Jennette Lee

[Bobby]

Thanks for asking Willie. BIG, BIG difference between the two. There are some "top" players who will NOT gamble without a backer. Names withheld for fear of causing great emotional embarrassment . These players will not risk one dime of their own money under any circumstances. Even if they have thousands in their pocket, you couldn't pry it loose with a crow bar. Do I make my point?

Then their are a few players who prefer to bet their own with no backers (Chris Bartram, Darren Appleton, SVB are three I can think of quickly). That way there is no one looking over your shoulder and no one to explain anything to afterward. I happen to be in this mix. I don't like someone else's cheese riding on my cue, just mine and only mine.

And there are many top players who like having someone take a piece of their action, just to lower their overall risk. This is especially true when the bet gets very high, as it did in the matches JL just played. Usually these "partners" only take a small piece of the action, and often it is done as a favor for a friend who wants to be involved. I have frequently taken a 10% piece of some very big bets (in the tens of thousands). Often times a backer or a player will "lay off" part of their action, just because the risk is higher than they want to take on their own. Same thing that bookies do frequently.

When a player like JL lays off a piece of her action with a friend or "partner", it does not diminish her risk. She (and George of course) is still betting her own for considerable amounts of real money. There is no doubt that betting high for your own money takes significantly more courage than playing with a stake horse putting up all the dough.

Of course, the rewards are greater if you bet your own. You get it all if you win! With a stake horse, a player is lucky to get a third in a big game, and often times it is much less. Smart backers have learned that giving up half to the player is a losing proposition. You have to win two out of three times to break even (on similar sized bets). Not a good percentage.

I always thought it was a third or less to the player if it's on the road but about 50% if it's in his home room or city. I've never let anyone back me, mostly because I really hate to lose someone's money. The only reason I never gambled for very high stakes is because I'd really hate to carry all that money on me and have people know that I have it on me.

Jay, do you know how much Lassiter used to get from his backers? I know he was road partners with Don Willis, but I've also heard he had backers at other times. I would think that he would get 50% because they say he nearly always won for the cash.

 

[watchez]

With pool these days - if you are betting your own and the other person is getting staked, the rumor of a dump will still be there.

If you are part of a corporation, the rumor of a dump will still be there as well.

Also Jay, there are some pool players that won't play even if they are getting staked.

 

[ribdoner]

With pool these days - if you are betting your own and the other person is getting staked, the rumor of a dump will still be there.

If you are part of a corporation, the rumor of a dump will still be there as well.

Also Jay, there are some pool players that won't play even if they are getting staked.

Rare indeed for a player to not like a game if staked....they're keepers

 

[timdog24]

TD,
I will re-post my response from another thread, as I have a minor disagreement with your assessment.

There is a LOT of difference between a "backer" and a "road partner". I'm surprised more people on here haven't made the distinction - the player that backs herself/himself is very admirable in my estimation. There is nothing wrong with having a backer; but I really think it takes a lot of courage to play on your own dime.

Except for a ring game or two at DCC; I am not aware of either GB or JL having a "backer" this century (but hey, maybe this is a new thing for the SBE.....nahh, I doubt it). Road partners are a WHOLE different thing; sharing equally in losses and victories. I hate to contradict T-dog regarding the "backer"; but I'm very skeptical of his assessment as "partners" has been the norm for the past few months as most are aware.

I wonder how many of the critics/skeptics gamble this large on their own dollar......few I think. Remember to include the road partner/partners' performance when tallying up the figures if that is your desire. To demean someones performance by "supposing" that a backer is present is cheap in my view. I think it takes incredible heart to put up your own cash and gamble with players like Fargo, Bergman, Chavez, etc.....spots be damned, I just about hurled the only time I played for $500. To have a partner takes nothing away from such accomplishments in my opinion, to have a backer takes away a LOT of the pressure.

Maybe Jay Helfert will chime in with his opinion on "backer" vs. "partner" as regards pressure on the player.

You are probably right on the backer/partner situation. In the first session I saw one guy controlling the $, raising the bet considerably when it got even, racking the balls for her, studying the racks of her opponent, etc. so I assumed she was getting staked by him. But, the 2nd session, it looked like she was betting her own for sure. Sorry for the miss info.
I play a little myself and definitely understand the difference between backer and partners. I'm from New York, the home of corporation betting.

 

[jay helfert]

I always thought it was a third or less to the player if it's on the road but about 50% if it's in his home room or city. I've never let anyone back me, mostly because I really hate to lose someone's money. The only reason I never gambled for very high stakes is because I'd really hate to carry all that money on me and have people know that I have it on me.

Jay, do you know how much Lassiter used to get from his backers? I know he was road partners with Don Willis, but I've also heard he had backers at other times. I would think that he would get 50% because they say he nearly always won for the cash.

