Why are phillipino's the best poolplayers in the world?

tommywhsl1 said:
In the 40's, 50's, 60's, 70's, thru the early 80's the best pool players in the world came from right here in the good old USA. What happened?

Theory (1st part)

In the time before 1940 and thru the early 80's (Buddy Hall) pool was not a sport of liesure to top players but a life. The routine was get up in the morning go to the pool hall hit balls (practice) until you were tired, take a break for a lunch, picture show, etc. and back to the pool hall for more practice or the days action. The next day start again by waking up heading to the pool hall to hit balls and so on and on. This happened 7 days a week 8 to 10 hours a day sometimes longer. Practice, practice, practice, gamble, practice, gamble, play on to scratch out a days/weeks/years money! Good guys, bad guys, crooks, cons they were all in the pool rooms looking for a score. Jay H. has many stories in his book, accounts of players and things he has seen! So he is one that can atest to the fact that if you want to be the best you must be more decated than the rest. That is why american pool players were the best during these years because they wanted it more, were willing to go past what was needed to get there. Proof is that during these years their wasn't just one player that could run 120, etc and out playing straight pool, but a hand full that all did on a regular basis. Today on personally don't know of more than one or two in the world that play at that speed. Of course this was before accustat and before nine ball was changed to the ball in hand rules the players had to be ball makers first and formost because there wasn't any ball in hand to bail you out from a bad spot, if you could make the shot and you knew your opponent could not you had the nutts and that was just the way it was!! The rule changes effected the game in a neg. way in my opinion by taking away the better pool players biggist adantage his ability to see and make shots.

Theory (2nd part)

Today american pool players face many things that keep them from performing as their mentors and heros did! Pool players are know to harness multipule bad habits to go with pool and thru the years they are easier and more abundunt than in the past. Examples, casino's, poker, slotmachines, bookmakers, drugs, golf, women, men, phones, and the list goes on!!! and a pool players priortiy's are screwed up 90 percent of the time. Not necessarily is it all their fault because of the inablity to make a money playing the game they look for other ways to score. The funny part is that pool players are under the mentality that they would rather play pool and make the easy money than get a job and make real money for working, what they don't know is the hustling pool is hard work much like playing poker but wihtout the possiblity of hitting a homerun for millions.
A top pool player today may stay in the pool room for hours on end for a period of time 1, 2, 3, 5, 7, maybe as long as 10 years, but that is tops and to beat the best you must be more didicated than your opponent and this will not get it done!!!

Theory (3rd part)

The opponent (phillippino's) start out with nothing and i mean nothing go to work in the pool hall as a kid sweeping up or some type of gofer work. At each oppertunity they pick up a stick and hit balls, they watch the best players in the world hit balls and stay in action daily, they see the time that it takes to be the best. They don't suffer the distractions of their counterparts in the USA. No money to play poker, golf, slotmachines, etc. they see only one way out and that is to beat the best and get a ticket to make it playing the only game they know POOL!!!!!!!!

Conclusion:

Phillippion's are the top of the game (THE BEST)


My theory in text,

Thanks, Tommy
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poverty is a great motivater!

most intelliegent/capable westerners look at efren and might appreciate his skill but who would want his life, i know my friends that played and myself wouldnt he doesnt make much money. and spends all day everyday in a smoke filled room not exactly livin it up is he.

poor countries have no oportunities for the majority they have nothing better to do than go to pool room and probably cant/dont want to do much else either. id play 10 hours a day if i could make 300k + year in year out like other sports/games do then retire and live my life but alot of smart people want the american dream now, people with nothing or not so bright dont thats the only reason poorer countries do well cause western countries cant be bothered as it dont pay well enough

so most westerners give the game what it deserves part time practise as the rewards are not there to give it more, stick millions in the game and garanteed western countries would probably dominate or at least be level again within 10 years
 
Interesting thoughts on the english snooker players and decline of the game. As a fan of all pool games this is another disappointment to the state of our game. The good news is that like Jay referenced in the Phillippines of the 90 million people 5 million will watch a top pool match. Thats a huge number much like we here in the US watch the playoffs in the NFL, etc. It would be great to see unedited complete matchs on tube but thats not happening so keep of the sumulicast threads on the the web guys and lets start politicing for more sponsors
 
jay helfert said:
They've already arrived; Appleton, Boyes, Peach, Hundal, Hill, etc.
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i agree jay that they have but there will be a lot more like them very soon changing from snooker to pool, with the state of the game and how only the top make any money.
Also hopefully pool becoming bigger and bigger with more sponsorship and bigger money tournaments, as for the norwegian i never meant it like the british have more this or that just there is thousands of top snooker players who may switch and play more pool, with more making it to the world stage.
 
Pool

Because the Filapinos have a higher level of competition at every stage of development of the sport.

Necessity is the Mother of Invention. (Ever heard that before). So it is with the Filapinos. Anyone that has ever been to the Philippines can tell you
how survival dependent they are on different things.

The government and the people support Pool over there in a big way, something the USA could stand to learn better.

It is sickening to watch some of these so called sports in the Olympics when Pool, one that demands excellence mentally, emotionally, and some physical requirements is not included, especially since all countries would be able to compete in an entirely fair way. Quite frankly, the major Pool organizations have failed in their attempts to get Billiards into the Olympics. Think of the changes for the sport if it was in the Olympics.
 
Richardson said:
I agree with this alot. I agree with some other things said in this thread also. Lets face it, American's for the most part are lazy people anymore who want something for nothing.

