What if they had a raffle...
- Thread starter asiasdad
- Start date
raffle ...
I don't think anyone has ripped anyone off ... And I think the success of the raffle depends on the cue ... A production cue is not going to do well in a raffle I put a nice Schon up... But heck I later found out that dealers get one heck of a discount on Schons ... I pulled it back and traded it ...
Now I put a Varney J/B and priced it at what I felt was fair price and it sold out in almost one days time ... I'm convinced I could of asked for more then the cue was worth and would of got it ... I'm also convinced it depends on the cue and who made it ... I have not seen a Sugar tree or a Southwest fail yet... The Gina cue was going to fill a 100 spots at a pretty steep price per ticket ... And was well on it's way to doing it ...
I think in order to have a successful raffle you need a nice Custom ... The nicer the custon the faster the raffle will sell out... I don't try to over charge I try to get what I feel is a fair price and will cover shipping and paypal .... I have dropped the price on one or two of my raffles but it was not because I felt the cue was priced to high ...But more because I felt that once everyone saw how well the raffles were doing 4 or 5 raffles at a time popped up and it was like all of a sudden we were in competition ... Just like Gas it is 4.00 a gallon now let someone drop it down to 3.75 a gallon down the street and see what happens ....
I don't think anyone has ripped anyone off ... And I think the success of the raffle depends on the cue ... A production cue is not going to do well in a raffle I put a nice Schon up... But heck I later found out that dealers get one heck of a discount on Schons ... I pulled it back and traded it ...
Now I put a Varney J/B and priced it at what I felt was fair price and it sold out in almost one days time ... I'm convinced I could of asked for more then the cue was worth and would of got it ... I'm also convinced it depends on the cue and who made it ... I have not seen a Sugar tree or a Southwest fail yet... The Gina cue was going to fill a 100 spots at a pretty steep price per ticket ... And was well on it's way to doing it ...
I think in order to have a successful raffle you need a nice Custom ... The nicer the custon the faster the raffle will sell out... I don't try to over charge I try to get what I feel is a fair price and will cover shipping and paypal .... I have dropped the price on one or two of my raffles but it was not because I felt the cue was priced to high ...But more because I felt that once everyone saw how well the raffles were doing 4 or 5 raffles at a time popped up and it was like all of a sudden we were in competition ... Just like Gas it is 4.00 a gallon now let someone drop it down to 3.75 a gallon down the street and see what happens ....
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I agree ...
The cue market is belly up and with the raffle idea dying now it is only a matter of time till someone comes along with another idea to move cues ... I thought about giving away a SUV free of charge with the next cue I sell... Wonder how what will go over ...
The cue market is belly up and with the raffle idea dying now it is only a matter of time till someone comes along with another idea to move cues ... I thought about giving away a SUV free of charge with the next cue I sell... Wonder how what will go over ...
GoTulane
Shizzle-rific
I see your point, to an extent. But my main belief is that this publicity on raffles - whether GOOD or BAD only helps the raffles. Reminds me of a cuemaker here on AZB that no matter what publicity he gets, it helps him sell more cues - in your face marketing. No publicity is BAD publicity. My wife always says I am a Devil's Advocate, and truly my opinion on raffles is they should die out pretty soon, but let them on their own accord. The more press they get is not pressuring people to stop, just adding fuel to the cause.JCIN said:
BTW- I used the CAPS on ANTI-RAFFLERS to show the catch 22 in the situation, based on my opinion - People who complain about raffles seem to help them continue with the press. So are the ANTI-RAFFLERS actually against raffles?
Because it seems to help them continue. And I will not go Politically correct on my term
I am glad you find it cute Everybody has their feelings and opinions, and they are just that, and having the ability and right to express them is what makes this country great. But if you really want them to go, let's see some good cues selling on AZB for fair prices, and less commotion around the RAFFLES.
I believed the raffles would be dead by now too, but every time I turn around there is a pro/con raffle thread.
BTW- I tried a raffle and it didn't do SQUAT!!! I did not believe I was too high priced, but I guess the AZB members did? So I should totally be against them, because I made a better trade. Ebb and flow of sales and selling techniques - we just have to survive the crest of raffles.
Last question - What is your definition of success, since you haven't seen any successful raffles? What makes a good cue sale/trade/purchase in your opinion?
I do not think you are a bad guy, and my comments in the earlier thread were not just directed at you - there have been many ANTI-RAFFLERS who have made some interesting claims that still have not been backed up. - You are not the first, and probably not the last.
You have your right to your opinion, as do I , and everybody on AZB.
