Is it possible to throw an object ball? Nope
- Thread starter mohrt
- Start date
There are several simple demonstrations of throw, and if you know the physics involved, it's easy to see why throw must happen given a few simple observations. Here is the demo I like. With both the cue ball and object ball exactly one ball diameter off the cushion, it is possible to make the object ball hit the GB (gauge ball) and get the cue ball to move towards the cushion, ending less than a ball from the cushion. (The question that the diagram was designed for was to find out how far apart the balls could be and still get this result -- closer is easier.)
Won't the OB pick up opposite english, which would, if it would at all, cause the OB to move to the left, rather than the left(GB)? So the only way to get the OB to move left would be to cut it to the right, which should cause the CB to move to the right, correct?
throw an o.b.
i learned from some esteemed players and mentors in my snooker days, it is possible to transfer a small amount of spin to the o.b. that was 30 years ago.
since then i have demonstrated this fact using two striped balls and a pocket speed hit, to many non believers and opponents. cloth and ball condition have a great influence over this phenomenon. simply set the 2 balls up with the stripe vertical. 1 ball is the c.b., the other the o.b.
enjoy the can of worms!
p.s. one of the "esteemed", became world snooker champion in the 80's.
i learned from some esteemed players and mentors in my snooker days, it is possible to transfer a small amount of spin to the o.b. that was 30 years ago.
since then i have demonstrated this fact using two striped balls and a pocket speed hit, to many non believers and opponents. cloth and ball condition have a great influence over this phenomenon. simply set the 2 balls up with the stripe vertical. 1 ball is the c.b., the other the o.b.
enjoy the can of worms!
p.s. one of the "esteemed", became world snooker champion in the 80's.
Spin transfer and throw
"by transferring spin from the cueball to the object ball. This cannot be done, says Ron."
Don't tell Grady this. I'm sure he'd hate to have to stop shooting all of those 'twist' banks he's been firing in all of these years. Isn't a ball that skids just a ball thrown by the cueball?
"by transferring spin from the cueball to the object ball. This cannot be done, says Ron."
Don't tell Grady this. I'm sure he'd hate to have to stop shooting all of those 'twist' banks he's been firing in all of these years. Isn't a ball that skids just a ball thrown by the cueball?
Patrick is right, if you slow roll the CB with a ton of side spin you will get more throw out of the shot.
Why, that's the Tasmanian Devil stroke he speaks of.
This comes up ALL the time in straight pool when you are touching balls into pockets from the middle of the slightly opened rack with interfering balls all around.
Either it works, or I've been defying physics for 50 years and I am going to be rich.
Why, that's the Tasmanian Devil stroke he speaks of.
This comes up ALL the time in straight pool when you are touching balls into pockets from the middle of the slightly opened rack with interfering balls all around.
Either it works, or I've been defying physics for 50 years and I am going to be rich.
Not exactly. Most of the time when people use the word "skid" in this context, it means a very, very extreme kind of throw due to the contact surface of the collision being much more sticky than it usually is. This seems to usually be from a chalk spot at the contact point. When you get a skid -- which is also called "cling" in the US, "kick" in the UK and other snooker-playing countries, and "bad contact" by carom players speaking in English -- the object ball may throw by several times its usual amount of throw.
But that is all separate from using side spin on the cue ball to throw an object ball.
For reference, with relatively clean but used balls, it is possible to get about 5 degrees of throw. That's the same as five inches in the length of your cue stick. You can get that throw from either spin or cut -- both can do it.
My experience is that I can throw a ball with pretty much any diameter shaft, but with a larger shaft it is harder to judge the squirt. That difficulty of controlling squirt for a thick shaft may mask the effect of throw.
stunshotDAVE...The second part of that, is that it will only happen when shot slowly, and the "transferred spin" to the OB will be gone within a few inches of travel. As you mentioned, conditions (table, cloth, balls, temperature, etc) will play huge roles in whether it happens at all. This is why, imo, good instructors do not obsess over this. If it doesn't happen ALL the time, under any conditions...and when it does happen, it only happens to a slight degree...know about it, understand why it is (or isn't) happening...but quit obsessing over it as a necessary ingredient in normal play. It's just not...
Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com
Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com
I seem to recall that Mike Sigel had this same view a number of years ago. Some of us decided we should just respect his playing skill.
Whenever I try to use gearing english with a large shaft I'll undercut certain shots as if I used just centerball. Doesn't the squirt happen at higher speeds?
throw an o.b.
thanks, scott.
it,s not me obsessing over it. at all.
just my 2 cents worth of throw.
great can of worms!
thanks, scott.
it,s not me obsessing over it. at all.
just my 2 cents worth of throw.
great can of worms!
I don't know if you mean it this way, but the transferred spin doesn't change the path of the object ball. The OB's path is changed only by (and during) contact with the CB; the transferred spin is a side effect.
pj
chgo
Patrick's first post gave the explanation of why the cue ball would NOT stop on a dime if hitting the OB perfectly square with CB spin. Ron simply must not know this. There is really no more need for debate...
A ball in good condition can throw an inch per diamond. That's a few inches for an average shot and half a foot for a long shot.
pj
chgo
There is about the same squirt at all speeds for a given off-center hit. What changes a lot with speed is the amount of swerve you have and to a smaller extent the amount of throw.
If you cannot throw an object ball then explain why it's so evident in banks. Banking with inside spin causes the OB to bank short. Using outside spin causes it to bank wide. Contact point is same so why the difference if the OB isn't picking up any spin from the CB? And if it is picking up spin from the CB then it can be thrown. Pretty simple stuff.