Pulling up in the middle of a set when score is tied

woody_968 said:
He was not being sharked or cheated. He made a game and halfway through the set new he made a bad one.

I think 1on1pooltourneys may be right, I was thinking the same thing. I think Dennis may have been desperate and tried the move to see what would happen.
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I was responding to the original post and thought it was a generic question. She didn't make it clear in her op it was an actual situation.

There is a simple solution - follow Tom Ferry's rules for gambling one of which was to establish the rules of the game ahead of time. But whatever you do, don't listen to the old road player's advice and just start playing without any rules and see what happens because that makes for far more entertaining internet reading.

What should have happened is simply a matter of opinion. What did happen is Orcollo pulled out when the game was tied and the other guy agreed to take a $150 dollar buyout. Once he took the buyout that is the end of it.

Speaking of what should happen, is all the money won and lost gambling in pool halls being meticulously documented and reported to the IRS? Of course not. The rules appear to be quite flexible.
 
uwate said:
Your out of line. The game WAS on the level. Rob had to beat the 10ball ghost to win this game. Orcullo didnt think he could but he was wrong. Orcullo matched up bad. End of story. Hardly a "charade" when one player has to beat the ten ball ghost to win.
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Not to pick nits, but this game is a ball or two easier than the 10-ball ghost. Especially for someone of Rob's skill and knowledge.

As far as the game being on the level, I agree wholeheartedly.

Aaron
 
uwate said:
Your out of line. The game WAS on the level. Rob had to beat the 10ball ghost to win this game. Orcullo didnt think he could but he was wrong. Orcullo matched up bad. End of story. Hardly a "charade" when one player has to beat the ten ball ghost to win.
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He didn't have to beat the ghost. He could play safe.

But, agreed that Orcullo pulling up was BS. Not that I have any skin in the debate.
 
yep

uwate said:
Your out of line. The game WAS on the level. Rob had to beat the 10ball ghost to win this game. Orcullo didnt think he could but he was wrong. Orcullo matched up bad. End of story. Hardly a "charade" when one player has to beat the ten ball ghost to win.
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Thank you !

maybe creedo and btown are in the minority here, but i respect them for riding it out.

bighurt: you must have a great game to be able to get the nuts aginst DO. As others stated his mind was probably not right after losing in the casino. If you could condense your thoughts in your posts I would appreciate it. TMI in some posts.

And to say the thread is a dead horse, maybe so. I did enjoy the whole thing thoroughly.

To answer the question in post #1. Yes, it is ok to pull up, as long as you don't mind a 17 page thread about it on AZ. It is also ok if you are from PI. Also ok if you are in a bad game.

Not ok if your opponent says, "Say hello to my little friend".
 
uwate said:
Your out of line. The game WAS on the level. Rob had to beat the 10ball ghost to win this game. Orcullo didnt think he could but he was wrong. Orcullo matched up bad. End of story. Hardly a "charade" when one player has to beat the ten ball ghost to win.
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I guess we have different definitions "on the level".
To me, "on the level" is someone looking to gamble and making a game where the outcome is not known.
Rob said plain and simple "the money was lost as soon as it was posted"
and that he was laying down just to keep it close.

If that still meets your definition of "on the level" then probably no point in me trying to convince you otherwise.

To me it's funny that the pool world is so in love with the idea of hustling, that the victim of a scam is expected to sit still and let it happen.
Like if I'm about to pay for a diamond and someone informs me it's cubic zirconia,
I should just pay up anyway.
 
CreeDo said:
I guess we have different definitions "on the level".
To me, "on the level" is someone looking to gamble and making a game where the outcome is not known.
Rob said plain and simple "the money was lost as soon as it was posted"
and that he was laying down just to keep it close.

If that still meets your definition of "on the level" then probably no point in me trying to convince you otherwise.

