Is Scott Frost over-rated?

[Nick B]

Alex did beat him in a long set .

Absolutely,
Scott walked into that one. Tough (gaff table) that Alex had just played a bunch of hours on. Scott fired and almost made a few banks that he wins from if they go...none did. All of Alex's went. In short bad day for Mr. Frost. I watched all of it. When I saw what table they were playing at I almost screamed through the computer.....NNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!

Tough action. Alex always is.

Nick B

 

[naji]

scott isn't overrated. when I talked to him I asked him question and this is it, do you fell you always got to play power one pocket because that what people expect. He said I was right that a lot of games he would of won but he performs for the crowd. I believe if he played for himself and not for crowd all the time he would be unbeatable

He tried the power thing with Alex, but none worked, he was 4 down, finally he woke up but was too late Alex killed him that day 8 ahead.

 

[JAM]

Alex did beat him in a long set .

Do you think equipment had anything to do with it, as far as Diamond v. Gold Crown?

Most players today are very familiar with Diamonds, how they bank, et cetera. Well, that's according to my other half, what he says. Diamonds seem to be used more today at events than GCs, so many are more familiar with Diamonds and how they play today.

Players who can adapt to strange equipment the fastest at tournaments, for example, do well. As you know, one never knows what equipment will be utilized as far as cloth speed, rails, hot lights, humidity, all the condition that can affect how a table plays.

Alex has been in combat in all kinds of conditions, which is why I think he may have come out ahead on this match with Scott. A rematch would be interesting to see, but after witnessing Alex in action many times, I wouldn't bet against him -- ever.

Funny thing is that he's never beat Keith in a tournament, each time they played against each other, but he has beat Keith in action. Alex plays all games well, and that's what makes him super strong.

 

[Fast Lenny]

Lenny, JB, thanks so much. I just woke up and read this latest exchange, and I'm cracking up JB, thanks for your PM as well. I will bow down to you Lenny, since I "put my money where my mouth is", unlike JB thinks, I will PP you the cash I lost betting on Efren last night. I fell asleep at 7-7 or 6-6 I forget. Couldn't stay awake any longer. Looks like I missed a hell of a last few games. Thanks for the action.

JB, if you'd like to play social, I will. Even. And I will try my best to beat you. I'm not gambling with you. Ever.

Thanks for the sweat bet Nick. :smile:

 

[spanky79]

All I can say is this.

Efren is the best to ever pick up a cue and the best one pocket player EVER.

Yes Efren is older now and if Scott have to go hill hill to beat him now imagine what would have happen against the 15 years ago Efren.

With that being said I watch Scott make one of the best runs I have ever seen being down 9-8 in a race to 10 for the cash. Efren missed shape to get out and left a shot he didnt like would go. Scott was obviously nervous and I was yelling at the screen "just shoot the damn ball", but he got it back to him needing one and eventually wont he game. He then went on to win hill hill when it was down to the last 2 balls.

He EARNED it. And he EARNED my respect as a fan of the game. The last 3 rack of the that match where the best pool I have ever seen.

Well play Scott well played.

 

[spanky79]

Do you think equipment had anything to do with it, as far as Diamond v. Gold Crown?

Most players today are very familiar with Diamonds, how they bank, et cetera. Well, that's according to my other half, what he says. Diamonds seem to be used more today at events than GCs, so many are more familiar with Diamonds and how they play today.

Players who can adapt to strange equipment the fastest at tournaments, for example, do well. As you know, one never knows what equipment will be utilized as far as cloth speed, rails, hot lights, humidity, all the condition that can affect how a table plays.

Alex has been in combat in all kinds of conditions, which is why I think he may have come out ahead on this match with Scott. A rematch would be interesting to see, but after witnessing Alex in action many times, I wouldn't bet against him -- ever.

Funny thing is that he's never beat Keith in a tournament, each time they played against each other, but he has beat Keith in action. Alex plays all games well, and that's what makes him super strong.

I was there that night a ALEX straight up tortured Scott. It was just sad. I was told how much money Scott and his crew has on them and trust me they could of played another set. But after what Alex did to him Scott just walked away.

I would love to see that match up again. But I must say, I think the diamond table makes a HUGE difference in Scott`s game. Alot of the shots he can pull off on a diamond just cannot be played on a gold crown.

 

[actionplayer]

Not biased, just making conversation. Is it NOT a bias/judgement to knock just as much as it is to support?

