What speed,,
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I think we are underestimating the top pros (SVB, Archer, Corey), and overestimating the amateurs.
Not the original question, but they could give an A player the 5 out and the breaks on a 9 footer, and I'd bet on them all day long. Bustamente gave a top open player in my area the 5 and breaks and beat him. I've heard of Santos giving all the top guys in NY (Hernandez) ridiculous weight and beating them.
On a 7 footer, I think a B will not win with the 7 and breaks. It would take an A player to win.
I actually think we as a community make the game all about the break, and figure if a player makes a ball on the break, he is going to win. If we had good statistics on this, and maybe we do somewhere, I hypothesize that it would be shown that LOTS of games are lost after the break on poor position control. A "B" player is going to mess up LOTS of position shots, even on a bar box.
The only statistic I remember hearing about the break is when Pat Flemming was doing the accu-stats (before videos), he actually discovered during PRO events the breaking player was more likely to lose the game they just broke rather than win it. Just food for thought on everyone putting all the emphasis on the break, and not the position play and other skill sets of the game.
Not the original question, but they could give an A player the 5 out and the breaks on a 9 footer, and I'd bet on them all day long. Bustamente gave a top open player in my area the 5 and breaks and beat him. I've heard of Santos giving all the top guys in NY (Hernandez) ridiculous weight and beating them.
On a 7 footer, I think a B will not win with the 7 and breaks. It would take an A player to win.
I actually think we as a community make the game all about the break, and figure if a player makes a ball on the break, he is going to win. If we had good statistics on this, and maybe we do somewhere, I hypothesize that it would be shown that LOTS of games are lost after the break on poor position control. A "B" player is going to mess up LOTS of position shots, even on a bar box.
The only statistic I remember hearing about the break is when Pat Flemming was doing the accu-stats (before videos), he actually discovered during PRO events the breaking player was more likely to lose the game they just broke rather than win it. Just food for thought on everyone putting all the emphasis on the break, and not the position play and other skill sets of the game.
The reason is that weight isn't much more than a confidence boost at that level...
The reason they can give ridiculous weight and still win is that weight at that level is more of a confidence boost than anything.
How many times is an A player or better going to get to the six, seven or eight and miss the last couple of balls? 1 in 5 maybe??? does that make much of a difference, no not really.
So that would be like getting two on the wire in a race to ten.... The A player doesn't have much of a chance getting two on the wire from a top pro in a race to ten. There isn't as much separating them as some would believe, but the consistency of the top pro will win out in the end especially endurance wise.
The A player may win one or two sets, but in the end, the top pro will win out unless the a player has a tremendous break and gets the breaks as well.
Jaden
The reason they can give ridiculous weight and still win is that weight at that level is more of a confidence boost than anything.
How many times is an A player or better going to get to the six, seven or eight and miss the last couple of balls? 1 in 5 maybe??? does that make much of a difference, no not really.
So that would be like getting two on the wire in a race to ten.... The A player doesn't have much of a chance getting two on the wire from a top pro in a race to ten. There isn't as much separating them as some would believe, but the consistency of the top pro will win out in the end especially endurance wise.
The A player may win one or two sets, but in the end, the top pro will win out unless the a player has a tremendous break and gets the breaks as well.
Jaden
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Why i posted this is i seen a unknown player that plays pretty tough some times plays a good pro with the 7 and break and drill the pro .The pro quite after 2 sets.Made me wonder was it because of the bar table or was
he just lucky or just how important the break is.Then i was wondering what
speed is the the unknown player.Pro only wins 4 out of 18 games....
he just lucky or just how important the break is.Then i was wondering what
speed is the the unknown player.Pro only wins 4 out of 18 games....
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i already responded to that
i think accu stats said that the breaker loses 60% of the time. i think i heard that once before
Bar box would be different, but I would like to think the person who makes a ball, and has control of the table would have the 60%. Also, breaks have become much more controlled, or manipulated, much more than days of old.
I agree Josh. That's a very old stat and doesn't apply to today. Johnnyt
I agree that's an old stat. But I think its applicable here because that stat came from the pro tour, with the best guys in the world. I know the break has matured quite a bit since the days of hit it as hard as you can and try to squat the rock.
The reason I think those stats are still valid on this topic is because we are talking about B players now. If a pro on the old stats was not a favorite to get out after the break (even an "old style" break), then I don't think a B player is a favorite to get out today even if he knows the break inside and out.
The reason I think those stats are still valid on this topic is because we are talking about B players now. If a pro on the old stats was not a favorite to get out after the break (even an "old style" break), then I don't think a B player is a favorite to get out today even if he knows the break inside and out.
hippiepool
Banned
I think the most I have ran is 3 ......and I will take that spot from most anyone .....
of course I've got more heart and gamble than money ............................:wink:
hippiepool
Banned
Excellent Idea Drew .......wish I had a pool table.....
I will play him or any of his peers a race to 21 like that for $500 in Vegas this year...
I am a completely rookie at a bar table, don't know how to play on it or why there is such a difference compared to a 9'.
Why is it harder to kick and get successful on a bar table?
You're right, a bar table is a different story. I don't know too many people who "try" to kick safe on a BB. The pro's I watch are kicking to pockets or two way shots and making a ton of them. There's really no such thing as a good safe on a BB.
In the end, it really comes down to your break. You'll have to be making balls and getting a shot at the 1 at least 50% of your breaks. If not, you can expect to lose that game against a top pro.
I haven't played on a valley barbox but once in the last ten years.
My bro was going to meet his wife to watch their league match and we hadn't played in a long time so we played some barbox nineball on a valley.
I BNR'd the first three racks, so we switched to altrnateing breaks and I think out of the ten or so games we played, we only actually played a game against each other once or twice.
I did play some barbox on diamonds up in Knoxville, Tennessee when I was there for some fun, and they were a little more respectable.
Jaden
My bro was going to meet his wife to watch their league match and we hadn't played in a long time so we played some barbox nineball on a valley.
I BNR'd the first three racks, so we switched to altrnateing breaks and I think out of the ten or so games we played, we only actually played a game against each other once or twice.
I did play some barbox on diamonds up in Knoxville, Tennessee when I was there for some fun, and they were a little more respectable.
Jaden