Should the live streamer have stopped filming Billy's match when the verbal back-and-forth began?

[NorthernArbiter]

The live streamer comments.... Aka "Just doing my job.". Spoken like a true champion who volunteered for the Stanley Milgram experiments on obedience to authority

 

[NorthernArbiter]

I do not own a room/club/bar but if i did it would be old-school video-free. I would respect both mine and my player's privacy. To paraphrase a lil' city out in the desert, "What happens in the poolroom stays in the poolroom." Everybody with a phone is the media these days and they'll do ANYTHING to get some 'likes'.

As a pool room owner, you have legal responsibilities... Most importantly, not to over serve patrons.

 

[trob]

Thank you for sharing your thoughts. I appreciate you taking the time. The live streamer wrote this on Facebook:
Well since everyone seems to be jacking my s*** and posting it all over the place without my permission and the video is already out there anyway what's the difference?

I might as well release the full unedited clips of the entire match people are taking some of this out of context so at least people can get the full picture.

What you fail to grasp is that this is reality in a pool room at times it doesn't matter who was playing really it doesn't change the fact that this was reality. Okay there's a lot of things that you can come up with that are taking place during that match because you can hear the audio and you can see what's going on. It was late night it was in a pool room there was alcohol involved it's not my judgment to count people's drinks I wasn't paying attention to that really. Two top players were gambling somebody's winning somebody's losing somebody raises the bet. I mean this is a very typical situation that happens on a daily basis. The s*** talking that occurred the violent activity that occurred, I mean things like that happen surely not as common. I dont interfere in the game usually I barely even talk to the players.

However what you don't see is because the people that jacked my video you don't show you even shortly after that fact that the mood in the room changed and the players became more friendly with each other you don't see that because people just edited out the bad s***. Frankly if the players were so disturbed with the situation they would have just stopped playing.
I stuck around until they got even for the first time and it must have been like 5:00 in the morning when I left and before I left I said well I'll leave the stream on so you guys can watch the rest of the match I got to get some sleep to get up for the tournament.
It was recorded to my platform originally anyway. It was initially somewhat blocked for audio copyright violations on it anyway then I just took it down because at the moment I was asked too and because the whole thing was sloppy as it is I had three matches in one file.
I'm further disappointed in some of the responses from people that are personally attacking me and
calling me scummy and the fact that I should I should have stopped the broadcast I should have done this I should have done that. I've got some hard reality for you. I am nobody's babysitter. I'm a part of this Billiards lifestyle as I promote, put on the marketing and network with players and ultimately when it comes down to the actual event I provide the media for the event as well.
Until you get out of your home studios in your basements and actually drive 1500 miles to do an event sleep in your car and eat out of a gas station or bum a room off a player or vice versa just to make 500 dollars you don't know what it's like so don't judge me. I have to grind it this just as much as the players have to grind at this I have much respect for the players and I would like to hope to think that I have their respect although in my encounters it's not always that way.
I've been doing this for 11 years plus now a true pioneer and I work my ass off for my art. I consider this more art than anything because you have no idea what it takes to make a living exclusively from broadcasting pool as far as I know I'm probably the only one doing it full time exclusively. So it's not really my job to explain to you a business model how it works to do this and even if I did you wouldn't do it anyway because you don't want to do the 1500 Mile drives anyway. That is just the reality of it and at the end of the day I did what I do any other day that I produce and broadcast matches. I was just doing my job and I'll be damned if someone's just going to steal my content and post it around. I will clean this post up later cuz I'm busy driving 700 miles halfway through a snowstorm to get home. I'm one of the realest mothers out here alive I promise you that.

I now understand why some players refuse to be live streamed.

Jam pool wants to be big time ? And nit have people watch? If billy wants to be a pro and in the public eye then he needs to carry himself as such. This is 100% on him. Not the guy with the camera.

 

[JAM]

It seems some folks have a hard time understanding the poll. NOWHERE is there any mention of the altercation being the live streamer's fault. NOWHERE! I repeat: NOWHERE in this poll is blame being placed on the live streamer.

If you understand the above sentence thoroughly, then you may understand the poll question: Should the live streamer turned off the camera when the altercation occurred?

NOWHERE -- I repeat -- NOWHERE is this poll saying the live streamer is at fault. The poll addresses the obligation of the live streamer, if there is one, to the players or to the viewers.

Again, I would really love to learn what Big Truck thinks about this. I already know what Upstate Al thinks, and Upstate Al agrees with me that the live streamer should have turned off the cameras.

Pool is not NFL, golf, tennis, baseball, or NBA. There is no other sport where professional sports people compete with the average Joe and mingle with them before, during, and after the competitions like there is in pool. We are a unique culture in that regard. The live streamer asks pool players if they would permit the live streamer to film them. The pool players, in most instances, get not one penny from that live streamer, not a cent, unlike Accu-Stats who not only pays the players, but continues to pay royalties to a player decades later. I think the live streamer should have had a little integrity and protected the players who agreed to let him film them.

