could 526 be broken?

1

1129

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
does it seem possible that todays great players could break this record if they played on the same equipment as mosconi was playing on when he had this run
i read an article that said it was a 4x8 table with rather large pockets
with todays players playing on such tight equipment it just seems like these large pockets and smaller table would make it simpler
don't get me wrong i am aware that the cloth and balls were different but mosconi was not playing on a diamond either
it would be neat to see this type of equipment at the derby and give todays players the chance to try
$100 a chance winner take all for high run with $10,000 bonus for a new record
documentating the run should not be a problem there is easy access to equipment for recording
 
If there was a $1,000,000 prize for doing it I think it would fall within a year. Barring something along those lines I just do not see someone putting forth the time and effort.

I would love to see John Schmidt put a 4x8 and video camera in his house and shoot at it. I think he could do it. The return on investment of time and mental anguish is questionable however. Could you imagine having a ball skid on 526 ? A guy might go jump off a bridge :D
 
I think it has been

I think 526 has been broken and on tougher equipment. Doing it in a manner that it would be accepted as a new record is the catch. Willie put on a lot of straight pool exhibitions to run 526 once. Who today has an equal shot at the record?

Hu


1129 said:
does it seem possible that todays great players could break this record if they played on the same equipment as mosconi was playing on when he had this run
i read an article that said it was a 4x8 table with rather large pockets
with todays players playing on such tight equipment it just seems like these large pockets and smaller table would make it simpler
don't get me wrong i am aware that the cloth and balls were different but mosconi was not playing on a diamond either
it would be neat to see this type of equipment at the derby and give todays players the chance to try
$100 a chance winner take all for high run with $10,000 bonus for a new record
documentating the run should not be a problem there is easy access to equipment for recording
Click to expand...
 
Schmidt, Hohmann, Harriman, Feijan, and a bunch of others, I think could do it.
 
I agree with JCIN. Players make their money off 9 and 10 ball nowadays, so breaking the record would take lots of effort at the expense of practicing those games. A big prize would help, but I think it would be tough to market. Imagine a player hitting 520 then missing. What a waste that would seem.
 
Schmidt has two runs of 400 or more and I believe Engert has one over 400 as well. Those runs were on tougher equipment than Mosconi's reported equipment, but it's an apples & oranges thing that will never be resolved.

The modern players have demonstrated immense skill at Bob Jewett's DCC 14.1 challenges...and I mean no offense to Bob but that's a rather informal competition...Bob has my respect for putting up a large chunk of his own money to keep the game alive.

My point is, if the players would prepare for a world-class competition (big, big money is the motivator, right?), the records could be in jeopardy. Don't forget, 14.1 is not dead in Europe...it's just fallen off the map in the western hemishpere.

BTW, Mika ran 160 on the BRUTAL DCC equipment the year I watched. With the streak he is on right now, he might post a 300 or 400 or 500 ball run on more typical equipment.
 
Hu...Where, when, and by whom? It hasn't been done in front of credible witnesses, or it would BE the new record. There have been many so-called high runs...but never documented. Wimpy was documented running five 150-and-out matches, back to back...but it was against 5 different people, so it wasn't considered breaking Mosconi's record. The Eufala Kid supposedly ran over 600, but it couldn't be documented.

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com

ShootingArts said:
I think 526 has been broken and on tougher equipment. Doing it in a manner that it would be accepted as a new record is the catch. Willie put on a lot of straight pool exhibitions to run 526 once. Who today has an equal shot at the record?

Hu
Click to expand...
 
The thought that no pros capable of getting close to 500 don't care enough to try to break the record without a paycheck, makes me sad.

If I could get close to 400 or 500, I'd do it just to make history. I wouldn't need to be paid 10 cents to do it.
 
It will not

be broken anytime soon. A good run comes on its own. If you plan to break the record, it will never happen.

When I ran 11 racks of 9 ball, I wasn't counting, my opponents were though.
It was a 3 man ring game, $50 a man per game, and I was down $1,500 before the run.
 
