He spelled everything correctly because of spellcheck, there is no punctuation check.
Got Cheated In Olathe
- Thread starter 1 Lone Wolf
- Start date
He spelled everything correctly because of spellcheck, there is no punctuation check.
Jay, we all know you have all the experience to make such a call, but we don't need a 'Judge Judy' call like it seems was made here. She had two conflicting stories. She did not see the shot. Now just how does one make a just call under those circumstances? Some have said the 'tie' goes to the shooter. The only way she makes the call she did is if she just believed Joey and discounted what Gary said. It really seems some other solution should have been reached (maybe a replay).
The TD's ruling is after the fact and I was responding specifically to the details of what THIS thread is about.
In case it went over your head, the TD made a judgment call in FAVOR of the non-shooter w/o actually being there at the time of the disputed incident.
*Interesttingly enough, the operative words you used here are EXACTLY the reason for this thread.
Evelyn counld NOT discern what actually happened and yet the non-shooter was given the benefit of the doubt and rewarded with BIH?
Set aside your condescending attitude for a second and answer this...
You say "Evelyn was doing exactly what I would have done..."
Really!? Without seeing anything,you would give the non-shooter BIH? Well then this would be part of the *5%.
And to ask them to start the game over? What if they don't agree to?
Then what?
Answer: Then the ruling SHOULD/MUST go to the shooter.
simple.
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To be clear about my last post, DD, the bottom line IS the TD, not the
spectators.
But I feel the TD should use any resource available to help make their
decision.
In the snooker world, the refs are allowed to appeal to the audience
for any help.
It would be even important to use this resource when the TD didn't even
witness the shot in question.
http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=...fz52mtpxpFQ7CKLYQ&sig2=VdUTgZKDW1SNnik5K_h83g
I love all of the armchair QB rulings. The only experienced ref in the thread, (Jay Helfert), tried to explain the decision, but yet a lot of people choose to take one side of the story and make a decision. Joey doesn't post on AZ. And for a reason. When I asked him if I could post his side of the story, he said "let it go, its over".
Evelyn and Danny have excellent reputations and I will let that speak for itself. Gary has had a very good reputation until this weekend. I have, as many on here have, bet for and against Gary over the years. His actions over the course of this weekend were uncharacteristic. He went overboard about a questionable call, he became out of control after drinking too much, he quit winner after one set on another player, all of which is entirely out of character for Gary.
Clearly something is going on with Gary that is out of the norm. Instead of throwing rocks at Gary or Evelyn, maybe we should keep Gary in our thoughts and prayers and hope that whatever is making him not himself, ends quickly.
The Gary I've heard about this weekend from a lot of people I trust is not the Gary I know. I hope he works out whatever problems he has going on.
Sent from my BlackBerry 9650 using Tapatalk
Evelyn and Danny have excellent reputations and I will let that speak for itself. Gary has had a very good reputation until this weekend. I have, as many on here have, bet for and against Gary over the years. His actions over the course of this weekend were uncharacteristic. He went overboard about a questionable call, he became out of control after drinking too much, he quit winner after one set on another player, all of which is entirely out of character for Gary.
Clearly something is going on with Gary that is out of the norm. Instead of throwing rocks at Gary or Evelyn, maybe we should keep Gary in our thoughts and prayers and hope that whatever is making him not himself, ends quickly.
The Gary I've heard about this weekend from a lot of people I trust is not the Gary I know. I hope he works out whatever problems he has going on.
Sent from my BlackBerry 9650 using Tapatalk
Pangit
Banned
It brings back memories of the 2007 WPC in Manila. I think that was the year? Daryl Peach vs Bustamante. Michaela Tabb and crew reviewed the video and got the call right...the skinny blond ref "knew" it was a bad hit.. much to the dismay of the partisan Pinoy Crowd. DP had to be escorted out of the building for his own protection. At least that's been the local word on the street for the past nearly half dozen years.Everything is not Mango's and Cream in the PI.
