The Biggest reason Lower level players can't improve ????

CocoboloCowboy

Cowboys are my heros.
Silver Member
Crappy players are crappy because they put little effort into improvement. They are like people who try many sports, for fun & recreation.

But they put little effort, or practice into improvement.
 

DrCue'sProtege

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Would anybody be interested in hearing what has caused me to shy away from genomachino and Perfect Aim and this thread?

r/DCP
 

iusedtoberich

AzB Gold Member
Gold Member
Silver Member
Yes please, we are all dying?

Seriously though it’s kind of dumb. You spent so much time on this thread explicitly asking gene questions and pointing him to your identical straight in shot posts in the instructor forum. You could have just called him instead. Hell, maybe he would’nt have even charged you. It’s like you’ve been trolling him and us this whole time.
 

genomachino

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Benefit of 2 lessons.....

I'd recommend you give him a call;) I know you are a student of the game. I suppose this is how all the CTE people (that get it) feel. Its like you can't miss. I've read most of Dr Dave's stuff, and you really need Gene on the line with you to help you get it. IMO. And I'm the last person here, well other than maybe you and Lou, to adhere to any aiming system. ha ha. Maybe its ok in this case because its really about head/eye alignment, and not aiming at edges and then pivoting like the other systems. PS, you do need to know where the pocket is for this one:)

Thanks for the good review here. It was fun the first lesson and then it was even more fun the second time because you can see how easy it is to forget some things. Plus there was more info the second time because I learned more. Learned more and learned how to teach it. .

I have never seen anything that works so well and is so easy to learn.

To fit it into ones game is another matter depending on the players fundamentals. Sometimes many things need to be changed or tweaked and sometimes just a few. So you really need to have someone teach this that knows what they are doing.

There are about 10 things that need to be absolutely correct when coming down on a shot. Or as correct as possible.

Just changing the eyes will help some but getting the whole puzzle together will make the results seem magical.

Sometimes players ask for some drills. I tell them any drills will work, because everytime your looking at a shot you are practicing what you learned with the eyes.

Practice makes Perfect. Perfect practice gets to Perfect sooner...:cool:
 

DrCue'sProtege

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Yes please, we are all dying?

Seriously though it’s kind of dumb. You spent so much time on this thread explicitly asking gene questions and pointing him to your identical straight in shot posts in the instructor forum. You could have just called him instead. Hell, maybe he would’nt have even charged you. It’s like you’ve been trolling him and us this whole time.

Wrong.

And how much time have I spent on this thread compared to others? How many posts do I have compared to others? And you claim I am trolling???

I was trying to get at least a little piece of info that might make me think its all legit before I pulled the trigger.

Anyway, here goes........

I had a supposed "World Class" instructor tell me he gave Karen Corr a lesson. I later found out all he did was help her get her instructor certification. Big difference.

And I'm sorry Gene, but here goes. You told me you worked with Tyler Styer and Sky Woodward. I checked with both of them. They both said no, that they never took a lesson from you. I was also told you tried to show one of them something but the player in question said it didnt help any.

All of this straight from the horses mouth. I think everybody should be made aware of this.

r/DCP
 

genomachino

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
You are not telling the truth my friend....

Wrong.

And how much time have I spent on this thread compared to others? How many posts do I have compared to others? And you claim I am trolling???

I was trying to get at least a little piece of info that might make me think its all legit before I pulled the trigger.

Anyway, here goes........

I had a supposed "World Class" instructor tell me he gave Karen Corr a lesson. I later found out all he did was help her get her instructor certification. Big difference.

And I'm sorry Gene, but here goes. You told me you worked with Tyler Styer and Sky Woodward. I checked with both of them. They both said no, that they never took a lesson from you. I was also told you tried to show one of them something but the player in question said it didnt help any.

All of this straight from the horses mouth. I think everybody should be made aware of this.

r/DCP

Tyler Styer would not say that . I gave him a lesson at Romines. I think he was 16. I showed Sky at a tournament in Cape Giardo how these eyes worked. I try to work with all the kids and help all I can. I think he was 17 maybe 16. Not sure.

