Can you get the object ball to spin and to "grab" the pocket and help it drop?

[KoolKat9Lives]

Can you get the object ball to spin and to "grab" the pocket and help it drop?

I've heard someone say certain spin will help an object ball "grab the pocket" and help it drop in - or "widen the pocket" if you will.

As an example, take the following shot. If the 9 ball goes into the right side of the side pocket and has clockwise spin on it, won't that help it grab the pocket and drop? So to give it clockwise spin it needs to be hit by the cue ball with counter clockwise --> ie. inside english.

Is this a helpful skill to have in your arsenal?

CueTable Help

 

[mnShooter]

My buddy used to call this spinning the ball into the hole. It definitely works. Also on the shot you have posted it is easier to make the ball when you are cutting it to the right than if the cueball were closer to the upper left corner pocket and you were cutting the object ball to the left. It seems like the object ball picks up some roll in the direction of the path of the cueball. You almost get a little masse when the object ball stops sliding.

 

[measureman]

If you hit the cue ball with right hand english it will transfer a little left spin to the object ball. The slower you hit it the more it will transfer .The shot you have diagramed can't be hit too hard so if your objective is just to pocket the ball i would feather it in . Side pocket shots with a lot of angle have a nasty habit of spitting the ball out if hit too hard. Overall i think transferring english to pocket a ball is not worth the effort on most shots.

 

[greyghost]

inside english does that

matlock talked to me about this once, if you put inside on the CB it will make the OBJ ball spin toward the inside of the pocket, not much is needed. If its a pretty striaght in shot, just a half or quarter tip of inside english will do fine and the same applies for any shot. Speed does affect this, but I'm sure you can see how the technique works.

Go to your home ball,
Grey Ghost

I also agree that its not worth the effort on most shots to pocket the ball, as you can sacrifice proper positioning of the cue ball by applying this. But then again if the pocket is giving you problems I would rather chinch the ball and still be able to shoot again, than to rattle her. I find I use this more on the tighter diamonds than on any other table. So it is a definate skill for your arsenal that can help take down the $$$. The more you know the better prepared you are.

 

[woody_968]

Im with Measureman here, yes it can be done but I dont think its worth it. IMO a small amount of transfered spin may make the pocket accept the ball a little easier, but your making an accurate hit harder to accomplish with the addition of english. I think your giving up more than you are gaining.

 

[tucson9ball]

Natural spin........

The angle you have in your example will pick up natural inside spin on the OB because of hitting it on the left side. The same would be true for a corner pocket.
I might add, this spin will only last for maybe a couple feet. Try it using a striped OB it's easier to see the transferred spin.
I don't think it's worth risking on a long shot, I would only use this extra spin on short shots. My rule of thumb: if the shot is over 4ft. I use minimal english. I would rather make the ball and have a little more difficult next shot than hang it in the jaws for the next guy.:wink:

 

[Majic]

Brady showed that to me a while back and I played with it some. I think its more useful going down the rail so a pocket facing won't throw the ball back onto the table.

 

[nathandumoulin]

By doing this you're compromising the accuracy of the shot, as well as your position play. In the end it will probably cause you to miss more shots.

Just my 2 cents.

 

[JAM]

I've heard someone say certain spin will help an object ball "grab the pocket" and help it drop in - or "widen the pocket" if you will.

As an example, take the following shot. If the 9 ball goes into the right side of the side pocket and has clockwise spin on it, won't that help it grab the pocket and drop? So to give it clockwise spin it needs to be hit by the cue ball with counter clockwise --> ie. inside english.

Is this a helpful skill to have in your arsenal?

You shoot the ball with a downward stroke, with right-hand english, deadening the cueball, where the object ball will then have some spin on it and throw it right in the side pocket.

It's a technique a/k/a known as "the inside kill shot." It's used a lot by good players who like to use english more than others. There's a lot of times you shoot the ball down in the corner pocket using the english, and the ball with the correct spin will make the pocket bigger. The whole secret is the english.

You can hit the ball on the rail, and it looks like you missed it, but the english and the spin, if it hits the pocket at all, will usually make it go in.

Ask me how I know how to shoot this shot! :grin-square:

 

[enzo]

hell yes you can.

this is why players, when shooting a ball down the rail with the cueball being closer to the rail, tend to load it up with outside english. and this is why when cutting a ball down the rail, and the cb is further from that rail than the ob, players tend to use at least more of a center ball, cus it puts more "spin into the pocket english" that way.

 

[greyghost]

where do you get these top secret secrets????? lol

You shoot the ball with a downward stroke, with right-hand english, deadening the cueball, where the object ball will then have some spin on it and throw it right in the side pocket.

It's a technique a/k/a known as "the inside kill shot." It's used a lot by good players who like to use english more than others. There's a lot of times you shoot the ball down in the corner pocket using the english, and the ball with the correct spin will make the pocket bigger. The whole secret is the english.

You can hit the ball on the rail, and it looks like you missed it, but the english and the spin, if it hits the pocket at all, will usually make it go in.