I don't think I am knocking. I agree he is up there with the best in 1 hole. but because he has a dvd doesn't make him the all time best imo.

similar to when I argued against svb being the greatest player ever to pick up a cue. now I am not saying he isn't a world class player and maybe one day could be but to make that statement I think was ludicrous but I get some egits giving me crap for that kind of statement

I think frost as a similar fan club to svb where feast or famine he will be untouchable

 

[real bartram]

Do you think equipment had anything to do with it, as far as Diamond v. Gold Crown?

Most players today are very familiar with Diamonds, how they bank, et cetera. Well, that's according to my other half, what he says. Diamonds seem to be used more today at events than GCs, so many are more familiar with Diamonds and how they play today.

Players who can adapt to strange equipment the fastest at tournaments, for example, do well. As you know, one never knows what equipment will be utilized as far as cloth speed, rails, hot lights, humidity, all the condition that can affect how a table plays.

Alex has been in combat in all kinds of conditions, which is why I think he may have come out ahead on this match with Scott. A rematch would be interesting to see, but after witnessing Alex in action many times, I wouldn't bet against him -- ever.

Funny thing is that he's never beat Keith in a tournament, each time they played against each other, but he has beat Keith in action. Alex plays all games well, and that's what makes him super strong.

I do bel the real tight table they played on did factor .
And I was just saying Alex beat him cause a guy said Scott is number 1
I don't think there is a clear cut number 1
1 pocket player like there was when efren was in his prime
And I don't believe anyone could play efren even 1 pocket when he was in his prime
Vs anyone else in their prime

 

[JB Cases]

I don't think I am knocking. I agree he is up there with the best in 1 hole. but because he has a dvd doesn't make him the all time best imo.

similar to when I argued against svb being the greatest player ever to pick up a cue. now I am not saying he isn't a world class player and maybe one day could be but to make that statement I think was ludicrous but I get some egits giving me crap for that kind of statement

I think frost as a similar fan club to svb where feast or famine he will be untouchable

I don't think there is any way for a guy to be "the best" until he is clearly beating everyone multiple times. Scott is top 5 in a group of top one pocket players. Any of those guys can win against any of the others on any given day IMO.

Efren however......is the best......at 60 years old....because it takes everything Scott can bring to beat him.....and no one else dares to challenge Efren.....I mean seriously, Efren is 60 and played the finals that started at 11am then stayed at the pool room all day playing pool and chess and cards - then at like midnight he starts a race to 10 with Scott that goes hill/hill down to the last two balls that finishes at like 7am the next day.

I mean say what you will but that takes major balls to jump up and play Scott Frost like that - and Efren led the set pretty good too until Scott came back to tie it up. It was epic but I have to give the nod to Efren here for being so strong in both tournaments and gambling.

This discussion though reminds me of the legendary Don Willis....http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Don_Willis

"Although Willis “never won a major tournament…most of the greats acknowledged gambling losses to the Ohio-born hustler.” Willis very likely could have won tournaments had he chosen to compete, but like many hustlers, he knew he could make more money hustling if he remained unknown. To quote R. A. Dyer, “he feared not defeat…but rather exposure. He wanted no pictures in the paper.” Because Willis did not play in tournaments, his talent was never widely recognized beyond a close circle of friends and family. The little documentation available on Willis tends to mention him chiefly in connection with Luther Lassiter, who said of him, "If I ever had to have someone else shoot pool for my life, win or lose, live or die, the man that I'd have shooting for me is Don Willis."

Once Don did play in a an event and the promoter insisted everyone fill out a bio. Don, not wanting any more recognition refused. The promoter was adamant. So Don said let me see the stack and picked out one of them with a player who listed a bunch of titles. Don scribbled at the top of it, "I beat him".

 

[gxman]

I think Efren had too much pool in one day to play near his best. In the chat during the match with Scott, BigTruck said Efren was at the pool hall for about 17hrs that day.

 

[westcoast]

Absolutely,
Scott walked into that one. Tough (gaff table) that Alex had just played a bunch of hours on. Scott fired and almost made a few banks that he wins from if they go...none did. All of Alex's went. In short bad day for Mr. Frost. I watched all of it. When I saw what table they were playing at I almost screamed through the computer.....NNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!

Tough action. Alex always is.

Nick B

tight table, yes- but gaffe? What was so strange about the table besides being tight?

On a different note, what are the reasons that Frost isn't top notch in rotation games? One would think his way of playing one pocket would transfer to rotation game fairly well.

 

[BelleBelle]

Efren in his prime nobody could play even with him. The man is 60 years old and tired. Still it took frost going hill hill. Not taking anything away from Frost he is a monster one pocket player. Efren in his prime nobody on earth has a chance to win!!