Luther usually had a partner and together they put up all the money. Don Willis and Earl Shriver were two of his road partners that I know of. Lassiter didn't need or ask for backers. He wanted to win it all himself. I'm sure he he felt like he was the best player when he got in the box, and he usually (99% of the time) was. A bad game for him was one where he didn't bust his opponent. If they escaped with any money, it was a miracle. Lassiter took them all the way. He was not one to quit winners, and no bet bothered him. In fact the bigger the bet, the more he liked it. He was making multi thousand dollar scores in the 40's and 50's. His reputation was as a long player who would stick with a guy until he said quit.

 

[JAM]

Also Jay, there are some pool players that won't play even if they are getting staked.

Some people realize there's more to life than pool. Good for them!

When the dust settles after the action and everybody goes home to their loved ones and the security of their homesteads, nobody remembers the action man. In fact, he/she is usually subjet of ridicule on pool forums for being, God forbid, a "pool player."

Yet, without the so-called "action man," there wouldn't be much discussion for some members of this forum.

 

[JAM]

TD,
I will re-post my response from another thread, as I have a minor disagreement with your assessment.

There is a LOT of difference between a "backer" and a "road partner". I'm surprised more people on here haven't made the distinction - the player that backs herself/himself is very admirable in my estimation. There is nothing wrong with having a backer; but I really think it takes a lot of courage to play on your own dime.

Except for a ring game or two at DCC; I am not aware of either GB or JL having a "backer" this century (but hey, maybe this is a new thing for the SBE.....nahh, I doubt it). Road partners are a WHOLE different thing; sharing equally in losses and victories. I hate to contradict T-dog regarding the "backer"; but I'm very skeptical of his assessment as "partners" has been the norm for the past few months as most are aware.

I wonder how many of the critics/skeptics gamble this large on their own dollar......few I think. Remember to include the road partner/partners' performance when tallying up the figures if that is your desire. To demean someones performance by "supposing" that a backer is present is cheap in my view. I think it takes incredible heart to put up your own cash and gamble with players like Fargo, Bergman, Chavez, etc.....spots be damned, I just about hurled the only time I played for $500. To have a partner takes nothing away from such accomplishments in my opinion, to have a backer takes away a LOT of the pressure.

It sucks when somebody you care about is the subject matter of untrue threads on this forum, ESPECIALLY when the posts written about them may only be based on rumors.

Nobody can ever take away Jeanette Lee's celebrity in pool. She wears it proudly, and most who have ever seen her in person realize she's first class all the way. :smile:

 

[maha]

you make money by getting good games and betting as high as they want, and not sharing your winnings. your opponents dog it for the cash if they are playing their own. if not have a better game and play for less and win more games.
when you are known to bet high and have alot of gamble the easy money chases you as they are tired of being locked up, and ultimately find themselves in worse shape.

 

[jay helfert]

Some people realize there's more to life than pool. Good for them!

When the dust settles after the action and everybody goes home to their loved ones and the security of their homesteads, nobody remembers the action man. In fact, he/she is usually subjet of ridicule on pool forums for being, God forbid, a "pool player."

Yet, without the so-called "action man," there wouldn't be much discussion for some members of this forum.

I like you Jam but why so touchy. You may not realize how highly revered Keith is in the pool world. Just because a few ignorant people had something negative to say doesn't mean he isn't popular on this forum or any other pool forum for that matter. I would go so far to say he is one of the most popular players of his generation. Just like Alex is today.

I find that there are many knowledgeable posters on here and greatly prefer it to any other pool forum. I have known Keith for many years and never known him to be bothered by any "knockers". He always had a quick comeback for anyone who tried knocking him, something to the effect of "Get your ass up here and see if you like it." :thumbup:

I hope he plays again before he gets too old to be a factor. Like it or not, Keith is a POOL PLAYER, and that is what he will be remembered for.

 

[Deadon]

Jay, your right on. Keiths legacy is his play and persona, and it would be great to see it continue.

 

[JAM]

I like you Jam but why so touchy. You may not realize how highly revered Keith is in the pool world. Just because a few ignorant people had something negative to say doesn't mean he isn't popular on this forum or any other pool forum for that matter. I would go so far to say he is one of the most popular players of his generation. Just like Alex is today.

I find that there are many knowledgeable posters on here and greatly prefer it to any other pool forum. I have known Keith for many years and never known him to be bothered by any "knockers". He always had a quick comeback for anyone who tried knocking him, something to the effect of "Get your ass up here and see if you like it." :thumbup:

I hope he plays again before he gets too old to be a factor. Like it or not, Keith is a POOL PLAYER, and that is what he will be remembered for.

Thanks for sharing your thoughts, Jay. I understand your feelings. I have some too.

 

[DelaWho???]

I like you Jam but why so touchy. You may not realize how highly revered Keith is in the pool world. Just because a few ignorant people had something negative to say doesn't mean he isn't popular on this forum or any other pool forum for that matter. I would go so far to say he is one of the most popular players of his generation. Just like Alex is today.

