A Huge Thank You from CueSports International (CSI)!

So I took a look at our new friends post history:

2012 he posts a Lambros for sale. First appearance on AZ. Only other post that year is to bump a thread about the action pool tour (Started by username manfromoz. Thats Ozzy before CSI-Ozzy was around): "Bump for a fantastic tour!"

Whats really interesting is the cue that Shoreboy is selling:

View attachment 393273

Looks a lot like the one manfromoz tried to sell four months earlier. One of the pictures is actually the same:

View attachment 393274

2014 he jumps in a thread about CSI challenge match Ko vs SVB (Started by username CSI-Ozzy) where he dropped this gem:

View attachment 393275

Only other posts that year are to start a thread about why a New York 10 ball event only got 17 players. Does not post again for one year almost exactly.

2015 he jumps in the CSI thread announcing the US Open 8 ball and 10 Ball (Started by username CSI-Ozzy). When someone says these events should just be called the USBTC II because they are the same events our friend Shoreboy shows up to prove them wrong. Even goes to the trouble to create this visual aid:

attachment.php


Only other thread our hero has posted in is this one. (Started by username CSI-Ozzy)

So by my rough count our new friend posts in six threads: Four of those started by Ozzy under either his CSI or APT accounts and two threads Shoreboy started. One of those to sell a cue that belonged to manfromoz (Ozzy) and one to ask about an east coast tournament.

This leads me to believe I was called disgruntled by the third string account of a guy who is nowhere near as smart as he thinks he is.

f5657ea6e8a5225a9c0c692817d5bf5c-micdrop07.gif

Very impressive sleuthing
You are the real CSI (as in the TV series )
A smoking gun could be to get one of those IP tools that can identify IP. Pretty sure some of these usernames have same / similar IP:grin-square:
 
"A Huge Thank You from CueSports International (CSI)!"

Shitstorm just morphed into a steaming pile of black comedy.

By the way, You're Welcome, compliments of AZ Billiards!
 
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Neil - I understand fully. Ozzy is placing the blame on anyone or anything besides himself. He has no respect for the players (see his Facebook posts for further examples) and no respect for the people that put their money up to make the Oscar/Sky match happen. Who cares if these guys are playing for as much money as was added to the entire event he is running. He has a stream to show of a challenge match that wasnt marketed correctly so he is worried about viewership.

Yes I understand that players were in Vegas for the CSI event and wouldn't have been there otherwise. But without action matches in a pool players life, players couldn't afford to go to events. And without action at events, they are not cost effective to go to either. With the action this past year, players will come next year. That is what made it a success if you want to know the truth. It's like a mini DCC. Unfortunately the action was taken to a pool room. Maybe Ozzy could concentrate on correcting that.

Hell Oscar CASHED in the 8 ball event and got back less than his entry fee. :confused: Maybe Ozzy also need to concentrate on looking at his payout structure then trying to hand out a biscuit to a player. And I'm not saying that $30k overall added isn't nice but the payouts of the money are faulted.

Re read his response. Intentionally was used over and over and not in the way you initially have understood.


Yes please have them look at the payout structure.

I won the 9 ball this year, 326 players it paid 1900. I staked Lil D to play a couple years ago, he won the same 9 ball event with a capped field of 256, it paid like 2500, lmao. Just funny to me, I go for the fun of going, not the $ cause there's none there.

But they need to check that structure you are correct. It's awful.
 
This was entertaining and FREE! Thanks to all who participated and see you next time even under a different username. :p
 
Ah, the multiple personality posting disorder.

It has ruined many great (deluded) posters before.

I look forward to seeing the spin on this one. Everyone save this thread on your computer before it gets deleted.
 
Ah, the multiple personality posting disorder.

It has ruined many great (deluded) posters before.

I look forward to seeing the spin on this one. Everyone save this thread on your computer before it gets deleted.

Yea I can't see it lasting long.

#breakgate
 
Why the Silence?
As some of you may have noticed, I no longer engage in opinion or debate on this forum. I only use it to provide information about our events and to answer legitimate questions. The sad reality is that there are a few people here that do nothing but attack and spread negativity. I often joke with Mark Griffin that we could publish the cure for cancer here and get repeatedly attacked.

I don’t respond to these often ridiculous posts for two very simple reasons. First, I have a company to run and important work to do. I have a responsibility to Mark Griffin, our employees, our members, and our sponsors. Responding to every silly accusation or comment would divert me from the real work to be done. Secondly, reacting to these people gives them and their comments some form of legitimacy. As you can see in a few of the comments in this thread, there are some people here that will constantly criticize your every action. There are even some who lodge personal attacks without knowing me or any of the information that goes into my decisions. I really don’t mind because I’m an adult and it comes with the job. I usually just chuckle and get back to work. As an adult and a professional, I refuse to engage on that basis.

There also seems to be some notion that the details of every action, decision, or negotiation in the pool industry should be posted for public consumption. That notion is false and should be rejected by any rational person.