Ask me how I know how to shoot this shot! :grin-square:

Jam How do you know this shot? Did you happen upon it during an EARTHQUAKE? LOL (hey have you two emptied your mail box, tried to send something the other day) By the way, I LOVE THAT CAT!

G.G.

 

[measureman]

The angle you have in your example will pick up natural inside spin on the OB because of hitting it on the left side. The same would be true for a corner pocket.
I might add, this spin will only last for maybe a couple feet. Try it using a striped OB it's easier to see the transferred spin.
I don't think it's worth risking on a long shot, I would only use this extra spin on short shots. My rule of thumb: if the shot is over 4ft. I use minimal english. I would rather make the ball and have a little more difficult next shot than hang it in the jaws for the next guy.:wink:

Pay attention to the last two sentences people. Here is a person that probably learned this lesson the hard way by giving up the cash.
Unless you are a real good player this is a great rule : Don't beat yourself!

 

[JAM]

Jam How do you know this shot? Did you happen upon it during an EARTHQUAKE? LOL (hey have you two emptied your mail box, tried to send something the other day) By the way, I LOVE THAT CAT!

G.G.

You guessed right. I had a consultant giving me advice on this thread. :wink:

My PM box is clear! I love that cool cat too!

 

[pvc lou]

how do you know how to shoot this shot? oh. nevermind.

You shoot the ball with a downward stroke, with right-hand english, deadening the cueball, where the object ball will then have some spin on it and throw it right in the side pocket.

It's a technique a/k/a known as "the inside kill shot." It's used a lot by good players who like to use english more than others. There's a lot of times you shoot the ball down in the corner pocket using the english, and the ball with the correct spin will make the pocket bigger. The whole secret is the english.

You can hit the ball on the rail, and it looks like you missed it, but the english and the spin, if it hits the pocket at all, will usually make it go in.

Ask me how I know how to shoot this shot! :grin-square:

 

[SpiderWebComm]

I'm on a Mac with OS 10.6 so I can't see the diagram. I'm not sure why you'd ever wanna spin an OB to help it grab the pocket. Just hit the hole instead of the rail and you don't have to sweat anything.

 

[Bob Jewett]

I've heard someone say certain spin will help an object ball "grab the pocket" and help it drop in - ...

It's easy to see how much side spin you can get on an object ball by banking a stripe and "twisting" (transferring side to) the object ball. It's not much. Maybe that little bit of side spin is useful for getting balls to drop when they are barely at the edge of hanging up, but I think any advantage is negligible, especially compared to the aiming issues when using side spin.

I think the real advantage of this technique is that it gives you confidence.

Somewhere above someone mentioned getting the object ball to masse a little by using side spin on the cue ball. To the best of my knowledge, this has never been demonstrated to be a practical shot.

 

[jwilliams]

I'm on a Mac with OS 10.6 so I can't see the diagram. I'm not sure why you'd ever wanna spin an OB to help it grab the pocket. Just hit the hole instead of the rail and you don't have to sweat anything.

If you've got Firefox installed try it with that...I've got 10.6.1 as well and can see it fine in Firefox but not in Safari. Go figure...

 

[Patrick Johnson]

Is ["helping" english] a helpful skill to have in your arsenal?

No.

The amount of spin you can transfer to an OB is too small to make a difference unless the visible pocket opening is very small. Shooting at a small target is exactly when you don't want to compromise your accuracy with sidespin, especially since it rarely is helpful.

Transferred spin wears off quickly, so it could only make a difference on short shots or on shots you hit harder. You probably don't need it on short shots because you can hit the pocket opening pretty accurately already (unless you add sidespin to the equation), and hitting shots harder makes it much more likely the OB will jaw (in addition to also reducing accuracy even more).

In other words, it's a bad idea and a myth. They're common in pool (another related one is "rail hugging english").

pj
chgo

 

[woody_968]

I'm on a Mac with OS 10.6 so I can't see the diagram. I'm not sure why you'd ever wanna spin an OB to help it grab the pocket. Just hit the hole instead of the rail and you don't have to sweat anything.

Im using Safari 4.0.3 and see it just fine. Im not sure what I did to get it that way though LOL.

 

[enzo]

No.

The amount of spin you can transfer to an OB is too small to make a difference unless the visible pocket opening is very small. Shooting at a small target is exactly when you don't want to compromise your accuracy with sidespin, especially since it rarely is helpful.

Transferred spin wears off quickly, so it could only make a difference on short shots or on shots you hit harder. You probably don't need it on short shots because you can hit the pocket opening pretty accurately already (unless you add sidespin to the equation), and hitting shots harder makes it much more likely the OB will jaw (in addition to also reducing accuracy even more).

In other words, it's a bad idea and a myth. They're common in pool (another related one is "rail hugging english").

pj
chgo

nice post, an ob hitting the pocket facing with spin toward the pocket wont help? and you are the one stating that (those other people) believe in a lot of myths in pool, ironic.

first, all you gotta do is bank enough balls (ask the bankers) about how much english can be transferred to an ob, especially when you hit center on the cb. second, how can you possibly think that this amount of english wont help a ball in when it hits the facing of a pocket (as opposed to say rattling otherwise).

in any case, forgive me, but it's just no wonder there is so much misinformation out there.