The truth about the GSBT event in Bristol TN

See everyone at Micheal's this weekend! Looking forward to another excellent GSBT event. Thanks for adding the Bank Tournament... can't wait!!!!
 
Bank Tournament

Worminator said:
See everyone at Micheal's this weekend! Looking forward to another excellent GSBT event. Thanks for adding the Bank Tournament... can't wait!!!!
Click to expand...


Yeah Im really jealous you guys up there are getting a Bank Event up there, Id drive the 8hrs just to play that if I didnt have some other things to have to do. Man thats going to be a great event.

336Robin :thumbup:
 
geno said:
This question has been asked before (a tleast 3 times)and the GSBT still has not responded.

I would also like to say that after doing some payout research for the GSBT I have seen a few other things mentioned in forums, some about the take and some about your guaranteed added monies. It seems that at some events it was listed as $1,500 guaranteed added but the GSBT only added $1,000 to the prize fund after the players traveled to the events. I would think that since the tour obviously does make a profit overall (nothing wrong with that) that you would live up to your promised guaranteed added monies. YES, I do find something seriously wrong with the fact that when you say guaranteed added and you don't add that much to the event even though the players were counting on that. These actions are no different than when promoters bounce checks or do not pay all of the players.

This specific incident of not paying the correct amount to the players happened in Mobile.

GSBT, do you have any explanations as to why you did not add the amount you said (GUARANTEED) your were going to add to the event in Mobile (and other places I have heard)?

Honestly, how the heck can any AZer say it is OK to make a good dollar running a tour when you do not live up to your guarantees for the players?
Click to expand...

buy some glasses or read the whole thread they have responded. post number 40 in this thread and they have addressed it in others. there is no "correct amount" to pay out. there is the entry fee and there is what the td tells you is the pay out for 1st, 2nd etc. there is no way, unless it's the room owner running the tournament, that a tour can pay out 100% of the money it takes in for entry fee, plus added money. then there is no way to pay for the tour. how is that so hard to understand. and as far as you think they are taking too much, then don't bother to play. it's really easy. don't understand why people are making it so complicated.
i have played in thier events. i look at the flyer and there is the entry fee. by the time the calcutta is done and first round matches are set there is a clear number of how many players and payouts are established and the whole show is there to see. if you go to thier events and you don't like the math no one is holding a gun to your heads and making anyone play.
 
jrt30004 said:
buy some glasses or read the whole thread they have responded. post number 40 in this thread and they have addressed it in others. there is no "correct amount" to pay out. there is the entry fee and there is what the td tells you is the pay out for 1st, 2nd etc. there is no way, unless it's the room owner running the tournament, that a tour can pay out 100% of the money it takes in for entry fee, plus added money. then there is no way to pay for the tour. how is that so hard to understand. and as far as you think they are taking too much, then don't bother to play. it's really easy. don't understand why people are making it so complicated.
i have played in thier events. i look at the flyer and there is the entry fee. by the time the calcutta is done and first round matches are set there is a clear number of how many players and payouts are established and the whole show is there to see. if you go to thier events and you don't like the math no one is holding a gun to your heads and making anyone play.
Click to expand...

He's not asking about the payout. He asking why the guaranteed ADDED money wasn't what was advertised.
 
Who gives a rats ass? You can either play or stay home. Your choice! I hope the tournament director does make money. Otherwise we have no tournaments to play.
 
PaulieB said:
Even though I made a tongue in cheek joke about a million dollar added tourney earlier, I do realize that people need to make money to keep a tour running, etc. I wasn't bashing the tour at all, I was just making a (in hindsight, very dumb) comment about saying you are adding any amount you want, since you can take what you want back in fees. (yes, I realize that the "added" amount advertised and the fees taken aren't always the same people)

To the OP though, would it make you feel better if you thought about it this way ....

Total entry fees were 4635, of which 2615 were taken out for advertising costs, whatever random overhead, greens fees, paying salaries, who knows what goes into running a tournament. THEN 1500 was added to the payout for a total of 3520. If it wasn't a 1500 added tournament then the payouts would of only been 2020. So now, to me at least, the 1500 added practically doubled the prize pool, allowing for much larger payouts.

Does looking at it that way make you feel better or do you really expect people to put all this crap together for you for no monetary return on their part?
Click to expand...
Great post ! There you go fools and naysayers !!!


geno said:
This question has been asked before (a tleast 3 times)and the GSBT still has not responded.

I would also like to say that after doing some payout research for the GSBT I have seen a few other things mentioned in forums, some about the take and some about your guaranteed added monies. It seems that at some events it was listed as $1,500 guaranteed added but the GSBT only added $1,000 to the prize fund after the players traveled to the events. I would think that since the tour obviously does make a profit overall (nothing wrong with that) that you would live up to your promised guaranteed added monies. YES, I do find something seriously wrong with the fact that when you say guaranteed added and you don't add that much to the event even though the players were counting on that. These actions are no different than when promoters bounce checks or do not pay all of the players.

This specific incident of not paying the correct amount to the players happened in Mobile.

GSBT, do you have any explanations as to why you did not add the amount you said (GUARANTEED) your were going to add to the event in Mobile (and other places I have heard)?

Honestly, how the heck can any AZer say it is OK to make a good dollar running a tour when you do not live up to your guarantees for the players?
Click to expand...

Not such a good post JANIS !
 
The info Geno provided is correct. As I have also have 1st hand knowledge that they have puled this move more than once.