So, in the future, when you see negative comments, accusations, or personal attacks against me or CSI, you will see no reaction. Silence is not an admission of guilt. Again, I have far better things to do with my limited time. With that said, I will always try to answer legitimate questions and respond to serious and civil posts.

A Little Background
Against my better judgment, I will explain what happened in this situation and it will be the last time I ever do so on the AZBilliards forum. Before I do, it may be helpful to understand a little background. Ray Hansen and I have been friends since 2011. He helped me tremendously when I was setting up the live stream for The Action Pool Tour on the east coast. He spend a lot of his valuable time on the phone explaining what I needed and how to make it work. He even mailed me a few computer components that I lacked. He did this and never asked for anything in return.

Oscar and I have been friends since 2013. I could tell immediately that he was a good person raised in a great family. He rarely has anything negative to say and he is doing great things on the west coast. The effort he has put into the Mezz West State Tour surpasses anything I have done with The Action Pool Tour. I think I did a good job but he is doing a great job. I admire what he is doing so when he asked me for help in setting up the Mezz West State Tour live stream, I didn’t hesitate. He needed a Ustream channel which was previously free but now cost a minimum of $200/month. Coincidentally, I had a spare Ustream channel that I used for testing purposes. Rather than watching him buy one and take that money from his players, I gave him my channel free of charge. I was happy to help a good person who really cares about the game.

So, What Really Happened?
Oscar Dominguez and Skyler Woodward had agreed to play their match on July 22 and 23 beginning at 4pm each day and then asked Ray Hansen to stream it via PPV. I assume that Ray and the two players would split the PPV revenue in some fashion – as is usually the case. Neither of the three parties knew that we had already scheduled and announced The Kamui Challenge and The Tiger Challenge for July 22 and 23 beginning at 5pm each day.

When I saw the flyer for their match, I immediately called Ray Hansen. Ray informed me that he was not the organizer so the scheduling was out of his control. He was simply asked to stream it. I then called Oscar. He was completely unaware of the conflict and was very apologetic. After discussing possible solutions to avoid the conflict, Oscar’s girlfriend (Desiree Rivera) proposed a solution. She suggested that the Oscar/Skyler match begin at 2pm each day and take a long break at 5pm when our challenge matches began. This would prevent a situation in which two PPV streams were running simultaneously and people that wanted to watch both could do so. Oscar, Ray, and I all agreed that this was a good solution and would benefit everyone.

Oscar then contacted Skyler to get his approval. A few minutes later, Oscar called me back and said that Skyler’s backer said, “No…the match will be played as originally agreed.” I then contacted Skyler and explained the entire situation to him. He seemed to understand and said that he would speak with his backer and get back with me shortly. A day later, he still had not contacted me so I reached out again. He said that he hadn’t spoken with his backer yet but would do so soon. I expressed the urgency and he seemed to understand. Another day went by and I reached out to him again. He then said that they were not going to move the match up to accommodate us. I explained to him that running two PPV streams would not be good for either of us because we may split the audience rather than giving people the opportunity to watch both. I again asked him and his backer to reconsider so we could work with each other rather than against each other. Again, they said, “No.” I then explained to Skyler that his unwillingness to compromise would damage our live stream viewership, interfere with our ability to recover the cost of paying the players and the stream crew, and hurt our sponsors – Kamui and Tiger. He still said, “No.” Finally, I told him that if he maintained his position to intentionally harm us and our sponsors, we would have to seriously consider whether or not to accept his entry into our events (which he had not yet registered for). He and his backer finally agreed to compromise.

I then informed Oscar and Ray that Skyler agreed. Ray and I agreed that he would encourage his viewers to flip over to our challenge match and we would encourage our viewers to flip over to his later in the evening. We would work with each other rather than compete for the same tiny market of PPV viewers.

Bullying?
What happened was not bullying. CSI guaranteed $30,000 to be added to the US Open events and we had to pay a live stream crew of seven (7) people for 11 days. We recover some (definitely not all) of that money through sponsorships, VIP seats, and live stream revenue. Additionally, our sponsors pay for exposure. A competing PPV stream scheduled directly on top of our two challenge matches would limit their exposure and make them less likely to be a sponsor in future years. Without sponsors, there are either no events or smaller prize funds in the future – both of which are bad for the players. Our position was simple and logical…if you intentionally harm us or our sponsors, you may not be welcome to play in our events. That’s not bullying…that’s accountability for your choices.

There also seems to be some notion that people have a right to play in various independent events produced by individual businesses. That is untrue. Like most businesses, the entities that provide the funding have the right to refuse service to anyone. Although we want everyone to participate and have equal opportunity at our events, we are not required to service someone who intentionally harms us, our sponsors, or our other members. This holds true for someone who organizes a competing live stream directly on top of ours or someone who publically attacks us on social media. They have the absolute right to do those things and we have the absolute right to not do business with them. Again, that’s not bullying…that’s accepting the consequences of your actions.