I met Sky in person in Duluth, MN at the $1000.00 entry tournament at the Break Room. We were sitting there and Sky asked me when I was going to show him more. He said I know you know more than what you showed me before. About 3 months ago I sent a message to Sky telling I would show him the new stuff on skype. He said cool . But He wasn't playing at all at the time because of the pandemic and didn't have a table.

You get in trouble assuming my friend.

I also showed this to Rodney Morris also in 2009. He really liked it.

You didn't hear this from any horses mouth my friend. Both these kids are good guys.

This is really a shame. The 5 years that I was on the road I never missed a chance to try and help the young players and for free. Your trying to make the wrong guy look bad.
 
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cookie man

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Wrong.

And how much time have I spent on this thread compared to others? How many posts do I have compared to others? And you claim I am trolling???

I was trying to get at least a little piece of info that might make me think its all legit before I pulled the trigger.

Anyway, here goes........

I had a supposed "World Class" instructor tell me he gave Karen Corr a lesson. I later found out all he did was help her get her instructor certification. Big difference.

And I'm sorry Gene, but here goes. You told me you worked with Tyler Styer and Sky Woodward. I checked with both of them. They both said no, that they never took a lesson from you. I was also told you tried to show one of them something but the player in question said it didnt help any.

All of this straight from the horses mouth. I think everybody should be made aware of this.

r/DCP

I know for a fact that Gene has worked with Tyler in the past.
 

Archer400

Registered
Wrong.

And how much time have I spent on this thread compared to others? How many posts do I have compared to others? And you claim I am trolling???

I was trying to get at least a little piece of info that might make me think its all legit before I pulled the trigger.

Anyway, here goes........

I had a supposed "World Class" instructor tell me he gave Karen Corr a lesson. I later found out all he did was help her get her instructor certification. Big difference.

And I'm sorry Gene, but here goes. You told me you worked with Tyler Styer and Sky Woodward. I checked with both of them. They both said no, that they never took a lesson from you. I was also told you tried to show one of them something but the player in question said it didnt help any.

All of this straight from the horses mouth. I think everybody should be made aware of this.

r/DCP
I just am not understanding why people want to put this man down.
If your so sure that this is ( snake oil) that it can't help because it is not the " traditional way" then instead of just saying why it can't work, Take a mini lesson from him.
He is willing to do that.

How many other's out there are willing to go to that extent.
So far anyone that has had a mini lesson with Gene, has changed there tune on this.
Are we all just trying to get in your head, or is Gene paying us to tell you this is real?

People on here say, well it is only because he is trying to charge us for this.
But is he really? He is willing to show you it really works for free.
Then and only then is he saying I will give you a 3 to 4 hr lesson for 300 dollars?
Or get a DVD and I will give you a free skype lesson with it?

I have never seen anyone else selling a DVD or video being willing to do that.
I have many of them From Stan's to Dr Dave's Venmo videos, to See system, Tor's Zero-X kicking system. ETC. They all charged me and I Could have them come over and give me a personal lessons or I could go to them for like 3000 dollars for a two day training lesson.
So I have seen and practiced a lot of aiming systems and by far the easiest and the one with the best results were with Gene,
And his wasn't a system at all. it was just the way you look at the ball, and really understanding how your eyes work. and he works on your stance, and stroke too, all for the same price.
That is ridiculous, that alone would cost you much more than what he is charging for the whole package. And you get a DVD to keep, and free tune ups?

I think if he could he would give this away for free, and he does a lot of times. But he still has to be able to pay for his expenses. I know if I want 3 to 4 hrs of someone's professional help, no matter what it is, I am going to be paying a lot more then 300 dollars.

Go look on the internet and see what others are charging?
And they don't give you a free sample before they charge you.
Before putting this man down, know what you are talking about.
Then if you don't feel he is legitimate, then come on here and say that it is all " snake oil"
And don't don't be a fool and drink the kool aid.