Again, NOWHERE in this poll is anyone saying the live streamer is at fault. Not sure why some forum members cannot understand this. They seem to harp back on everybody is blaming the live streamer. Well, I am not blaming the live streamer.

Yes, I want pool to flourish in America and around the world, but I do not think a live streamer whose income is based on the backs of players dancing like monkeys for them, free in most cases, should tarnish their reputation by filming them when they are drunk or at their worst.

Again, pool is not NFL, golf, tennis, baseball, or NBA. We are all members of the Tribal Nation of Pool, but as always, pool is cruel to its own, especially in America. Railbirds are result pickers when it comes to who's the best and like to ridicule and rip apart pool players sometimes, but when the tournament happens, these same railbirds asking for a photo opp or an autograph of the pool player. I could write a dissertation on this subject alone based on my experiences.

Billy is young and will definitely learn from this experience. The way social media has taken off, I think all sponsored pool players will be careful about their demeanor in public, which is a good thing. In this regard, there are lessons learned from this. Billy and his entire family are pretty cool pool people, and thank goodness they are receiving support from the pool public in a good way right now. Nobody is saying Cuetec was wrong, but most everybody is saying they still want to root for Billy Thorpe in the future.

 

[The_JV]

This wouldn’t even be a big deal except Billy used the F homosexual slur. If he had done everything else exactly the same I don’t think there would have been any professional repercussions. There is plenty of predecnce caught on video amongst pros to show this, and more with no video, but everyone in pool knows about.

What stood out to me was the duration of the rant, the heavily repeated use of slurs, ....and of course the physical altercation. Someone slipping with a slur doesn't blip my radar. Still not appropriate but that's life, grow some skin. Billy's rage combined with the open threat of violence is what made this whole thing not sit well with me.

Interesting thought though... if there was no sound, what's Billy fate then...? Viewing the recording again without sound does tame the magnitude of the event down considerably. So maybe the trick here wasn't so much ending the stream, but just killing the sound once the streamer determined he/she wasn't going to man the controls anymore for the evening...?

 

[iusedtoberich]

It seems some folks have a hard time understanding the poll. NOWHERE is there any mention of the altercation being the live streamer's fault. NOWHERE! I repeat: NOWHERE in this poll is blame being placed on the live streamer.

If you understand the above sentence thoroughly, then you may understand the poll question: Should the live streamer turned off the camera when the altercation occurred?

NOWHERE -- I repeat -- NOWHERE is this poll saying the live streamer is at fault. The poll addresses the obligation of the live streamer, if there is one, to the players or to the viewers.

Again, I would really love to learn what Big Truck thinks about this. I already know what Upstate Al thinks, and Upstate Al agrees with me that the live streamer should have turned off the cameras.

Pool is not NFL, golf, tennis, baseball, or NBA. There is no other sport where professional sports people compete with the average Joe and mingle with them before, during, and after the competitions like there is in pool. We are a unique culture in that regard. The live streamer asks pool players if they would permit the live streamer to film them. The pool players, in most instances, get not one penny from that live streamer, not a cent, unlike Accu-Stats who not only pays the players, but continues to pay royalties to a player decades later. I think the live streamer should have had a little integrity and protected the players who agreed to let him film them.

Again, NOWHERE in this poll is anyone saying the live streamer is at fault. Not sure why some forum members cannot understand this. They seem to harp back on everybody is blaming the live streamer. Well, I am not blaming the live streamer.

Yes, I want pool to flourish in America and around the world, but I do not think a live streamer whose income is based on the backs of players dancing like monkeys for them, free in most cases, should tarnish their reputation by filming them when they are drunk or at their worst.

Again, pool is not NFL, golf, tennis, baseball, or NBA. We are all members of the Tribal Nation of Pool, but as always, pool is cruel to its own, especially in America. Railbirds are result pickers when it comes to who's the best and like to ridicule and rip apart pool players sometimes, but when the tournament happens, these same railbirds asking for a photo opp or an autograph of the pool player. I could write a dissertation on this subject alone based on my experiences.

Billy is young and will definitely learn from this experience. The way social media has taken off, I think all sponsored pool players will be careful about their demeanor in public, which is a good thing. In this regard, there are lessons learned from this. Billy and his entire family are pretty cool pool people, and thank goodness they are receiving support from the pool public in a good way right now. Nobody is saying Cuetec was wrong, but most everybody is saying they still want to root for Billy Thorpe in the future.