In the end, let's just do our best to buy, sell, & trade cues on here - because isn't it the point of trying new cuemakers and dealing with others who share the same love of the game that makes this site worthwhile? That is what it is for me.
Michael
Forgive me for being so flip in my original reply. I get worked up and say some dumb things. I see your point of view and I agree. The whole end goal is for people to come together and buy,sell,trade safely and hopefully everyone goes away happy.GoTulane said:I see your point, to an extent. But my main belief is that this publicity on raffles - whether GOOD or BAD only helps the raffles. Reminds me of a cuemaker here on AZB that no matter what publicity he gets, it helps him sell more cues - in your face marketing. No publicity is BAD publicity. My wife always says I am a Devil's Advocate, and truly my opinion on raffles is they should die out pretty soon, but let them on their own accord. The more press they get is not pressuring people to stop, just adding fuel to the cause.
BTW- I used the CAPS on ANTI-RAFFLERS to show the catch 22 in the situation, based on my opinion - People who complain about raffles seem to help them continue with the press. So are the ANTI-RAFFLERS actually against raffles?
Everybody has their feelings and opinions, and they are just that, and having the ability and right to express them is what makes this country great. But if you really want them to go, let's see some good cues selling on AZB for fair prices, and less commotion around the RAFFLES.
I believed the raffles would be dead by now too, but every time I turn around there is a pro/con raffle thread.
BTW- I tried a raffle and it didn't do SQUAT!!! I did not believe I was too high priced, but I guess the AZB members did? So I should totally be against them, because I made a better trade. Ebb and flow of sales and selling techniques - we just have to survive the crest of raffles.
Last question - What is your definition of success, since you haven't seen any successful raffles? What makes a good cue sale/trade/purchase in your opinion?
I do not think you are a bad guy, and my comments in the earlier thread were not just directed at you - there have been many ANTI-RAFFLERS who have made some interesting claims that still have not been backed up. - You are not the first, and probably not the last.
You have your right to your opinion, as do I , and everybody on AZB.
In the end, let's just do our best to buy, sell, & trade cues on here - because isn't it the point of trying new cuemakers and dealing with others who share the same love of the game that makes this site worthwhile? That is what it is for me.
Michael
I fully understand people are going to do whatever they like as long as they are allowed to. I wouldn't want it any other way. I just wish some would look a little farther ahead. No hard feelings. I apologize if I was out line my response to you earlier.
GoTulane
Shizzle-rific
I know
So I see your point, but it is the gamble that some are willing to take, and that is their right, and nobody is going to stop them by talking to them and telling them it is wrong. Only too high a price on a raffle, with an even smaller chance of winning, or a cue that isn't truly wanted by many - That's what will kill a raffle - I could show you many examples, including my own.
So I say, let's just sell some cues!!!
Michael
I believed I knew what you meant, but it was how it was said/written. A lot of ideas in just one sentence that could pertain to a bunch of different things in your statement. Wasn't qualified well enough. But in the end, Raffles only work well for the seller and the winner - everybody else is a loser - sorry guys, but it is the truth, and I can't word it any other way - no pc here.JCIN said:
So I see your point, but it is the gamble that some are willing to take, and that is their right, and nobody is going to stop them by talking to them and telling them it is wrong. Only too high a price on a raffle, with an even smaller chance of winning, or a cue that isn't truly wanted by many - That's what will kill a raffle - I could show you many examples, including my own.
So I say, let's just sell some cues!!!
Michael
GoTulane
Shizzle-rific
No offense taken
So who are the true winners in the raffle?
Well, if the cue raffled is a keeper, and the winner is not a flipper - then you will never see it sold again, and the RAFFLER made their money. It is the raffles on cues that you know will just be flipped again that causes concern - due to the winner's rep or the cue itself.
In the end, these raffles are going on, and people are trying to buy/sell/trade cues - AND THE ECONOMY STINKS!!!
I wish I could buy/sell/trade more cues, but cash flow is slow for cues with gas prices going up up up up ........
Trading seems to be the way to get a nice cue for a nice cue, and that is what I have been doing.
Sellers - lower your prices on some nice cues, and the raffles will die - because a bird in the hand is worth more than a $50 ticket to loserville!
Michael
Yes, in the long run, this has some major consequences that many are not seeing, or feel will not truly be a concern. I understand that point. I think the winners selling the cues they won in a raffle might be feeling that. Not selling at their asking price, because others know what they "paid" for it. And raffled cues might have to continue to be raffled, or sold at a much lower cost, especially on AZB, because of this. Will this cause the secondary market of a specific cuemaker to go south, if they have beeen raffled? That is the questions we need to ask.JCIN said:
So who are the true winners in the raffle?