More then likely, you will be the next convert, and will be praising him like all the rest of us that have "drank the Kool aid"
 

CocoboloCowboy

Cowboys are my heros.
Silver Member
Tyler Styer would not say that . I gave him a lesson at Romines. I think he was 16. I showed Sky at a tournament in Cape Giardo how these eyes worked. I try to work with all the kids and help all I can. I think he was 17 maybe 16. Not sure.

I met Sky in person in Duluth, MN at the $1000.00 entry tournament at the Break Room. We were sitting there and Sky asked me when I was going to show him more. He said I know you know more than what you showed me before. About 3 months ago I sent a message to Sky telling I would show him the new stuff on skype. He said cool . But He wasn't playing at all at the time because of the pandemic and didn't have a table.

You get in trouble assuming my friend.

I also showed this to Rodney Morris also in 2009. He really liked it.

You didn't hear this from any horses mouth my friend. Both these kids are good guys.

This is really a shame. The 5 years that I was on the road I never missed a chance to try and help the young players and for free. Your trying to make the wrong guy look bad.


Maybe Rodney Morris was being polite, and laugh at your mobo mobo umbo jumbo. Do not see many Pro Plays saying Thank You Geno, you made me better & richer.

I have a saying when someone GIVES me a Cigar, gift, sample, etc. I smoke it, and had because it is bad, taste like s***, and I would never buy. If person.who gives it say how was it. I say INTRESTING.

Friend know that is polite for sh***, crapo, never agiain. your Perfect Aiming DVD Geno was interesting. LOL
 

straightline

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
You might think so , but it really is so natural. It feels right when you do it.
It is hard to explain. It is like this is the way you want to see the shot but a lot of times you can't get there.
Gene's tutoring helps you get there. But you fall back on your old ways. That is why I can see the shot so perfectly sometimes and it just feels natural. And other times I don't, and I cant figure out why. Then I go back to the video realize what I did wrong and correct the error, and it al works again.
And it just feels right.
I would be in a world of hurt right now, and very frustrated, if I did not have the video to go back to.
And I don't think I would have understand the video, if I didn't first have the lesson from Gene.
So I can understand why people that just see the video doesn't think this works.
You need both.

I get why this is so hard to teach or explain, you really have to experience it to understand it.

Sounds about right for new toy syndrome. If it becomes more than that please report back. What level player are you?

So I'll jump back in with my experience doing a lesson with Gene, because this sounds like a legit thought, and not more salesman lynching.

My mechanics are pretty solid. To the point where I never get any comments on them other then how dialed in I am when approaching every shot. If anything I'll have new opponents or first time on lookers make it a point to speak to me about it. I feel pretty damn confident that my alignment while addressing shots is pretty damn consistent.
Keeping that in mind, here's what I experience when cutting the OB to the left as compared to the right. We should note that I'm also a chin centered over cue kind of player.

I address every shot as I would normally. While standing I find my angle to make the OB, then my line from the CB to the OB to get the amount of cut required. When cutting to the right, as I get down on the shot everything remains clear and I can adjust my aim clearly. When cutting to the left, as I get down on the shot, my vision starts skew/blur while focusing on the OB. At this point I start to hunt for what "feels" correct as I don't see the OB with sharp detail. I rely on experience to find the correct CB path to the OB. Prior to speaking to Gene, the adjustment on LH cuts I was making was automatic, and my difficulty was "just part of my game".

What Gene did for me was point out that he could plainly see what I was doing in terms of compensation, explain why and how to correct it while addressing the ball. No secret sauce, request for money, and no aiming system required. Just an explanation, and the minor adjustment I would need to make to remedy what I was experiencing. I tried what he suggested, (which for me was a slight tilt of my head) and it cleared my focus on the OB on those left hand cuts.