It would be nice if somehow there would be a nice sponsor for pool and make it worthwhile to play for a living.
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I beg to disagree, the American players can't depend much on pool to augment their income, they need other outlets to earn some extra coin. If pool offers the same amount of money that golf, tennis, basketball, football or NASCAR racing gets, I'm sure they'll stick to what they love and that is to play pool until the day they die...
 
chamillionare said:
poverty is a great motivater!

most intelliegent/capable westerners look at efren and might appreciate his skill but who would want his life, i know my friends that played and myself wouldnt he doesnt make much money. and spends all day everyday in a smoke filled room not exactly livin it up is he.

poor countries have no oportunities for the majority they have nothing better to do than go to pool room and probably cant/dont want to do much else either. id play 10 hours a day if i could make 300k + year in year out like other sports/games do then retire and live my life but alot of smart people want the american dream now, people with nothing or not so bright dont thats the only reason poorer countries do well cause western countries cant be bothered as it dont pay well enough

so most westerners give the game what it deserves part time practise as the rewards are not there to give it more, stick millions in the game and garanteed western countries would probably dominate or at least be level again within 10 years
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You are misinformed about Efren. The guy has money by any nation's standards. He hands all his winnings and endorsements to his wife. That is part of his wisdom. He also does not spend his nights in smoke-filled rooms. Once in a while, he still goes to sleazy joints if and when the money is right. But most of the time, he plays in first-class places. Many will give up anything to become what Efren has become.

But yes, perhaps there is truth in saying that wanting to get out of poverty is a motivator because all our pros - save for Manalo, Lining and Valle - come from very humble beginnings. But I think that it is coincidental. It just happens. Anywhere in the world, once you get hooked in the game and understand the perplexity of balls and banks and stroke, you're hooked for life. It's the gambling factor that gives them the first taste of money early in their addiction. Every successful shot gives them the sense of fulfillment... every game won gives them a sense of accomplishment... and every Peso won makes them more thirsty.

But then again, this cycle happens all over the world. Only very few of the pros, regardless of nationality, have college degrees. Many of them did not even finish high school. It is just more intense in the Philippines because there are pool joints in every corner of every town, plus the rotation factor that I had previously mentioned in this thread.

Isolating poverty does not make sense either. All countries have bad areas. Many got shocked when Katrina exposed a third world within the USA. So why do good players not mushroom from these bad areas where poverty is at its universal?

You have to come to the Philippines (like Jay) to see for yourself this phenomenon of mushrooming skilled players. Even unknown players give ranked foreign pros spots here.
 
jay helfert said:
Many good posts on this thread, but this one is particularly appropriate. This is a vastly overpopulated country (over 90 mil), with a huge unemployment rate (probably close to 25-30%). People work doing anything to make a few dollars a day. A good job pays 1$ an hour, and a worker in a typical fast food outlet or small store works a 10-11 hour shift six days a week. To get one of these jobs is highly competitive and you are easily replaced if you show up late for work ONCE!

To work in a bank or department store or other high level employ, you need a college degree. Then you could earn as much as $2 and hour for a ten hour shift. Every worker regardless of position is expected to be wearing a clean and neat uniform at all times. And you must remain focused on your job, which is taking care of customers. Always in a friendly and cordial manner I might add. I don't care what store or shop you enter, you will be greeted IMMEDIATELY by a smiling face or two or three, and asked "Can I help you sir?"

Contrast the above with being a professional pool player in the Philippines. Pool over here is definitely major league, with all tournaments reported alongside other major sports news in all the daily papers. The pool champions (like Efren and Alex and Ronnie) are national sports figures here, and everyone knows who they are, from the store clerks to the cab drivers. Remember the pay scale now, where the average annual wage may be $2,500-3,000 a year and an excellent job pays 5K a year. A pool player goes abroad and wins a major tournament and comes home with say $40,000. That's nearly two million pesos or 8-15 years the annual salary.

Who wouldn't want to be a pool player over here? To be a successful pool player is like a young kid becoming a successful pro golfer or tennis player in the USA. That's why there are literally tens of thousands of young kids in all the provinces practicing pool ALL day long! It's a way out of wrenching poverty. And one of the few avenues for an uneducated kid to make it big over here. Similar to what we see with all the kids in the black ghettos who practice basketball with the big dream of making it as a pro.

And like someone else said, if you have so many trying to excel and pushing each other, it is no wonder that a few great ones will emerge. Yes, there are many great players coming out of Taiwan. They are disciplined and hard working. But they will never match the hunger and fervor of the filipinos.
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I agree with you 100% Jay. Last September, when I was at One Side I spoke to a few top players there. In the beginning they have a strict regiment of practicing 70-80 racks EACH DAY! In order to become good you have to Train, Train, and TRAIN! As you said, the filipino's help each other and you can see that if you are there. They have the hunger to win money to make a good living so they can support themselves and their families. IMO, American players lack the discipline and desire compared to players overseas. Trust me...poverty in the United States is NOTHING compared to poverty in the Phillipines.
 
Born with a stick in our hands.....

Lol, on a serious note, filipinos are so good cuz thats all there ever is to do there to kick it and have fun. When I was down there thats all we did on the regular weekdays cuz none of the hot girls are out till the weekends at the clubs and on Sunday for church...lol and thats for real!
 
> I heard John Schmidt say something to the effect that the country is so much smaller there,that it's easier for them to run into each other,and thus,tough action is easy to find. Not so in America. That is a VERY intuitive statement. Who does John have to really bang heads with regularity here? He could drive all day and not find an even game,and giving up the nuts and trying to outrun it isn't the same as playing a guy that can beat you even if you play that speed. Imagine if you took the top 25 players here,and locked them up in the same place for a month or more at a time. That's what they have there.

How good would John or Shane or even a player like Jonathan Hennessee play if they had world-class players sitting in the box waiting to play every single day? Tommy D.
 
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