Final Thoughts
So, there it is. Those are the details. You have the right to agree or disagree. You have the right to continue to post whatever comments you wish. You have the right to publically criticize or attack me or CSI anytime you wish. None of that really bothers me or will deter us from pushing forward and making a real difference in an otherwise tragic industry. This will be the last time that I ever reply on AZBilliards to a “demand for answers” based on a contrived conspiracy by people who contribute nothing but negativity and divisiveness. So, if you ever wonder why there is no response from CSI on this forum, there is your answer.

To all of those good people who make up the silent majority here, I don’t blame you for not posting here and we truly thank you for your support. Thank you.

You gave him an offer he couldn't refuse...How very reasonable of you. All the CSI guys posts read the same to me: "Give respect or else..Bla, bla business...". Every time the word "business" is mentioned there is either a concealed threat or in defense of some thuggish action. You talk exactly like the mafia guys.:rolleyes: Here is some nice music to go with your post:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qSxxQcVd2MU
 
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Oh man this is awesome. Ozzy just isn't a PR person. Annddddd he obviously thinks he's smarter than everyone on here.
 
Damn, I was hoping it was Barton.

I kinda sorta was, but shoreboy turning out to be Ozzy was actually even better. I wonder what support for CSI from the pool community will look like after this.

Unrelated thought... if CSI is trying to appeal to the drunks and bangers with their mini-tables, wouldn't that put them directly in competition with the APA?
 
While being honest is generally admirable when at fault, you need to show a certain amount of humility to go with it. I think Ozzy and his clone, while honest, lack remorse and explaining what they planned on doing in the future should this event arise. They should acknowledge the opportunity cost of the assigned Mosconi Cup points were a motivating factor not just encouragement. That's $10k(USA stopped winning), exposure on the highest level, and a chance to represent your country.

If I was Matchroom, I'd take my points away for a year or two and then let CSI feel the impact of a strong arming. They won't get the same names without the Points attached to the events or the same fan fare that goes with it. That might smarten them up some.

If I'm CSI I wouldn't hold firm to this rigid stance they've taken, I'd admit guilt and say how they plan on getting better in the future. Action provides a means of supplemental income especially for these high level players. It's like a side job for an electrician or something, same craft different check. These guys are independent contractors, unless CSI wants to start hiring players to non-compete with their events they have to be as accommodating as possible. Yes Sky makes your product better on bar tables as he's one of the best on that table in all games. That's a mutually beneficial relationship.

Figure your shit out CSI, this won't fly too long. Everyone messes up, important thing is just to figure out when you messed up and then try to be better in the future. You can't change the past but you can put systems in place to prevent these incidents in the future. Even if it's something to the players that lets them know in advance what the penalty is.
 
Too much political allegiance in this thread. It's quite obvious to anyone who's been a member of this forum and in the pool world. We get it. Somebody you know and love has been slighted, so let's attack anything and anybody associated with that slight.

All's fair in love and war, but in pool, it's an all-out war to the very end.

Time to move on. Nothing more to see here.
 
And another thing, nobody -- and I mean NOBODY, not one member of this forum -- can predict what may happen when a pool event is in progress. It is impossible to have every single thing covered that is thrown your way. You have to make an executive decision and move forward. It's a time-sensitive industry when a tournament is in progress.

You don't like the decision, well, that's too f***ing bad. I can't tell you how many bad calls I've witnessed from a referee in a pool tournament, and there is nothing anyone can do about it.

This tournament industry business is not a perfect science. It's one thing to defend your friends and loved ones, but when you do it at the expense of knocking down good men in this pool world, it's not really helping anybody. It's just ends up, well, like this thread.
 
And another thing, nobody -- and I mean NOBODY, not one member of this forum -- can predict what may happen when a pool event is in progress. It is impossible to have every single thing covered that is thrown your way. You have to make an executive decision and move forward. It's a time-sensitive industry when a tournament is in progress.

You don't like the decision, well, that's too f***ing bad. I can't tell you how many bad calls I've witnessed from a referee in a pool tournament, and there is nothing anyone can do about it.

This tournament industry business is not a perfect science. It's one thing to defend your friends and loved ones, but when you do it at the expense of knocking down good men in this pool world, it's not really helping anybody. It's just ends up, well, like this thread.


Thank you



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Name Shoreboy. 29 posts in three years. Jumps right in this thread. Knows I am friends with Cleary and left CSI. Calls me disgruntled because I say strong arming players with points given to you by an outside entity is some low shit.

Who do I know from the shore....ohhh somewhere like Virginia maybe that could have an interest in this topic? [...].

I have no idea who Shoreboy is. But you guys should at least be aware that Ozzy has a brother in law who

A. Was a key behind-the-scenes person helping with and promoting the Action Pool Tour.

B. is from the VA shore

C. moved out to Vegas and is now working for CSI

Again, I don't know. But being a little more circumspect here would not be unreasonable...
 
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