Do I use what he suggested...?..., no I don't. Would it improve my game...?..., meh maybe. Why don't I...?.., because I've been doing the same thing for over 30yrs and that slight tilt doesn't feel natural to me.

The head tilt part. I've found that the head positioning adjustments I've experimented with, all worked to some degree and had more to do with subtle stroke alignment than image correction.

For me,
The Filler tilt works best and requires the least body adjustment. When my contact point stroking starts to drift, the head tilt is what I do to re-calibrate.

The Morra lean works best for forceful stroking. It attenuates the outward hook caused by your swinging arm heading for your navel.

The Strickland sniper sight, works pretty well for med shots because the arm can swing closer to a true pendulum. To me it's just plain awkward.
It comes down to physique. The taller you are, the more built in leverage you have, therefore the less strain based biases.

You say you shelved GM's input. was the time worth it?

Would anybody be interested in hearing what has caused me to shy away from genomachino and Perfect Aim and this thread?
r/DCP

I read your clarification of this. Anything to add?
 

DrCue'sProtege

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I read your clarification of this. Anything to add?

All I know is what I was told by the two players in question. I dont know if Gene's system works or not. Some think he's great, some think its all blow and no show.

Tyler's response: "No, I use CTE Pro One by Stan Shuffett"

Sky's response: "No, I never took a lesson from him. He tried to show me one thing on one shot but it didnt help any"

r/DCP
 

straightline

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
All I know is what I was told by the two players in question. I dont know if Gene's system works or not. Some think he's great, some think its all blow and no show.

Tyler's response: "No, I use CTE Pro One by Stan Shuffett"

Sky's response: "No, I never took a lesson from him. He tried to show me one thing on one shot but it didnt help any"

r/DCP

So exagertising then... :grin-square:
 

genomachino

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Here is my Tyler Styer story.....

So exagertising then... :grin-square:

I did work with Tyler like I said and did a full lesson at Romines in Milwaukee.

I was traveling and teaching around the country. Milwaukee was one of my favorite spots because I'm from Wis. I walked into Romines and there was Terry Romine. As usually I introduced myself and told Terry I was there to teach Perfect Aim and that each pool hall I would do one free lesson to whomever the owner wanted.

Terry already knew I was a player but he didn't know I was traveling and teaching.

He looked over and said I got someone for you. There he was, A skinny kid with redish hair. So I went over and introduced myself, and we went to work.

I really enjoy working with the kids. One of the highlights while I was working on the road teaching.

Tyler was 16 years old and such a good kid. His mother was there and I met her also.

Tyler was pretty receptive to what I was teaching and was pretty excited. The complete lesson took about 2 hours. Always fun to work with all the kids.

I remember Tylers mother wanted to go. There was still about an hour or so the poolhall would be open. She could not get him off the table He just wanted to play and was excited about how he could zero in the shots.

It was allot of fun as usual with all the kids that I worked with on the road everywhere and I never charged any kid a dime.

At this point in Tylers life what I taught was pretty important. He could get the eyes in the correct position at such a young age and see the shots correctly.

Tyler since then has worked so hard at the game. His work with Stan Shuffet, one of the best teachers in the country, really helped Tyler get where he got. I am so happy with this young man and how he is handling life and pool.

Everything we learn in our life playing pool is important. From the first time we pick up a cue until we can't play anymore when we get old.

Did I work with Tyler like I said. Absolutely. Did I tell the truth, absolutely.

Did what I taught Tyler help him. Absolutely. It helps everyone if they learn it and understand it.

Getting the dominant eye in the correct position for any player is pretty important.

On this thread just listening to all the players that have learned this. That's all you have to do.


Stan teaches some pretty amazing stuff and has poured out his heart and soul to share it with the pool world.

But what players don't know is that Stan is also a great player. Understands the game inside and out.

One of the best things ever is this young man Tyler is not only a great ambassador for the game but he is helping so many players along the way.

His knowledge and wisdom is so huge and at such a young age.

Tyler Styer will accomplish so many things in this pool world playing as he has already.