 

[Old Nine Baller]

On a different note, what are the reasons that Frost isn't top notch in rotation games? One would think his way of playing one pocket would transfer to rotation game fairly well.

Frost has no stroke to speak of. He dipsy-doodles his tip all over the place leading to inaccuracies when shooting long shots in rotation games. He can set up shots for videos and impress with his stroke but in games he makes many errors because of it.

He also doesn't have the mentality for rotation games. It's a completely different way of running balls. Sometimes you have to hit balls almost as hard as you can to move the rock 4 inches, or maybe draw the cueball 7 feet or follow 12 feet. These things don't usually come up in one pocket.

P.S. If you told him he had to run them all in one pocket he probably could. He's the best ball runner I've ever seen in one pocket.

ONB

 

[Nick B]

tight table, yes- but gaffe? What was so strange about the table besides being tight?

On a different note, what are the reasons that Frost isn't top notch in rotation games? One would think his way of playing one pocket would transfer to rotation game fairly well.

You've never played on a gaffe table? I remember being in town and hitting balls on that table. The slates seamed to be misaligned and balls would make two or even three moves on the way down. One of the two pockets was noticeably tighter than the other. Table was filthy after all the play and powder use. Scott's a big boy. He played on it and lost. He doesn't need me to make excuses for him. Alex is super tough. Fighters make fights. That day Scott lost. Next time he'll win and everyone will walk him around the village on their shoulders.

Nick

 

[westcoast]

You've never played on a gaffe table? I remember being in town and hitting balls on that table. The slates seamed to be misaligned and balls would make two or even three moves on the way down. One of the two pockets was noticeably tighter than the other. Table was filthy after all the play and powder use. Scott's a big boy. He played on it and lost. He doesn't need me to make excuses for him. Alex is super tough. Fighters make fights. That day Scott lost. Next time he'll win and everyone will walk him around the village on their shoulders.

Nick

I don't know the table they were playing on, that's why I asked if there was more to it than just tightness. I wonder why they decided to play on such a table?

 

[gxman]

Can Scott play Darren Appleton on the Fight Night International challenge for $20K?

 

[Fast Lenny]

You've never played on a gaffe table? I remember being in town and hitting balls on that table. The slates seamed to be misaligned and balls would make two or even three moves on the way down. One of the two pockets was noticeably tighter than the other. Table was filthy after all the play and powder use. Scott's a big boy. He played on it and lost. He doesn't need me to make excuses for him. Alex is super tough. Fighters make fights. That day Scott lost. Next time he'll win and everyone will walk him around the village on their shoulders.

Nick

Actually they probably will make excuses as to why he beat Alex just like people are making excuses to why he beat Efren. Efren used to beat Scott giving weight along with everyone else, since they have played "even" Scott has beat Efren in the past 6 years around 6-7 plays in a row gambling with Efren not winning "even" but I guess Efren was tired each time.

Efren is past his prime as we all know, its still amazing that he does what he does at 60 and in his day no one could beat him as he is the best to ever hold a cue. Efren might win DCC again this year, he is fully capable of winning that event or even the 9 ball again. These last two sets they both played could have went either way just like the set in the tournament could have went either way and Scott might have won the tournament instead.

 

[yobagua]

I don't think Scott is over rated. Its just that the standard is so high. Not only in skill but in natural talent and passion for the game. For Efren to play Scott after a long tournament says a lot about Efrens love of the game. Win or Lose he just loves what he is doing. How many of us can say the same thing. He has chosen his path in life and making the world of it.
For Scott that's still in question. A young man today with talent and energy has options. Can Scott make that kind of commitment to the game? That remains to be seen. All the greats have to come to that conflict at the end of the day. Can I commit to a life style that only maybe 5% of the field can make a decent living?
At the end of the day whenever we talk about pool. Efren's name will be on our lips.
Whenever one pocket is thought about Efren's name will be at the top of the list and all others will be far below his.
Scott could beat Efren the next 10 times for cash but Efren lives forever in our hearts and minds.
I hope Scott eventually gets the recognition he deserves. But he is the master of his fate.

 

[Nick B]

I don't know the table they were playing on, that's why I asked if there was more to it than just tightness. I wonder why they decided to play on such a table?

Probably due to the stream. Best table for set up and viewing.

 

[richiebalto]

Can Scott play Darren Appleton on the Fight Night International challenge for $20K?

Darren better be getting some weight, not just a ball either!

Darren has no shot at beating Scott in 1 pocket, either does Ro Bo stiff, ops Ro Bo Cop!

SVB will be the next player that will challenge Scott in 1 pocket, but I don't think SVB is ready yet .

Scott is the BEST for my money!