The TD's ruling is after the fact and I was responding specifically to the details of what THIS thread is about.
In case it went over your head, the TD made a judgment call in FAVOR of the non-shooter w/o actually being there at the time of the disputed incident.
*Interesttingly enough, the operative words you used here are EXACTLY the reason for this thread.
Evelyn counld NOT discern what actually happened and yet the non-shooter was given the benefit of the doubt and rewarded with BIH?
Set aside your condescending attitude for a second and answer this...
You say "Evelyn was doing exactly what I would have done..."
Really!? Without seeing anything,you would give the non-shooter BIH? Well then this would be part of the *5%.
And to ask them to start the game over? What if they don't agree to?
Then what?
Answer: Then the ruling SHOULD/MUST go to the shooter.
simple.
You just don't get it and that's okay. There is a process a good TD goes through in a situation like that and I expect that is exactly what Evelyn did. We are not getting the entire story here but some of you want to jump to conclusions and castigate a very good tournament director. Sounds to me like she was the one acting professionally in this particular situation. If you don't read it that way, good for you.
Yes, a TD should evaluate the situation before making any call at all.
In this case it sounds like the Gary and Joey did not agree on the path the balls took.
So if Gary is saying the balls didnt even get close, and Joey is saying they did..
Doesn't it go to the shooter??? And if you dont ask any of the spectators and you didn't watch the shot yourself, HOW do you call it a bad hit?
IF the shooters agree on how the balls rolled is one thing. Then you can use your rulebook, but otherwise a close call ALWAYS GOES TO THE SHOOTER
I just would like to know, what would have made this shot go to the shooter?
Sounds like Gary was in a lose lose if Jay or Evalyn was coming to the table.
P.S. I could almost imagine Jay (i dont know him) saying something like, "you can't beat me i was playing pool while you were in diapers" just because you been calling bad hits your whole life doesn't make you a better shot caller :grin:
All i am saying is Jay you also weren't there.. If we called the shot from the forum board, SINCE it was a close call.. we must give it to the shooter
In this case it sounds like the Gary and Joey did not agree on the path the balls took.
So if Gary is saying the balls didnt even get close, and Joey is saying they did..
Doesn't it go to the shooter??? And if you dont ask any of the spectators and you didn't watch the shot yourself, HOW do you call it a bad hit?
IF the shooters agree on how the balls rolled is one thing. Then you can use your rulebook, but otherwise a close call ALWAYS GOES TO THE SHOOTER
I just would like to know, what would have made this shot go to the shooter?
Sounds like Gary was in a lose lose if Jay or Evalyn was coming to the table.
P.S. I could almost imagine Jay (i dont know him) saying something like, "you can't beat me i was playing pool while you were in diapers" just because you been calling bad hits your whole life doesn't make you a better shot caller :grin:
All i am saying is Jay you also weren't there.. If we called the shot from the forum board, SINCE it was a close call.. we must give it to the shooter
Whoever you are.....
I think I could stand drinking a little Tequila with a guy like you.
I think I could stand drinking a little Tequila with a guy like you.
JoeyA - hijeep is Whitey Walker. Says so under his username.
Okay - continue on.
I still don't know who Whitey Walker is...... carry on....
Then you must not know Joe Wolford either?
W.W is a Room owner or was, player, gambler, nice guy, likes the Mississippi river.
Cops get trained in how to diffuse situations because they often respond to disputes, some are better at it than others. It seems to me referees and tournament directors are sort of in the same situation.
I don't know Gary although I've met him when I lived in St Louis and familiar with who he is. I don't think he would have raised this much of a stink unless he got a bad call. Having said that, 99.999% of the time it is better to accept it and move on.
When life gives you lemons, make lemonade.
I don't know Gary although I've met him when I lived in St Louis and familiar with who he is. I don't think he would have raised this much of a stink unless he got a bad call. Having said that, 99.999% of the time it is better to accept it and move on.
