Pros today vs the pros yesterday

[ShootingArts]

I would not even argue about you charging me $5 lol. I’m still new enough I might sail one once a month. If I’m using my own cue ball could I pay half? (On the break)

I guess half your cue ball would work. That white phenolic should come in handy around a cue shop.

Five dollars a month would be no burden, especially if it was put to good use after you pay your fine. I have seen people that would be paying fifty dollars or more a session. I figure that would get their attention!

Hu

 

[justnum]

A technology forecast predicts billiards will develop new products.

Would a heavier or lighter cue ball make template rack breaks more consistent?

Achieving a golden break consistency, matches bowling standard of a strike.

Pros of the future will be monsters. Placing the demands on all billiard games is the new standard. Get out there and support rooms and tables.

 

[FunChamp]

100% agree. MMA cost boxing in a huge way

Boxing cost boxing. Decades of corrupt judges and promoters. Fighters ducking other top talent. Look at the numbers. Anytime a real fight evolves that the fans want to see, the PPV numbers blow MMA right out the water. Boxing could absolutely crush MMA into oblivion if they would pull their heads out their butts. Unfortunately they won't and probably never will and it's boxings fault that it's where it's at.

 

[jtompilot]

I think Shoot Out vs Shoot to Hit changed the game considerably. There were some Shoot Out Players who played that game so well that they would dominate today......at least in the rotation games. Toby was second to none including Buddy and others playing Shoot Out Nine Ball. My point here is we think that the ball striking today is better? Maybe maybe not. One of the earlier threads talked about Buddy Hall's position play and that is so true. IMO no one played position like the "Rifleman" could. So where does that leave us? Actually this is the conundrum that we cueists have faced forever and will continue to face. Are today's players better than yesteryears players? One thing is for sure.......There are more good players internationally than ever before and that is for all the cue games.

Talking about Buddy, there was a 1P match at the US Open in Kalamazoo between Buddy and Scott Frost around 1998. Scott broke and left a ball in front of his hole and the CB behind the stack. Somehow Buddy softly kicked and left the CB between the pocket and Scott's ball. Scott got the CB back to the other side of the stack. Again, Buddy kicked and again left the CB between the pocket and Scott's ball. I overheard Scott tell a friend of his that he can't believe Buddy beat him.

 

[23DenaliBDE]

Boxing cost boxing. Decades of corrupt judges and promoters. Fighters ducking other top talent. Look at the numbers. Anytime a real fight evolves that the fans want to see, the PPV numbers blow MMA right out the water. Boxing could absolutely crush MMA into oblivion if they would pull their heads out their butts. Unfortunately they won't and probably never will and it's boxings fault that it's where it's at.

PPV does not tell the whole story. It leaves out UFCs 5 year streaming deal in 2019 worth 1.5B and 2022 UFC made more money than every other MMA and boxing promotion combined

 

[ShootingArts]

Boxing cost boxing. Decades of corrupt judges and promoters. Fighters ducking other top talent. Look at the numbers. Anytime a real fight evolves that the fans want to see, the PPV numbers blow MMA right out the water. Boxing could absolutely crush MMA into oblivion if they would pull their heads out their butts. Unfortunately they won't and probably never will and it's boxings fault that it's where it's at.

I like the way you think. Unfortunately fans like blood and blood sports. Boxing was banned from TV in the late fifties or early sixties, it was too bloody and violent. The mob likes it's blood and gore though. MMA of today seems far bloodier than boxing of the fifties watched in black and white and I have to say that is what audiences like. I think if boxers used a very similar glove to the MMA boxing would be much more popular, not that fourteen sanctioning bodies hasn't hurt it.

Talking about Buddy, there was a 1P match at the US Open in Kalamazoo between Buddy and Scott Frost around 1998. Scott broke and left a ball in front of his hole and the CB behind the stack. Somehow Buddy softly kicked and left the CB between the pocket and Scott's ball. Scott got the CB back to the other side of the stack. Again, Buddy kicked and again left the CB between the pocket and Scott's ball. I overheard Scott tell a friend of his that he can't believe Buddy beat him.

I suspect Scott was still suffering from shellshock when he said that.

Hu

 

[23DenaliBDE]

I like the way you think. Unfortunately fans like blood and blood sports. Boxing was banned from TV in the late fifties or early sixties, it was too bloody and violent. The mob likes it's blood and gore though. MMA of today seems far bloodier than boxing of the fifties watched in black and white and I have to say that is what audiences like. I think if boxers used a very similar glove to the MMA boxing would be much more popular, not that fourteen sanctioning bodies hasn't hurt it.




I suspect Scott was still suffering from shellshock when he said that.

Hu

People like MMA because it actually requires more strategy and ability. BJJ is an amazing thing

 

[JPB2]

The post was but I am no opponent of jump cues.
Does that mean the poster does not mind jump cues?
I think jumping should not be allowed at any time.

Yes, it means I don't mind them. I guess I should clarify. I am not against them in games with ball in hand for any foul, which was not the traditional way to play. 8-9-10 ball played by those rules. Jump cues in one pocket no way. Straight pool no. I am fine with jumping with a regular cue in straight pool or one pocket as the rules have always allowed. It doesn't really come up much and most can't do it well enough to justify the risk.

