Thats all we played in baltimore in the 70s 80s then came 1 foul,we called it 2 foul ball in hand,if 1st person push out,then the next shot was a foul ,then it was bih,every ball was spotted,thats when spot shots ment something,if u made the 9ball an scratched,well u didnt automatically lose,your opponent still had to make a spot shot on the 9ball!
How good was Toby Sweet and does anyone have stories.
- Thread starter floridaboy24
- Start date
Thats all we played in baltimore in the 70s 80s then came 1 foul,we called it 2 foul ball in hand,if 1st person push out,then the next shot was a foul ,then it was bih,every ball was spotted,thats when spot shots ment something,if u made the 9ball an scratched,well u didnt automatically lose,your opponent still had to make a spot shot on the 9ball!
Many years ago I saw Toby at the Hawks Nest pool room in the Squirrel Hill section of Pittsburgh. He was playing 9-ball for 300 a game. That was BIG $ in that day and I swear it was like he had whitey on a string. Watched him a few other times and I tell you, Toby was a fearless money player. And, always a class act.
Push at ANY time even if you had a good shot shooters choice, tho if you fouled twice in a row, BIH for your opponent. When you did push out tho you were on One, and if your opponent could lock you up, and you didn't make a legal hit, your opponent got BIH. Another example....your opponent pushes out, and lets say you took the shot and ran four or five balls and then Locked em up, you could get BIH because your opponent was still on One foul.
Now, that, I never even heard of. Just goes to show, regional rules abounded.
I played Toby only once. I went down through Florida in the 70's and happened to go in a poolroom that I think he owned. I played the guy who was working behind the counter and won a few bucks. He told me his boss likes to play and if I wait a while he'll be in to work. I should have left!
After a while in comes Toby and I recognized him. I greeted him and he was his usual polite self. Then he asks me if I beat his houseman and I said yeah (it was maybe $30 or $40 at five a game). He then asks if I want to play a little, "cheap" like $20 a game. No thanks, I told him. So now he asks me what kind of weight I would need to play. I said at least the seven ball. He quickly replied, "You got it." I was too embarrassed to back down, so we played. He beat me out of $100 (or $120) so fast my head was spinning. I thanked him for his hospitality and got the Hell out of there. :smile:
After a while in comes Toby and I recognized him. I greeted him and he was his usual polite self. Then he asks me if I beat his houseman and I said yeah (it was maybe $30 or $40 at five a game). He then asks if I want to play a little, "cheap" like $20 a game. No thanks, I told him. So now he asks me what kind of weight I would need to play. I said at least the seven ball. He quickly replied, "You got it." I was too embarrassed to back down, so we played. He beat me out of $100 (or $120) so fast my head was spinning. I thanked him for his hospitality and got the Hell out of there. :smile:
Last edited:
As I know it, this was the norm, Everywhere in the US, it was called "two shot shoot out" best player almost Always won, luck didn't help in the long haul:
Yep, any two in a row, per rack in rotation pool. Kinda like 14.1 per game, when your on a foul, it doesn't go away till a legal hit (or game over), even if your opponent runs fifty and then plays a safe, why, the game ends at 125. Of course in rotation pool each game ends after ea rack, and then your NOT on a carry over foul into the next rack/game.
Last edited:
Yeah, everything you said goes with what I knew about push out 9 ball except the push at any time. I knew at least a two or three guys who had been out on the road a lot and never heard of it from them. I did hear of both two fouls by the same player and any two committed in a row by one, then the other. It sure was a different game, that's for sure.
http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=95869&highlight=toby+sweet
Here is another good thread with some Toby Sweet stories!!!!
http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=143937&highlight=toby+sweet&page=4
Jack Kooney Vs. Toby Sweet story Above!!!
Here is another good thread with some Toby Sweet stories!!!!
http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=143937&highlight=toby+sweet&page=4
Jack Kooney Vs. Toby Sweet story Above!!!
Thanks, KD!
Never heard of those push out rules,once a ball is made,then all fouls were over.u could not continue on through the game with ur opponent stuck on 1 foul.once either player made a legal hit,then all fouls are gone ,back to zero.
Last edited:
Two foul,push out,any two fouls in a row ,no matter who,is bih,if i push out,then that is 1 foul,if u accept the shot and foul,then i have bih,who ever commits the 2nd foul,the other player will have bih,if i push and u give me the shot and then i foul,u get bih,ANY 2 fouls in a row,is bih.
Bingo....yep its a game where you can beat your opponent with knowlege, just like one pocket. It's strong to, lets say your on one foul and you opponent decides to run out, he scratches, then you just make a good hit or pocket a ball or two and then hook em, he's on One and better hit the next ball otherwise BIH for You. Fat Randy, OK would play just about anyone this game on a bar box, big ball.
the best ball pocketer wins in ball in hand games. with two shot shootout those that get hooked or have better moving skills can beat or give a close game to the guy that runs balls easily.
in ball in hand--
the ball runner just hooks you and then gets out with ball in hand. the mover has no chance.
but in shootout --
when he hooks you you can shoot to a place you have a chance to play safe or make it yet he may have less than a 50% chance himself so you get the shot.
skills like being a good banker, able to slow roll balls safe, making tough cut shots, and out thinking your opponent come back into play.
plus you can more easily make games with a better shooter so there is more action in the poolroom. that is gone now.
in ball in hand--
the ball runner just hooks you and then gets out with ball in hand. the mover has no chance.
but in shootout --
when he hooks you you can shoot to a place you have a chance to play safe or make it yet he may have less than a 50% chance himself so you get the shot.
skills like being a good banker, able to slow roll balls safe, making tough cut shots, and out thinking your opponent come back into play.
plus you can more easily make games with a better shooter so there is more action in the poolroom. that is gone now.
What's that?
road players only.
Is it a published book or are you just saying he's a great road player?
Your 2nd link is Cooney vs Toby Flaherty.