Well if you were the streamer, and a prominent forum member asked multiple times in multiple places if said streamer should have stopped the stream, and even went so far as to start a new thread with a pole about it, would you not take that as "the streamer is at fault"? You didn't explicitly state that, but its not a far reach to expect a reasonable person to have that reaction.

 

[MattPoland]

https://www.facebook.com/100000337131014/posts/3916649301689602

The ironic thing is I recall first seeing the edited clip directly from the streamer on a FB post to the effect of “so this happened last night”. I never saw it from other sources

And I saw other statements from the streamer like “you never know what’ll happen on my streams whether it be a great shot, big action or even a UFC fight will break out.” He was actively using the incident to promote his channel.

I understand him backpedaling given what’s going on. But from my recollection there’s a bit of revisionist history in play.

 

[chitownnorth]

https://www.facebook.com/100000337131014/posts/3916649301689602

The ironic thing is I recall first seeing the edited clip directly from the streamer on a FB post to the effect of “so this happened last night”. I never saw it from other sources

And I saw other statements from the streamer like “you never know what’ll happen on my streams whether it be a great shot, big action or even a UFC fight will break out.” He was actively using the incident to promote his channel.

I understand him backpedaling given what’s going on. But from my recollection there’s a bit of revisionist history in play.

Wow. Thanks for sharing that info.

 

[PoolHallPaul]

Are you actually aware of side betting or is your statement more to drill down into what could be?

 

[PoolHallPaul]

Does a news reporter turn their camera off?you have a choice to watch or not .If you didn't want to be there you wouldn't be watching. The td or management should have ended it before it went that long.jmo.

 

[JAM]

Well if you were the streamer, and a prominent forum member asked multiple times in multiple places if said streamer should have stopped the stream, and even went so far as to start a new thread with a pole about it, would you not take that as "the streamer is at fault"? You didn't explicitly state that, but its not a far reach to expect a reasonable person to have that reaction.

Uh, no, I would not. I never said the streamer was at fault for the altercation. I simply created a poll if the streamer should have turned off the cameras or not.

 

[OldOrvis]

It's not just between two people if there are side bets. Bars in Chicago get busted for Super Bowl squares and strip cards. Hell, one bar I went to got busted for Liar's Poker.

If you say you are competing in a contest of skill between 2 players in a tournament format they can not stop you. Seen it happen 1st hand lol

 

[SBC]

Ah yes, punish the paying customers and the streamer because of the incredibly poor choices of a pool player.

Next these puritans will be burning people at the stake...
You see how much that accomplishes.

 

[sjm]

I think the answer here is that the streamer had the right to turn off the stream, but not the obligation.

 

[Chili Palmer]

This wouldn’t even be a big deal except Billy used the F homosexual slur. If he had done everything else exactly the same I don’t think there would have been any professional repercussions. There is plenty of predecnce caught on video amongst pros to show this, and more with no video, but everyone in pool knows about.

I don't know Robb so my question comes from lack of knowledge, is he actually gay? I am assuming no, but thought I should ask. That would make this situation much different given the words Billy used.

 

[MattPoland]

I don't know Robb so my question comes from lack of knowledge, is he actually gay? I am assuming no, but thought I should ask. That would make this situation much different given the words Billy used.

My understanding is that he has a wife, a newborn baby, and a couple kids from a previous relationship.

 

[Ken_4fun]

Silly to say streamer should have turned it off.

They were in a public place.

Just curious, when Rodney King got the shit kicked out of him, should that video been turned off?

Funny how folks say one thing in one intense and another in another.

Both should have been allowed to video it, Frankly in both of the examples folks would have said it didnt happen or that it was blown out of proportion. Hard to lie and deny when a video exists.

JMO

Ken

 

[MattPoland]

Silly to say streamer should have turned it off.

They were in a public place.

Just curious, when Rodney King got the shit kicked out of him, should that video been turned off?

Funny how folks say one thing in one intense and another in another.

Both should have been allowed to video it, Frankly in both of the examples folks would have said it didnt happen or that it was blown out of proportion. Hard to lie and deny when a video exists.

JMO

Ken

In this case the streamer has expressed that they wish they had turned off the stream. It’s not that he’s obligated. But it appears in hindsight it is more wise as a business decision.

 

[JAM]

I think the answer here is that the streamer had the right to turn off the stream, but not the obligation.

Bingo. It is always welcome to any thread on AzBilliards when a voice of reason posts words of wisdom.

 

[Quesports]

I think the answer here is that the streamer had the right to turn off the stream, but not the obligation.

I concur with this thought. Billy behaved poorly and his apology was sincere after he had some time to look in the mirror. He is young and was using alcohol so with some help and maturity he will, I believe, become a better man in the future. He has lots of talent and supporters so I would say he has learned an important lesson. I hope he recovers from this and succeeds in life.