I already did.
Taiwan TOI
- Thread starter HawaiianEye
- Start date
I already did.
I think I value MY opinion more than yours...sorry. Maybe next time.
I was giving Randy a chance to give us all his valuable knowledge on the game. He is a master instructor and I think he lives in Dallas, TX, as well as CJ. Maybe he can tell CJ where he is getting it all wrong and come up with a DVD showing us what it really is.
Aloha.
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Playing with a "dead ball", has been around for a long long time. And yes, it was used by the old road players (I was taught about the dead ball in the 80s by an old road player), as it lets you get a read on an unfamiliar table quickly, and can be used effectively on fast or slow cloth to keep the cb on a short leash so to speak. Is it the end all be all of pool? No, and I think CJ would agree that there are more than a couple of ways to skin the cat.
And yes I agree that constant marketing from anybody about anything can be annoying, but jeeze people..... lighten up and give the the guy a break. He is contributing and giving away a ton of good information for free, and what he is selling is pretty good too. I bought it a while back because I collect tapes and books on pool. While the info wasnt anything new to me per se, it can definitely help some of the folks on the forum.
The people constantly following him around and complaining are far more annoying and disruptive than his posts by themselves. Dont like what he has to say? Put him on ignore, or drop it already. The complaining has gotten old.
Chuck
And yes I agree that constant marketing from anybody about anything can be annoying, but jeeze people..... lighten up and give the the guy a break. He is contributing and giving away a ton of good information for free, and what he is selling is pretty good too. I bought it a while back because I collect tapes and books on pool. While the info wasnt anything new to me per se, it can definitely help some of the folks on the forum.
The people constantly following him around and complaining are far more annoying and disruptive than his posts by themselves. Dont like what he has to say? Put him on ignore, or drop it already. The complaining has gotten old.
Chuck
TOI develops a "feel for the pocket," however, I don't "aim" with it
That's correct, TOI is not an aiming system.
TOI develops a "feel for the pocket," however, I don't "aim" with it (I align for the inside of the pocket, not the center). - my aiming system is called 'The Ultimate Aiming System' which is a fractional "CTE/CTC" technique.
That's correct, TOI is not an aiming system.
TOI develops a "feel for the pocket," however, I don't "aim" with it (I align for the inside of the pocket, not the center). - my aiming system is called 'The Ultimate Aiming System' which is a fractional "CTE/CTC" technique.
I've given plenty of credit to the players that have influenced me,
I've given plenty of credit to the players that have influenced me, so you're wrong, I have a lot of respect for the champions like Rodney Morris, Johnny Archer, Dennis Hatch, Earl Strickland, Buddy Hall, Mike Sigel, Luther Lassitor, Wade Crane, and Max Eberle.
I appreciate your input duckie, and again you quacked out of turn.
I've given plenty of credit to the players that have influenced me, so you're wrong, I have a lot of respect for the champions like Rodney Morris, Johnny Archer, Dennis Hatch, Earl Strickland, Buddy Hall, Mike Sigel, Luther Lassitor, Wade Crane, and Max Eberle.
I appreciate your input duckie, and again you quacked out of turn.
So, are you saying Rangyg is using it incorrectly or he isn't as knowledgeable on TOI as he claims? I've NEVER thought of TOI as an "aiming" system...I've always thought of it as a playing system.
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How a player "aims" is completely up to the individual. I use sectional aiming
I won't claim to know what anyone is thinking, although TOI is a technique that can help a player improve daily, because it opens a door of knowledge that connects the player directly to the game in a way that can be achieved no other way. imho
It took me thousands of hours to understand the deeper levels of TOI. As you know, many people are under the impression that TOI is an "aiming system," however, that would be like claiming "fading the golf ball" is an "aiming system," when in fact it's just a way to create a better approach angle through forcing the golf ball to consistently move to the right.
Our minds have been conditioned to see a ball move off a straight line, whether it's throwing a baseball, football, golfing, tennis (topspin/slice). TOI plays the same role in pool as topspin and slice in tennis. The outcome in these examples are to control the movement of the ball to create zones.
TOI uses a slight bit of deflection to do the same thing, however, you still have to align to the inside of the pocket. How a player "aims" is completely up to the individual. I use sectional aiming and use the center, or edge of the object ball as my starting point every time.......then, there's really just three angles I have to create, and this is easily done simply by trusting my instincts (subconscious mind).
The "Touch" of Inside, develops a feel for the pocket, the key to playing great pool is developing touch systematically - TOI will do this, and only with dedication, and the enthusiasm to improve daily.
I won't claim to know what anyone is thinking, although TOI is a technique that can help a player improve daily, because it opens a door of knowledge that connects the player directly to the game in a way that can be achieved no other way. imho
It took me thousands of hours to understand the deeper levels of TOI. As you know, many people are under the impression that TOI is an "aiming system," however, that would be like claiming "fading the golf ball" is an "aiming system," when in fact it's just a way to create a better approach angle through forcing the golf ball to consistently move to the right.
