What is a Hi end cue

scsuxci said:
Anything thats ''Predator" is high end if were talking playability.
Anything else is the materials being used like ivory,fancy leathers
for wraps and exotic woods that can be pricey.Most great cuemakers
I would guess build there butts as far as stability very similar.I
think alot has to do tapers,balance points,natural weight, shaft
wood and finishes.
The problem is almost all cues on AZ are bought on looks and the rep
of the cuemaker.If the buyer could hit some balls before the purchase,
there wouldn't be nowhere near the amount of cues up for sale.
I know in most descriptions of a cue,people say ''the cue hits great''
which is common sense to me,cause if you said''the cue hits like shit"
I really doubt you'll have many people breaking your door down to
buy it.
At the end of the day,its a gamble whether you'll like the cue or not
which makes it fun for the guys who like trying out different cues but
a pain in ass for the guys searching for 1 cue and 1 cue only.:smile:
Click to expand...

Sorry sir, but I don't agree with most of what you said.

Predators are good for some people, especially your lower level player. I think they help make those players a little bit better but it's like putting lipstick on a pig....it's still a pig. Now they can make that long straight shot and they can draw a little bit. But, they don't know the game at all so if you get into a battle with them, you will crush them. They have 1 speed. So, I won't call your average predator high end.

And as far as building a cue.... it's like skinning a cat, there's 9 ways to do it. If they all did it the same, then they would all feel the same and they don't at all. If it was that easy, everyone would be doing it and people like Stroud, BB, Searing, Showman, Franklin, Szam, Ernie, Vollmer, etc... wouldn't be charging thousands. Everyone would just buy a Predator or Lucasi and that would be it.

The reason you see most pros that use those "production" cues is because they are sponsored by those companies and let's face it, being sponsored is the only way it's possible to make it as a pro... at least successfully make it. You don't win enough to do so otherwise.

One of the biggest chalanges to "new" cuemakers is getting the word out to people ready to buy cues that their cues play well. Especially getting the word out that they play as well as the makers above. It's hard to overcome peoples notions that their cues plays better than anything else out there. You'd have a hard time convincing me that anything plays better than my Scruggs' or Black Boars.

Just my opinion, don't take it as criticism.

R,

Greg
 
Antfarm said:
Sorry sir, but I don't agree with most of what you said.

Predators are good for some people, especially your lower level player. I think they help make those players a little bit better but it's like putting lipstick on a pig....it's still a pig. Now they can make that long straight shot and they can draw a little bit. But, they don't know the game at all so if you get into a battle with them, you will crush them. They have 1 speed. So, I won't call your average predator high end.

And as far as building a cue.... it's like skinning a cat, there's 9 ways to do it. If they all did it the same, then they would all feel the same and they don't at all. If it was that easy, everyone would be doing it and people like Stroud, BB, Searing, Showman, Franklin, Szam, Ernie, Vollmer, etc... wouldn't be charging thousands. Everyone would just buy a Predator or Lucasi and that would be it.

The reason you see most pros that use those "production" cues is because they are sponsored by those companies and let's face it, being sponsored is the only way it's possible to make it as a pro... at least successfully make it. You don't win enough to do so otherwise.

One of the biggest chalanges to "new" cuemakers is getting the word out to people ready to buy cues that their cues play well. Especially getting the word out that they play as well as the makers above. It's hard to overcome peoples notions that their cues plays better than anything else out there. You'd have a hard time convincing me that anything plays better than my Scruggs' or Black Boars.

Just my opinion, don't take it as criticism.

R,

Greg
Click to expand...
When I mentioned Predator it was about Playability
thats all.I strongly believe that most buy on the looks and rep of
the cuemaker,especially if there buying a cue without hitting
with it first.On this site I would think there's just as many people
unhappy with there purchases to people that are happy.A highend cue
to me is a cue that I feel brings out my best game on a consistent
basis.
 
my question i guess was not well thought out

I have always wanted to try out different cues.
and i havent ever really had the chance.
the one meduim to hi end cue that i own makes me nevous to play with i am affraid of putting a nick or dent in.
and i didnt want to say hi end when it wasnt.

MMike
 
I ordered a new cue from a well known cuemaker that has made some very expensive cues in his career. He told me he had only made 5 or 6 cues like this one and asked me if it was an investment cue or a cue I planned on playing with. Maybe that makes it high end, for me it's the limit of what I would pay for a playing cue...
 
Hi end???

As I read this I had a couple of thoughts...

I do believe 'Hi End' is a personal descriptor... What is 'Hi End' to one, certainly isn't to another... Having said that, a few comments of what I think is 'Hi End'.

1. Price - If a cue is of enough value that I don't want to leave it out (with my friends) when I head to the men's room/bar/etc... then it's Hi End to me.

2. Quality - Is the workmanship on the cue stellar. Is everything perfect, the finish first rate and cause people (could be others but most especially you) to stop and take a second or third look... comment on the cue, then it' 'Hi End' and desireable :D

3. Uniqueness - Is it rare... do you see one every day of the week, or you've never seen another. My Dieckman certainly fits this category... Can you replace it? Does it have technology you haven't seen before, is it an R & D cue for a custom maker (My Starkey that I just purchased may fit here)

4. The hit... I've played with production cues most of my life, but sometimes you play a cue, and for you... it's an extension of your mind... What causes it to do that?? It might be what its made of , joint type/material, ferrule material, tip, balance point, taper... etc... I don't think this category makes "Hi End" by itself, but if the maker gets a reputation for a particular hit, and everyone acknowledges its desirability, price will tend to rise as well.