I find that there are many knowledgeable posters on here and greatly prefer it to any other pool forum. I have known Keith for many years and never known him to be bothered by any "knockers". He always had a quick comeback for anyone who tried knocking him, something to the effect of "Get your ass up here and see if you like it." :thumbup:

I hope he plays again before he gets too old to be a factor. Like it or not, Keith is a POOL PLAYER, and that is what he will be remembered for.

He was a pleasure to watch during the short lived IPT even though he didn't fare as well as he could have.

 

[JAM]

He was a pleasure to watch during the short lived IPT even though he didn't fare as well as he could have.

And there's a reason for that. He's much healthier today, than he was when he was attending the IPT events.

Surely you've heard of the "white men can't jump" phrase? Well, dead men can't play pool.

Thanks for the kind words.

 

[JAM]

Back to the topic of the thread.

Isn't Jeanette Lee beautiful? Here's a cute shot taken at Turning Stone Casino, the first time she competed there.

Every time she went to play a match, the crowd surrounded her table. She really knows how to work a crowd. Actually, she beat some tough players in that event too.

 

[metallicane]

Back to the topic of the thread.

Isn't Jeanette Lee beautiful? Here's a cute shot taken at Turning Stone Casino, the first time she competed there.

Every time she went to play a match, the crowd surrounded her table. She really knows how to work a crowd. Actually, she beat some tough players in that event too.

Yes she is beautiful and Keith is well Keith. I would love to see him playing again like everyone else, but I would rather see him healthy.

 

[watchez]

Thanks for asking Willie. BIG, BIG difference between the two. There are some "top" players who will NOT gamble without a backer. Names withheld for fear of causing great emotional embarrassment . These players will not risk one dime of their own money under any circumstances. Even if they have thousands in their pocket, you couldn't pry it loose with a crow bar. Do I make my point?

Then their are a few players who prefer to bet their own with no backers (Chris Bartram, Darren Appleton, SVB are three I can think of quickly). That way there is no one looking over your shoulder and no one to explain anything to afterward. I happen to be in this mix. I don't like someone else's cheese riding on my cue, just mine and only mine.

And there are many top players who like having someone take a piece of their action, just to lower their overall risk. This is especially true when the bet gets very high, as it did in the matches JL just played. Usually these "partners" only take a small piece of the action, and often it is done as a favor for a friend who wants to be involved. I have frequently taken a 10% piece of some very big bets (in the tens of thousands). Often times a backer or a player will "lay off" part of their action, just because the risk is higher than they want to take on their own. Same thing that bookies do frequently.

When a player like JL lays off a piece of her action with a friend or "partner", it does not diminish her risk. She (and George of course) is still betting her own for considerable amounts of real money. There is no doubt that betting high for your own money takes significantly more courage than playing with a stake horse putting up all the dough.

Of course, the rewards are greater if you bet your own. You get it all if you win! With a stake horse, a player is lucky to get a third in a big game, and often times it is much less. Smart backers have learned that giving up half to the player is a losing proposition. You have to win two out of three times to break even (on similar sized bets). Not a good percentage.

Having multiple partners on the road is safer too. If you are going to a spot and know that you are going to be able to bet a large number, it is a good idea.

 

[Robroy]

When I would play in local events...I was a very short stop at best.
I have all the local champs to thank for sparing with me. They made a Champ out of me...all kudos go to the short stops...
Trust me the women know their game...I sure did!

But I have to admit; as soon as I did win a match from the local’s stars...it felt as great as snapping off a big event!
And it also gave me the ability I needed to WIN the Big Money on tour.

I will always love the pool players...I love watching the ones that have the "Eye of the Tiger". It brings back Awesome memories for me.

 

[The Saw]

His reputation was as a long player who would stick with a guy until he said quit.

That's the way it should be.....

 

[watchez]

Oh and for people's information - I believe Tommy Kennedy, due to his religious beliefs, is a player that would not play even if he was staked. At least this is what I have been told.

 

[Ken_4fun]

I like you Jam but why so touchy. You may not realize how highly revered Keith is in the pool world. Just because a few ignorant people had something negative to say doesn't mean he isn't popular on this forum or any other pool forum for that matter. I would go so far to say he is one of the most popular players of his generation. Just like Alex is today.

I find that there are many knowledgeable posters on here and greatly prefer it to any other pool forum. I have known Keith for many years and never known him to be bothered by any "knockers". He always had a quick comeback for anyone who tried knocking him, something to the effect of "Get your ass up here and see if you like it." :thumbup:

I hope he plays again before he gets too old to be a factor. Like it or not, Keith is a POOL PLAYER, and that is what he will be remembered for.

Tap, Tap, Tap.....

There was a line in the movie, Visionquest, when a cook talks about watching Pele play soccer, and he says that it lifts humanity up that a guy can play like that. Only time that I watched a movie that had nothing to do with pool, that spoke with passion, the same passion we have towards pool.

Seriously, JAM, its the same with Keith, Matlock, Efren, Earl and others on the pool table. You have said that we are wanting Keith to play "watching a entertainer dance" or something along those lines.

Im just like the cook, watching Pele play soccer.

Ken