Our minds have been conditioned to see a ball move off a straight line, whether it's throwing a baseball, football, golfing, tennis (topspin/slice). TOI plays the same role in pool as topspin and slice in tennis. The outcome in these examples are to control the movement of the ball to create zones.
TOI uses a slight bit of deflection to do the same thing, however, you still have to align to the inside of the pocket. How a player "aims" is completely up to the individual. I use sectional aiming and use the center, or edge of the object ball as my starting point every time.......then, there's really just three angles I have to create, and this is easily done simply by trusting my instincts (subconscious mind).
The "Touch" of Inside, develops a feel for the pocket, the key to playing great pool is developing touch systematically - TOI will do this, and only with dedication, and the enthusiasm to improve daily.
I stated that neither of those players were using TOI.
For your info, I am in CJ's corner with TOI.
TOI is a good shooting system.
Also for your info, CJ has spent hours with me and TOI.
Don't twist my words.
randyg
You know what, Randy? I think they may have used TOI on a few shots, but not as many as I originally thought.
I hurriedly watched the video on the way out the door and formed a quick opinion. Last night, I sat down and closely watched the video again. They may have used TOI on several shots (I only watched the 9 ball portion), but not as much as my first impression.
I've played with it for a couple of years now and have a good handle on it. I'd have to say they weren't TOI proponents upon closer examination. I'm not saying this to flame or insult anybody over this, but that's my opinion after a second, closer look.
I would say, the player who put up the four pack favored the inside of the cue ball. :wink:
Best,
Mike
Glad to hear you can admit your mistakes.
If you could time stamp a few shots where you think they are using TOI, I would be more than happy to admit mine.
I guess we need Dr Dave here ,, I went to the table and hit several cut shots using a high ball so I could see the spin ,, inside does not stop the spin anymore than outside , one shortens the angle off the rail one lengthens the angle ,, both have a predictable outcome , center ball seems to give the best predictable outcome where speed does not change the angle off the rail ,,
I have heard from CJ you can't hit center repeatedly, and I can believe that's true for many including me ,, however I'm not a world class Asian shooter ,, maybe they can
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I have heard from CJ you can't hit center repeatedly, and I can believe that's true for many including me ,, however I'm not a world class Asian shooter ,, maybe they can
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I don't think people's opinions are mistakes. I stated an opinion earlier and took a lot of flak for it. After reviewing the part of the video I watched, I still have the same judgment of the players for the few racks I did watch. I can give a play by play critique if anyone is interested.
I watched the 9 ball not knowing either player or their rep. So, I had no expectations of an outcome. Only their play to form an opinion. They could have been anybody holding a cue stick, as far as I knew.
I looked at the four rack run by the first player which, BTW had quite a few problems in execution. I labeled the shot "TOI", or "maybe". The table is fast and this guy bunts a lot of balls which is not a trademark TOI movement. Hard to be sure. That's why it's been hidden so long in plain sight! You see it, but don't pick it out. I'll try...
Rack 1
4 ball--maybe
7 ball--maybe
8 ball--TOI
Rack 2
4 ball--TOI (Got lucky to get out in this rack)
6 ball--maybe
Rack 3
7 ball--maybe (Got lucky to get out in this rack)
Rack 4
2 ball--TOI
6 ball--TOI
The other player with the highlighted locks seemed to play a traditional game. The rest of the 9 ball set was not worth talking about. Pretty basic play.
Best,
Mike
One other factor to consider is the new cloth and tournament equipment. I have to tone down my TOI under these conditions, however I still favor the inside.
We mostly play on cloth that is more worn, which allows a firmer hit. It's really tough to play on brand new cloth (under TV lights), I'd be surprised if anyone can play their normal game they play under normal conditions, without some adjustments.
Watch Efren's videos of when he's playing in the Philippines, you'll see him favor the inside on most of his shots....unless he's changing the angles off the cushion, playing a straight-in shot, or slow-rolling the cue ball.
I only focused on the shots you had labeled as TOI.
Rack 1
(8 ball) He doesn't actually shoot the 8. Unless you were referring to the 7-8 combo, but that was shot with center ball.
Rack 2
(4 ball) Slightly below center. That's why the CB comes off the rail to the left.
Rack 4
(2 ball) Again, slightly below center which draws the CB towards the 3. You can clearly see the CB rolling a little after contacting the 2, which is what happens on stun shots.
(6 ball) Draw stroke.
I'm going to try to avoid this thread now. It's obvious that there are people here that will see what they want to see out of some unspoken loyalty to another member.
you hit the cue ball off slightly to the inside, or outside?
When you use "center ball" and miss a shot, was it because you hit the cue ball off slightly to the inside, or outside?
Think about this for a minute, how would you know?
With TOI you know every time, this is useful information, so you can fix the problem immediately......before it causes you to miss more shots the same way, or you try to fix something that's not broken.
When you use "center ball" and miss a shot, was it because you hit the cue ball off slightly to the inside, or outside?
Think about this for a minute, how would you know?
With TOI you know every time, this is useful information, so you can fix the problem immediately......before it causes you to miss more shots the same way, or you try to fix something that's not broken.