Scott Lee said:
Wimpy was documented running five 150-and-out matches, back to back...but it was against 5 different people, so it wasn't considered breaking Mosconi's record.
Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com
Click to expand...

Wow, I have never heard about that. To me that is more impressive than Mosconi's run. Where can I find information about Lassiter's five consecutive 150-and-outs?
 
When you look at when straight pool was the big game, there were just sooooooooo many formats that DEMANDED a player run a lot of balls. Nowadays, the only 14.1 competitions around are, at best, 200 point games. If there were 2,500 point competitions again, the incentive would be immediate - miss and risk never getting another clean shot today.

Honestly, I wonder how good these guys would be if the incentive to play better straight pool weren't just to attain a great high run but to actually just win the game at hand. Knowing how competitive these guys already are, I would imagine you'd see the game jump to an entirely new level.

I honestly believe the greatest could already be among us but with the state of the game currently, we may never know it.
 
I'd have to do my homework

Scott Lee said:
Hu...Where, when, and by whom? It hasn't been done in front of credible witnesses, or it would BE the new record. There have been many so-called high runs...but never documented. Wimpy was documented running five 150-and-out matches, back to back...but it was against 5 different people, so it wasn't considered breaking Mosconi's record. The Eufala Kid supposedly ran over 600, but it couldn't be documented.

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com
Click to expand...

Scott,

I would have to do my homework to get the names. In one instance it was reported to be broken with a crowd watching but with no knowledge that history was knocking no one person sat through it start to finish although there were people present for the entire run. I have heard several more reports of the 526 being beaten in practice but it is impossible to document to anyone's satisfaction. Nobody knows it is going to be a great run at the beginning of a run. My best shot at a perfect game of snooker was spoiled because I took a slightly easier six instead of the seven near the middle of the run. The seven was very makeable but I had no idea I was headed towards a perfect game had I taken the seven.

I shot a group of rifle targets that would have blown away the world record at the time and still would hold the world record now, many years later. The targets were shot in official target tag(paper) within the official time limits that records have to be shot in. They weren't shot in an event that records could be set in so my personal best is just that and meaningless to the rest of the world. It is still the most perfect set of targets I have ever seen with every group between 0.105" and 0.120" center to center with no large or tiny groups both of which can be flukes. How many others have shot equal groups? At least one more. Those interested do a search on benchrest and the Houston warehouse. Neither of us have any real claim to fame however.

Likewise anyone that has shot over 526 without indisputable proof is whistling in the wind. That doesn't mean it didn't happen, it means that very few care.

Hu
 
ShootingArts said:
I think 526 has been broken and on tougher equipment. Doing it in a manner that it would be accepted as a new record is the catch. Willie put on a lot of straight pool exhibitions to run 526 once. Who today has an equal shot at the record?

Hu
Click to expand...

I was at the old Stardust tournament in Vegas in the early 70's when they held up play for quite a while {don't remember exactly} because Colovia was practicing 14.1 and it seems he was at like 650 when they asked him to stop as they needed to get going. I don't remember what year, but sure it was the early 70's. I was just a kid.
 
ironman said:
I was at the old Stardust tournament in Vegas in the early 70's when they held up play for quite a while {don't remember exactly} because Colovia was practicing 14.1 and it seems he was at like 650 when they asked him to stop as they needed to get going. I don't remember what year, but sure it was the early 70's. I was just a kid.
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Do you mean Jack Colavita?
 
One of my responses copied and pasted from another thread on the same subject.... Keep in mind that, IIRC, the 9' Diamond pros at the DCC have 4-1/2" pockets and Willies 8' 526 table had 5-1/2" pockets. How many balls is that extra 1" worth?