Well, if the cue raffled is a keeper, and the winner is not a flipper - then you will never see it sold again, and the RAFFLER made their money. It is the raffles on cues that you know will just be flipped again that causes concern - due to the winner's rep or the cue itself.
In the end, these raffles are going on, and people are trying to buy/sell/trade cues - AND THE ECONOMY STINKS!!!
I wish I could buy/sell/trade more cues, but cash flow is slow for cues with gas prices going up up up up ........
Trading seems to be the way to get a nice cue for a nice cue, and that is what I have been doing.
Sellers - lower your prices on some nice cues, and the raffles will die - because a bird in the hand is worth more than a $50 ticket to loserville!
Michael
Criminality is not one that God gives and....
And just for clarification.... your post to another to illegally conceal the fact and ship an ivory laden cue to Singapore full well knowing it is against both U.S. and Singaporean laws will never leave my memory. You sir have criminal intent and are driven by nothing short of $$$$. I can probably get a "USED" Richard Harris cocobolo from a dealer for less than your raffle will net. You are raffling a "USED" cue if not mistaken. OR how about the NEW plain jane bacote one that just sold on ebay for less than $1200.00. Simply larcenous. RAFFLE ON BRO!
http://cgi.ebay.com/NEW-RICHARD-HAR...ryZ21568QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
you have it!Monto P2 said:
And just for clarification.... your post to another to illegally conceal the fact and ship an ivory laden cue to Singapore full well knowing it is against both U.S. and Singaporean laws will never leave my memory. You sir have criminal intent and are driven by nothing short of $$$$. I can probably get a "USED" Richard Harris cocobolo from a dealer for less than your raffle will net. You are raffling a "USED" cue if not mistaken. OR how about the NEW plain jane bacote one that just sold on ebay for less than $1200.00. Simply larcenous. RAFFLE ON BRO!
http://cgi.ebay.com/NEW-RICHARD-HAR...ryZ21568QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
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Imho
i wonder if these guys get upset at the girls that sell raffle tickets at the tournaments for the vendors. they walk around with a huge roll of tickets and sell them at $10 a pop out at the riviera for the bca and vnea tournaments. are they standing at the booth screaming about the tickets to retail ratio?? is that bringing down the value of the cues being sold to the other vendors?? i don't think so. i respect the opinoins of the posters on this thread but i am finding it hard to see why alot seem to be so anti raffle. i played montos last raffle for the southwest cue. he was attacked repeatedly about the amount he would take in from the raffle because some posters/mbers felt the amount taken in far exceeded the value of the cue. i asked indyQ to send me a price list for the southwests he had in stock. they range from low to mid 3000. that was right in line with what he was taking in for total tickets and you can see on his site how many southwests he sells per year. i think there is room for raffles on here and i hope they continue. just MO
i wonder if these guys get upset at the girls that sell raffle tickets at the tournaments for the vendors. they walk around with a huge roll of tickets and sell them at $10 a pop out at the riviera for the bca and vnea tournaments. are they standing at the booth screaming about the tickets to retail ratio?? is that bringing down the value of the cues being sold to the other vendors?? i don't think so. i respect the opinoins of the posters on this thread but i am finding it hard to see why alot seem to be so anti raffle. i played montos last raffle for the southwest cue. he was attacked repeatedly about the amount he would take in from the raffle because some posters/mbers felt the amount taken in far exceeded the value of the cue. i asked indyQ to send me a price list for the southwests he had in stock. they range from low to mid 3000. that was right in line with what he was taking in for total tickets and you can see on his site how many southwests he sells per year. i think there is room for raffles on here and i hope they continue. just MO
Opinion
Sir you have the right to think what u want to think.I have been more than fair in my dealings for whatever period i have been here.anyone who has dealt with me will vouch for my transactions.I never try to cheat anyone.I say what i do and i do what i say.
I dont have any hard feelings for you for the way you think about me.
I am fair in all my transactions and always wil be
our_auctionguy said:
Sir you have the right to think what u want to think.I have been more than fair in my dealings for whatever period i have been here.anyone who has dealt with me will vouch for my transactions.I never try to cheat anyone.I say what i do and i do what i say.
I dont have any hard feelings for you for the way you think about me.
I am fair in all my transactions and always wil be
GoTulane said:
I dunno 'bout that. The highest price raffle I've seen so far was the Ginacue at $77.50 (I believe) a pop, with 100 spots. That's about the highest "ticket" price there's been, at the longest odds there's been. Get the right cue and enough traction...and it'll fill up. Listen...damn near everyone in the billiards world has gamble in 'em. Even if they're not the best person in the world at actually playing the game...the gambling aspect is a big lure...and most everyone's going to pick and chose their spots to let loose a bet. I think the raffles are fantastic. I wish they had their own section, however. I just think they kinda get in the way of the stuff that's legitimately up for sale. Just my 2 cents.