5. Does it have a combination of the above factors that moves it from nice to valuable? AND moves your perception of the cue and whether you'll not leave it out of your sight...

Again, at the end of the day, it is a very personal evaluation... By itself, the descriptor may be so generic as to be unhelpful, but with other adjectives, it probably can be used as a reasonable additional descriptor.
 
CMD, my opinion is not bullshit - it is without doubt or question absolutely correct. :grin:

A high quality basic 4 point cue can be made by any number of great builders for $500. I've been told by one of the greats that anything beyond that does NOT make for a better playing cue. Was he wrong?

I did not suggest that I considered $500 to be any sort of hi-end cutoff point. But I'll stand by may statement that anything spent over $500 will not guaranty you a better playing cue, only a fancier one (sometimes).

Pricing not adjusted for recent inflation. Tax and shipping not included. :grin:
 
Underclocked said:
CMD, my opinion is not bullshit - it is without doubt or question absolutely correct. :grin:

A high quality basic 4 point cue can be made by any number of great builders for $500. I've been told by one of the greats that anything beyond that does NOT make for a better playing cue. Was he wrong?
Click to expand...

Yes, he was wrong. Who builds a basic 4 point cue for $500? I would love to see the names on that list.

I once paid $600 for one of the first of a cuemakers cues. Needless it was less than stellar AND it was a plain jane.


Underclocked said:
I did not suggest that I considered $500 to be any sort of hi-end cutoff point. But I'll stand by may statement that anything spent over $500 will not guaranty you a better playing cue, only a fancier one (sometimes).

Pricing not adjusted for recent inflation. Tax and shipping not included. :grin:
Click to expand...

I know most of this post was tongue-in-cheek but was this $500 cue the only cue you have ever owned? My guess is no. How many "magical" cuemakers must one go through to find "the" cue? Of course any one can spend $100 on any old P.O.S. cue, but is it any good? I would say you are right if quality and how it fits the owners style of play do not count. The cue I am playing with now is a Murray Tucker conversion cue from a Schmelke blank. It is the best playing I have ever owned and it was $650 with two shafts. Not far off, but I have spend tons of money to get to this cue.

How many cues have you bought in your life? I would venture to guess that number is more than one. How much was the second cue? And maybe the one after that? Do you see my point? We may not agree, but do you at least see my point?

I've done my share of buying and selling of cues on this forum. You may see a conversion for under $500 but not much more. In my opinion, if you up that number to $750 you will be spot on.


Good thread...
 
Antfarm said:
Predators are good for some people, especially your lower level player. I think they help make those players a little bit better but it's like putting lipstick on a pig....it's still a pig. Now they can make that long straight shot and they can draw a little bit. But, they don't know the game at all so if you get into a battle with them, you will crush them. They have 1 speed. So, I won't call your average predator high end.
Click to expand...

I've never heard of any requirement to owning a Predator cue that stated you have to be a "lowever level player" who can only make "long straight shots" but "don't know the game". Predators play quite fine, plenty of fine players own them and play with them.

Just like any other cue, Predators are subject to player preferences... And no cue is immune from player preferences, it doesn't matter who made it. Different strokes for different folks.
 
Imo, it's a term that refers to a cue that's a significant cut above the average or mid-range representation of a particular cuemaker's work. It's not necessarily related to a specific dollar figure, maker, etc.

(i.e. a Titlist Balabushka with no inlays may be a high end collectible, but it's not necessarily a high end cue)

Just my interpretation....there are always others with somewhat subjective terms. :)

Sean
 
A high end cue will vary from one person to the other based on different criteria. After all, beauty is in the eye of the beholder. What you think is great, I may not like and vise versa.

A high end cue for me would be the one that makes my Ahole pucker up, while it is sucking wind at the same time due to the fact, as soon as I see the cue, I know there is no way I'm letting loose of that much cash for a piece of wood to poke at a ball on a table.
 
High end cues

THE so called higher end cues that cost an arm n a leg are usually labeled ALBATROSS (like a big bird) MEANS ITS PRETTY IN FLIGHT BUT HALF ASS TO PLAY WITH my idea of high end is the materials used in construction of he cue to the types of ferulle and tip for example if u use aaa sg maple with a per inch grain quality and add micarta n moori tips well ur gettn into some costs issues nd then the particular joint set up and is it w or with out joint protectors. everybody has their own opinion here its just i want to point out there is a reason that u dont see everyone playing with a 4ooo dollar cue is playability not cost again my idea of high end is all the whistles an bells w playability i hate it when u pick iup a 2o somethinoz cue loaded with inlays n ivory n u feel like its gonna fall apart whenj u play with. i don think it has much to do with art as much as it does cost of materials. hope we see a revolution in the market place this damn economy is killin us!
:thumbup:
 
The way it is, nowadays, a great playing cue with 4 points, veneers, linen wrap...you know, what would be considered old school, will probably run between $1k - $2K.

To me, high end is anything around $2500 and above. There was a day when $500 would get you there but that days long gone. You can still get a great player for that amount but there will be zero bells and whistles.
 
Goose1972 said:
I don't think jump cues count, those are actually used. High end cues are cues only to be looked at. Like fancy flower shaped soap mom had.
Click to expand...

What?!?! Call me crazy, but unless I'm playing in a dive bar, i'll play with my Hercek, WwwGilbert, or Mcworter cue. I didn't spend all that money just to stare at it.
 
mortuarymike-nv said:
The reason i asked this question is i didnt want to say hey i have a hi end cue that makes me too nevous to play with.

And have the next person say thats not a high end cue!
104.jpg
Click to expand...

You could say: "I love this cue" and let the others decide if they call it high end or what else.
 
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