When life gives you lemons, make lemonade.
I think she would assume the player's recollection is skewed due to the fact that he is under the stress of playing a tournament and distracted by the act of shooting a shot at the time the incident occurred. She would also assume the sitting player's recollection is skewed due to his poor vantage point of the incident. So she would take these two possibly skewed versions of the same incident and apply them to the current lay of the balls. Then she would decide whether there is reasonable evidence to support either version. If there is then it is an easy call. If not then she would/should side with the shooter.
This woman has been running tournaments longer than some of ya'll have been alive. I cannot believe that someone with that kind of SUCCESSFUL experience would be biased by friendships. However, it is entirely possible she made a mistake. People do that sometimes.
I once knew a Wolford guy who passed through New Orleans many years ago, not sure if it was Joe or not. As I recall, the guy liked to bet the ponies and was a VERY good player.
Whitey seems like the kind of fair-minded guy I could get along with.
Gary and Joey call me to the table. Gary is shooting, I asked what happened, he said I moved the 5 ball when I shot. I said, okay where was the 5 sitting, he points to an area on the table, I look at Joey and ask if that is close, he says yes. BOTH PLAYERS AGREE, that is where the 5 ball was sitting. I asked Gary what happened, he explained the shot and YES the cue ball could have come in contact with the 5 ball. That is a foul.
Gary then starts to argue and says ask the crowd, why would I ask the crowd when both players are at the table and have already agreed that is where the ball sitting. Gary continues to argue saying it might have been in another area, after he was the one that showed me where it was in the first place. I told him he needed to calm down and continue the match.
Approximately 2 hours later and after a couple of trips to the bracket board complaining to me how he was cheated and complaining to anyone in the building about this decision, I took Gary outside, away from everyone (I did not want to embarass him or put him on TV). I told him I had heard all I wanted to hear about this, he needed to calm down and just play the game. He could not let it go, I then placed him on warning.
Approximately 10 hours later and several trips to the bar, Gary is playing his match on the elimination side. He stops when he up 7-0. He starts toward the bracket board, stops about 20 feet from me (still in the playing area) and starts yelling and screaming obsenities at me. I told him to settle down and finish his match. He would not stop. He left me no option I had to forfeit him out of the tournament.
Gary continued on, it took 45 minutes to get him out of the playing area, disrupting the tournament.
Gary not only disrespected himself, he showed disrespect to a roomowner that has added $5000 to this tournament, the other players in the tournament and the spectators.
Drunk or sober, this is totally unacceptable behavior.
Evelyn Dysart
Gary then starts to argue and says ask the crowd, why would I ask the crowd when both players are at the table and have already agreed that is where the ball sitting. Gary continues to argue saying it might have been in another area, after he was the one that showed me where it was in the first place. I told him he needed to calm down and continue the match.
Approximately 2 hours later and after a couple of trips to the bracket board complaining to me how he was cheated and complaining to anyone in the building about this decision, I took Gary outside, away from everyone (I did not want to embarass him or put him on TV). I told him I had heard all I wanted to hear about this, he needed to calm down and just play the game. He could not let it go, I then placed him on warning.
Approximately 10 hours later and several trips to the bar, Gary is playing his match on the elimination side. He stops when he up 7-0. He starts toward the bracket board, stops about 20 feet from me (still in the playing area) and starts yelling and screaming obsenities at me. I told him to settle down and finish his match. He would not stop. He left me no option I had to forfeit him out of the tournament.
Gary continued on, it took 45 minutes to get him out of the playing area, disrupting the tournament.
Gary not only disrespected himself, he showed disrespect to a roomowner that has added $5000 to this tournament, the other players in the tournament and the spectators.
Drunk or sober, this is totally unacceptable behavior.
Evelyn Dysart
Does this really surprise anyone? I saw him in Des Moines playing once...good player...bad/loud drunk.
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Oh wow! Aside from the part that He wasn't drunk it looks like I NAILED this one!!!