One of his greatest accomplishments already is sharing his success with other players, teaching and giving back.

I am so proud to call Tyler Styer my friend.....
 
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The_JV

Local_Pro
The head tilt part. I've found that the head positioning adjustments I've experimented with, all worked to some degree and had more to do with subtle stroke alignment than image correction.

Not in my particular case. For me the incorrect head placement (based on dominant eye) blurs my focus on the OB. The blur is subtle, but there none the less.

For me,
The Filler tilt works best and requires the least body adjustment. When my contact point stroking starts to drift, the head tilt is what I do to re-calibrate.

The Morra lean works best for forceful stroking. It attenuates the outward hook caused by your swinging arm heading for your navel.

The Strickland sniper sight, works pretty well for med shots because the arm can swing closer to a true pendulum. To me it's just plain awkward.
It comes down to physique. The taller you are, the more built in leverage you have, therefore the less strain based biases.

Wow, I can't imagine using so many stances/approaches to shots. Must have difficult to gain any consistency. I only variants in my mechanics are bridge placement/height and how forcibly I press the cue into the webbing of my grip hand.

You say you shelved GM's input. was the time worth it?

You should understand that I have been using the same approach for an extremely long time, and play at decent level already. The "blur" I mentioned on the left hand cuts is ingrained into my game and I already compensate effectively for the most part. I personally don't see the value in altering my approach and learning a new trick at this stage for minuscule gains.

With that said, yes I do firmly believe it was excellent time spent. Again, being so accustomed to "auto-compensation", I was naive to the situation and the root cause. As I explained way back in the thread. What this problem was doing to me on occasion was instilling doubt in my game on a given day. If I was struggling with my "feel" on those LH cuts and missing a few. The doubt in my aim would creep into the rest of my game. Things would snowball from there...

Now having a full understanding of what's going on, (thanks to Gene), I don't fret the "little stuff" any more. Having that knowledge has removed a "unknown" variable I didn't realize that I had.
 
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iusedtoberich

AzB Gold Member
Gold Member
Silver Member
All I know is what I was told by the two players in question. I dont know if Gene's system works or not. Some think he's great, some think its all blow and no show.

Tyler's response: "No, I use CTE Pro One by Stan Shuffett"

Sky's response: "No, I never took a lesson from him. He tried to show me one thing on one shot but it didnt help any"

r/DCP

Well if that is "the entirety" of what each said, then that still leaves room for what Geno said regarding working with them to be 100% correct.
 

iusedtoberich

AzB Gold Member
Gold Member
Silver Member
Uhhhh......what, do you not know what the word "NO" means?????

I know what No means. But I also know what taking things out of context means. Well why don't you post the whole conversation?

If Tyler said "No, I use CTE..."

That can still mean Geno gave him a lesson like he said a couple posts ago (post #573) when he was a teen red headed kid. And he now uses Stan's stuff. It doesn't make what Geno said untrue. Unless the conversation went something like:

DCP: Hey Tyler, do you know Geno? Did he ever work with you when you were a Teen? Did he show you any aiming stuff?
Tyler: No, I never met the guy in my life.

You see the difference? No only means no if you give us all the details, not a snippet.

Edit to add: and if you are going to call the guy a liar, you better not leave out any details of your conversation.
 
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iusedtoberich

AzB Gold Member
Gold Member
Silver Member
And to DCP:

The more you write in this thread, the more it seems you ARE trolling us. You went out of your way to contact two pro players to ask them about Geno? Come on man. That is like stalking territory. The guy (Geno) has been a regular on AZ for 10 solid years. Posting all the time. Sure, he is a good salesman, but he's also a regular guy and participates in all the conversations and tells us lots of good stories and good info. If after 10 years you think the guy is lying and therefore not worthy of your trust, well then I don't know what to say. He's kept us in the loop all these years. He even put himself up against Bartram when Bartram called him out. Somoene full of sh it is not going to do that.
 
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