To me it's funny that the pool world is so in love with the idea of hustling, that the victim of a scam is expected to sit still and let it happen.
Like if I'm about to pay for a diamond and someone informs me it's cubic zirconia,
I should just pay up anyway.
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You might want to refer to post # 151 of this thread as you holier than thou guys seemed to skip over in your defense of Dennis. Dennis by his own admittance dressed up in school uniforms to hustle the rich private school kids!! LMFAO He hustled kids and I get the nuts on the same guy who now is the best player on planet earth and Im the bad guy.. LMFAO
 
thebighurt said:
You might want to refer to post # 151 of this thread as you holier than thou guys seemed to skip over in your defense of Dennis. Dennis by his own admittance dressed up in school uniforms to hustle the rich private school kids!! LMFAO He hustled kids and I get the nuts on the same guy who now is the best player on planet earth and Im the bad guy.. LMFAO
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That is what I refer to as de-railing a thread. This thread is about what happened in this instance. I saw the video and didn't see Dennis in a school uniform. You are in the right in the discussions of what transpired in the action room at Tunica.

You were the unknown in the action room, everyone know who Dennis was.
There was a negotiation on a game (no hustling from either side) and you got the best of the negotiation.

Let the thread speak to that. Now what Jay wears on his head, who Dennis played elsewhere, how fat guys can't play, etc.
 
Diamond69 said:
You were the unknown in the action room, everyone know who Dennis was.
There was a negotiation on a game (no hustling from either side) and you got the best of the negotiation.

.
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agree -- yup... one guy did a great job negotiation before the game... and the other guy did a great job of "negotiation" at 8/8 to save $$$...

the discussion of good guy / bad guy or "code" or "ethics" is all BS... the man was in a stone cold trap.. and got out of the net for 15%...

and last night he was playing SVB 1 pkt for 1K (he lost last night but looks like he can still find action regardless of the discussion here)...
 
thebighurt said:
You might want to refer to post # 151 of this thread as you holier than thou guys seemed to skip over in your defense of Dennis. Dennis by his own admittance dressed up in school uniforms to hustle the rich private school kids!! LMFAO He hustled kids and I get the nuts on the same guy who now is the best player on planet earth and Im the bad guy.. LMFAO
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And my reaction to him hustling school kids would be the same as my reaction to you hustling him.

Why do people think "nobody's perfect" is a good excuse to do something sleazy?
 
CreeDo said:
And my reaction to him hustling school kids would be the same as my reaction to you hustling him.

Why do people think "nobody's perfect" is a good excuse to do something sleazy?
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It is a long standing tradition in pool to try and do things to give yourself an edge.

Everything from disguising oneself, to playing low speed, to how one negotiates a spot, etc.

It goes back a long, long time.

Color of Money and The Hustler were all about it.

Mark Twain wrote on the subject and lived a little bit of it.

Sleazy? maybe sometimes.

Clever? Usually

It's part of our sport's history.

I find it to be intriguing.

Rob Melrose did *nothing* wrong, imo.

best,
brian kc
 
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CreeDo said:
And my reaction to him hustling school kids would be the same as my reaction to you hustling him.

Why do people think "nobody's perfect" is a good excuse to do something sleazy?
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IIRC CreeDo, you choose not to gamble. Perhaps you haven't been exposed to what's going on in gambling at higher levels. I agree with you, the sleazy part of matching up and playing is... well sleazy and disturbing at times. The more I have learned about some of the sleazy practices - laying a lemon, dressing like a school kid, dumping, etc, etc, etc - I have chosen to not further my desire to gamble beyond very trusted people.

We don't have to like, but it exists. Anyone that is deep into pool has to either deal with it, or step away from it. It's too far gone for us to save it anytime soon my friend.
 
woody_968 said:
He was not being sharked or cheated. He made a game and halfway through the set new he made a bad one.

I think 1on1pooltourneys may be right, I was thinking the same thing. I think Dennis may have been desperate and tried the move to see what would happen.
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Yea like the old..."THAT BALL MOVED!" trick!! :eek:
 
CreeDo said:
And my reaction to him hustling school kids would be the same as my reaction to you hustling him.

Why do people think "nobody's perfect" is a good excuse to do something sleazy?
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If you are meaning that Rob did something sleazy by asking for this game and getting it, well you my friend have no idea what matching up is all about, it sure isnt about to give your opponent the best of the game.

Thats why matching up in pool today takes so long to get the game started, because both sides want the edge (best of it).

Years ago most all good players played even, so matching up then wasnt as hard as it is today,
,
.TODAY EVERYBODY WANTS THE BEST OF IT!

And if you can get the best of the game, then you did your part in the matching up part of it!
 
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