"I know this whole Mosconi 526 subject has been beat to death but here are the facts: they did use old "clay" type balls, nap cloth, and it was on an 8' Brunswick Sports King with 5-1/2" pockets. Snipped from the Wikipedia page for Willie Mosconi-->>> "The record was set on a 4 foot x 8 foot Brunswick pool table with 5 1/2 inch pockets at the East High Billiard Club in Springfield, Ohio." Some may argue that the pockets were really 5-1/2" but a local player from here in Central Ohio played a very long ring game session on the 526 table the day after Willes run. Johnny said it was the biggest bucket table he had ever played on.... So there is no doubt in my mind that the 5-1/2" pockets are a fact! With all of the resources that members here have, why doesn't someone here make this happen at the DCC this year?-->>> Set up an 8' Brunswick Sports King w/ 5-1/2" pockets, slow cloth, and "old" balls for the straight pool challenge table..... I know someone here can make that happen! Why not give John, Danny, and all of the other current top SP players a shot at glory under the same conditions Willie had???????"
 
that is one I don't remember hearing about

ironman said:
I was at the old Stardust tournament in Vegas in the early 70's when they held up play for quite a while {don't remember exactly} because Colovia was practicing 14.1 and it seems he was at like 650 when they asked him to stop as they needed to get going. I don't remember what year, but sure it was the early 70's. I was just a kid.
Click to expand...

That is a high run I don't remember hearing about and illustrates my point in my post to Scott. Most high runs aren't set in conditions acceptable to all so they are only remembered by a few and mostly forgotten.

I'd like to see a new high run set on a nine foot table with standard range pockets. That would give people an apples to apples record to shoot for.

Thanks for the info.

Hu
 
PoolBum...Well, it is second-hand information, told to me by someone who was there. It was at one of the Johnston City tournaments in the 60's. It was damned impressive, and I agree with you. I don't know how you could find out more about it...sorry!

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com

PoolBum said:
Wow, I have never heard about that. To me that is more impressive than Mosconi's run. Where can I find information about Lassiter's five consecutive 150-and-outs?
Click to expand...
 
This is a post John Schimdt made about playing on a smaller table

i used to wonder myself which is harder. the 8ft is absolutely easier. furthermore i was in the ob1 booth this year on a diamond bartable.i was curious if i could run 100. i walked in first shot 830 am ,dress clothes ,balls were even kinda dirty,no glove and not my obcue.a different obcue and ran 181 . bob jewett sweated most of it and my ob1 guys saw whole thing.
at first i said to myself thats gotta be like running 400.
actually it was easier than 9ft because i could reach every break ball easy and all the shots werte almost unmissable.
a 4by 8 is even easier.
trust me on 4by8 big pockets i think i would run over 500 within a 2 year period.
in closing i promise 4by8 is easier and if someone thinks different they can take a week on 9ft and ill take week on 4by8 and see who runs the most.jmho
Click to expand...

http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=110368
 
There has to be incentive. $ 200,000 maybe even $ 100,000 and I think it would fall within 3 months. Put up enough money and Efren might put the time in.
 
daphish1 said:
This is a post John Schimdt made about playing on a smaller table



http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=110368
Click to expand...


We have a couple of 8-foot tables at Amsterdam that the APA uses. I've played on them a few times and have put 3-packs together on them on several occasions. Every time I play on them, the thought of running out the set dances in my head. The best I've done is 4 of 5.

I admit, my knowledge is a bit limited. I don't play on them often BUT the few times I have played on them, I sure as hell believe it's easier. The size gives you enough space to maneuver with yet the shots are still easier.

Regarding straight pool - I mean, it doesn't take a mathematician to figure out that the probability of wired combinations is definitely going to increase since the pockets represent a greater percentage of the table perimeter. This may seem trivial to some but most will tell you, a big run often contains a few fortunate layouts where you can smash the rack without worry of missing the ball.

Also, the cut of the side pocket comes into play. On a standard 9-foot table, side pockets are bigger than corner pockets. On a standard barbox, the opposite is true. On an 8-foot table, the dimensions are often consistent with 9-footers which would make the sides EXTREMELY easy.
 
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