There IS one more thing I want to touch base upon. You cannot over inflate the price of a cue, in a raffle. For instance. The cue in my avatar. It's a curly pink ivory/rosewood 8-point Sugartree. Nice cue. I think I could probably do the typical Powerball raffle, and get 60-70 people to put up $40-$50 a pop. That's anywhere from $2400-$3500. Now...does that mean that the cue is worth $3500? Regardless of the total proceeds derived from a raffle, everyone knows what the cue's worth in a straight up sale, and going forward, any subsequent sale of that cue will revolve around that perceived worth...not the sum total of the raffle. Here's the point of all of this... When participating in a raffle...a participant (in my opinion) shouldn't be concerned with the sum total of money the raffler stands to make on the cue by conducting a raffle. What do they care, really? They're not paying the face value. All that should matter is this: Is it worth the asking price, given the stated odds, to take a shot at that cue? If it is...then play.
If it's not...well...then don't. 
Either way...raffle threads and sales threads a like...I wish there was a rule here that if you are not a party of interest regarding any item made available on this forum...then your opinion should be kept to yourself unless you're there to say "Nice cue" or "Good luck with your sale!". I've been guilty of not following this myself...and I apologize. No matter what you're dealing in...the market will always dictate what something's worth. Supply and demand is a proven concept. I say let people do as they may. Look around you...relative to the rest of what is a sales driven world...the pool cue market has very few "gimmicks". It could be a lot worse.
GoTulane
Shizzle-rific
I understand?
All I was saying is that if the price is too high in ticket cost versus value of the cue, considering the odds, then it more than likely will not fill - maybe not enough people with "gamble" in them. OR, if the cue is not spectacular or wanted by many, then it won't fill either - unless the ticket price is sooooo low that it is just worth a gamble. JMHO
Of course - "get the right cue, with the right price, and the right amount of people, and it will fill." That was kind of John Maddenesque.
And the anti-raffle threads are just giving the publicity to these raffles that they need.
I am not a ANTI- RAFFLER, or a PRO-RAFFLER, I am just a person who likes to buy/sell/trade cues to try out different makers. I have entered a few raffles, and I was a loser every time, like the majority of us.
I just think we should focus on buying/selling/trading cues - everybody LOWER YOUR PRICES!!
To raffle or not to raffle, that is the question! And I really do not care what the answer is. It is just entertaining during a dead economy.
Michael
Did the Gina raffle happen? Did it fill up?Retail1LO said:
All I was saying is that if the price is too high in ticket cost versus value of the cue, considering the odds, then it more than likely will not fill - maybe not enough people with "gamble" in them. OR, if the cue is not spectacular or wanted by many, then it won't fill either - unless the ticket price is sooooo low that it is just worth a gamble. JMHO
Of course - "get the right cue, with the right price, and the right amount of people, and it will fill." That was kind of John Maddenesque.
And the anti-raffle threads are just giving the publicity to these raffles that they need.
I am not a ANTI- RAFFLER, or a PRO-RAFFLER, I am just a person who likes to buy/sell/trade cues to try out different makers. I have entered a few raffles, and I was a loser every time, like the majority of us.
I just think we should focus on buying/selling/trading cues - everybody LOWER YOUR PRICES!!
To raffle or not to raffle, that is the question! And I really do not care what the answer is. It is just entertaining during a dead economy.
Michael
GoTulane said:
The raffle did indeed fill...but the raffler pulled the plug on it before he collected all the funds. So....it would have gone. I think you'll find these raffles aren't going to leave anytime soon. Even if/when the economy starts to recover...there's always going to be people willing to take a stab at a nice cue for a fraction of the cost. There aren't too many cues I've seen that haven't sold out. Some have taken longer than others but...they've all moved sooner or later.
GoTulane
Shizzle-rific
Actually... I had a fart.
And we will all have to live with them, and with their effects on the cue market as a whole.
Michael
You might want to get your facts straight - it did not fill, but had 33 spots left when it was pulled. It might have filled up, but who knows, I am not psychic. So it is everybody's own opinion if the raffles are here to stay, or a passing fancy. Nobody knows for sure, but while they are here, they are here, and everybody will have an opinion. Of course opinions are like a$$holes, everyones got one, but they all stink.Retail1LO said:
And we will all have to live with them, and with their effects on the cue market as a whole.
Michael