 

[FunChamp]

PPV does not tell the whole story. It leaves out UFCs 5 year streaming deal in 2019 worth 1.5B and 2022 UFC made more money than every other MMA and boxing promotion combined

This doesn't harken to popularity as it does better organization. Boxing has ten different sanctioning bodies, belts, 650 weight classes, 200 separate promotional bodies. Fans get tired of crooked judges awarding the fight to the promotions meal ticket. Champions only fighting once a year or longer. It's a mess. There hasn't been a dominant, great heavyweight since Lennox Lewis.
If they would fix all those issues then boxing would again reign supreme. MMA is great and all and is not going anywhere. But if boxing would be run the way it should be, there would be no comparison.

 

[Rimfirejunkie]

Not my comment but there are people like me who would be happy if there were no jump cues. There are people that go a bit further and hate them actively

Fedor made me hate them. It went from novelty to annoyance. I’d never watch pool again if that was the norm.

 

[j2pac]

Caras and Mosconi?
Doubt it. They had flawed mechanics.
Sigel's fidgety style wouldn't work with the shot clock.

Is there a current player that banks like Eddie Taylor?

 

[sjm]

Is there a current player that banks like Eddie Taylor?

Probably yes. As Freddie the Beard once observed, Eddie Taylor would have had his hands full in the bank pool ring game. Guys like Skyler and Billy would have given Eddie all he could handle, and let's not forget that the tables are tighter today than they were in Eddie Taylor's day. Bank pool is a difficult proposition on tight equipment. At the game of nine ball banks, I think Brumback may be the best ever.

That said, Eddie probably could have beaten them all at full rack banks.

 

[Baby Huey]

I think some breakthrough players come along that do impact cue sports and set a new standard. For me its One Pocket. Ronnie Allen set a new standard of play in the 60's and early 70's. Things kinda stayed the same in terms of skills until Alex Pagualyan came along in the last decade. His current skill set is recognized as TOP SHELF. So not to disparage any other great players but it took Hoppe in 3C then Cuelemans then Blomdahl to see the marked improvement in skills. In the 3C case those were about three generations. In the rotation games the skills are more blurred. So many great players both American and then Philippines, Euros and now International players that no one is really the "Best." So until someone comes along that sets a new rotation game standard I think it's be shared by a dozen or so players for the foreseeable future.

 

[FunChamp]

I agree with baby huey. When it comes to 9 ball and 10 ball, take the top 15 and flip a coin. One pocket you have about 5 that really separate themselves. Bar table 8 ball.....stay away from Corey Deuel.

 

[Jaden]

From watching videos for decades now ( and tournaments) , it is undeniable the pros today are just insanely straight shooters.
The pockets in the Spanish Open were tiny and I saw these monsters shoot long shots like nothing.
The pros today shoot straighter than their former peers as a group.

That's kind of funny. Watching the world cup of pool and watching a recently released 20 year old match of dennis Hatch and Nick Varner, I was thinking the EXACT opposite...

Jaden

 

[Bigkat]

I believe it is EVEN no matter how you slice it. Because, everything is ON SCALE . If you take the top players from the past, at their peak, with the information and technology that was available, at that time, they are easily on par with top players today with the YouTube, cell phones video and coaching available today. IT'S EVEN!!

 

[j2pac]

I believe it is EVEN no matter how you slice it. Because, everything is ON SCALE . If you take the top players from the past, at their peak, with the information and technology that was available, at that time, they are easily on par with top players today with the YouTube, cell phones video and coaching available today. IT'S EVEN!!

I would tend to agree. As with any sport, comparing players from different eras is difficult at best.

 

[WardS]

yup theyre soo good they make the game unwatchable. everything and everyone looks acts shoots dresses the same.

Amen

 

[WardS]

My thoughts are that there certainly are many more "top" players today than prior years. Some of the reasons for this are obvious- the training that occurs from an early age to insure stroke delivery mechanics that, when they become almost 100% repeatable, result in much more consistent high level play on even very demanding equipment. The availability of proper pool training , the internet, the use of the video, all have resulted in many more players that do things "right" on the pool table very consistently - much more so than years ago.

How many of us older guys here WISH that, with our love of the game, we had the same available pool instruction back in the 60s and 70s - I have spent the last two years, finally having the time in retirement, completely breaking my game down and rebuilding it according to "modern" pool teaching techniques- even at my advanced age I have improved at least 30% from a low B to a mid A- the internet and the video replay have been great saviors!

Mosconi had great natural talent - a stroke that moved the cue ball where he wanted it, tremendous final focus ability, and a mind that put winning ( executing under pressure) above all else in life. His dedication to the game allowed him to perform at the highest levels in each of these categories EVERY TIME HE PLAYED.

It takes a lot more than great mechanics to be a great player and a champion in any sport or game. However, more of today's pool pros do certainly exhibit the highest level of repeatable consistency in their game BECAUSE of their adherence to proper pool mechanics- that is the difference in my opinion.

Mosconi was 15 time world straight pool champion. I would like his chances today against anybody.

 

[bbb]

I agree with baby huey. When it comes to 9 ball and 10 ball, take the top 15 and flip a coin. One pocket you have about 5 that really separate themselves. Bar table 8 ball.....stay away from Corey Deuel.

Bar table anything
stay away from dave matlock
JMHO