Advertisement by the GSBT stating that $1,500 was GUARANTEED TO BE ADDED to the event. http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=158190&highlight=BREAKERS+BILLIARD+Mobile

Results and payouts only reflect less than what was stated as being GUARANTEED ADDED by the GSBT.
http://www.insidepoolmag.com/200912/billiard-news/lil-d-big-winner-in-mobile.html

Again, there is nothing wrong with the GSBT making money and how much really doesn't matter. But when they do make money and not live up to doing what they say they are going to do the I DO HAVE A PROBLEM WITH THAT! That is not what a REAL TOUR DOES or any good promoter does nor should it ever be accepted as such. EVER!

Sometimes as a promoter or TD you just have to come out of your pocket to make things right. I believe that many promoters here on AZ have done this more than once themselves. Possibly Randy G, Jay H, Mike J, Mike Z and many others I know of.

Again, when you are making the BIG Bucks you have to (or should have to) at least do what you say you are going to do even if it costs you a few bucks to save face.
 
Last edited:
geno said:
This question has been asked before (a tleast 3 times)and the GSBT still has not responded.

I would also like to say that after doing some payout research for the GSBT I have seen a few other things mentioned in forums, some about the take and some about your guaranteed added monies. It seems that at some events it was listed as $1,500 guaranteed added but the GSBT only added $1,000 to the prize fund after the players traveled to the events. I would think that since the tour obviously does make a profit overall (nothing wrong with that) that you would live up to your promised guaranteed added monies. YES, I do find something seriously wrong with the fact that when you say guaranteed added and you don't add that much to the event even though the players were counting on that. These actions are no different than when promoters bounce checks or do not pay all of the players.

This specific incident of not paying the correct amount to the players happened in Mobile.

GSBT, do you have any explanations as to why you did not add the amount you said (GUARANTEED) your were going to add to the event in Mobile (and other places I have heard)?

Honestly, how the heck can any AZer say it is OK to make a good dollar running a tour when you do not live up to your guarantees for the players?
Click to expand...

Actually your accusation was addressed here: http://forums.azbilliards.com/showpost.php?p=2875698&postcount=106 .

I read that as saying that the information you relied on to make your accusation was flawed; i.e. the insided pool article was incorrect.
 
MikeM said:
Actually your accusation was addressed here: http://forums.azbilliards.com/showpost.php?p=2875698&postcount=106 .

I read that as saying that the information you relied on to make your accusation was flawed; i.e. the insided pool article was incorrect.
Click to expand...

NOT CORRECT, they never responded to the event in question in Mobile (they responded only to the payouts for the current event in question). The payouts as listed on IP for that event in Mobile have never been addresses. As that is exactly what the payouts were. And that is an undisputed FACT.

As mentioned in an earlier post. Things like that should never be accepted.

I won't speak for the RO but I do know he was PISSED OFF and so were the players from this and each event they did this at.
 
Last edited:
geno said:
NOT CORRECT, they never responded to the event in question in Mobile (they responded only to the payouts for the current event in question). The payouts as listed on IP for that event in Mobile have never been addresses. As that is exactly what the payouts were. And that is an undisputed FACT.

As mentioned in an earlier post. Things like that should never be accepted.
Click to expand...

Geez, Janis. You do the same damn thing, so get off your flippin' high horse and move on.
 
coopersschon said:
The info Geno provided is correct. As I have also have 1st hand knowledge that they have puled this move more than once.

Advertisement by the GSBT stating that $1,500 was GUARANTEED TO BE ADDED to the event. http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=158190&highlight=BREAKERS+BILLIARD+Mobile

Results and payouts only reflect less than what was stated as being GUARANTEED ADDED by the GSBT.
http://www.insidepoolmag.com/200912/billiard-news/lil-d-big-winner-in-mobile.html

Again, there is nothing wrong with the GSBT making money and how much really doesn't matter. But when they do make money and not live up to doing what they say they are going to do the I DO HAVE A PROBLEM WITH THAT! That is not what a REAL TOUR DOES or any good promoter does nor should it ever be accepted as such. EVER!

Sometimes as a promoter or TD you just have to come out of your pocket to make things right. I believe that many promoters here on AZ have done this more than once themselves. Possibly Randy G, Jay H, Mike J, Mike Z and many others I know of.

Again, when you are making the BIG Bucks you have to (or should have to) at least do what you say you are going to do even if it costs you a few bucks to save face.
Click to expand...

I wasn't going to mention anything about this because I found it pretty funny but.....

http://forums.azbilliards.com/search.php?searchid=6004843

Coincidentally, a lot of your posts seem to occur in the same threads that "Geno" posts in. "You" seem to have many questions that "Geno" just seems to have the answer to. He is very handy to have around isn't he?

Not all of your posts center around "Geno", I can see that, but most of the others usually revolve around something seemingly derrogatory involving other tours or promoters. It is also uncanny how you just happen to remember certain unfortunate occurrances involving some tours or promotors.

I am sure I am the only one that has noticed this, maybe I am just reading too much into it. I mean, it could be a coincidence couldn't it?????:scratchhead:
 
I don't think this is the point.

MikeM said:
Why is that? If the owner relinquishes his greens fees to the tour operator, why should he give that away? Doesn't it still have value? Why does it matter who pockets the greens fees? The player is still paying them in order to be allowed to play. Same value propostion to the player.

If the money DID go to the house and then the house wrote a check in the same amount to the Tour Operator as a fee for bringing in players would that make everyone feel better?

I have a big problem with people trying to tell other people what is fair and what isn't. Either $60 for a possible payout of $1000 is worth it or it isn't. Sign up or don't and don't complain when someone finds a way to make money off of pool....imo.
Click to expand...

I think the point is that it shouldn't be billed as a money added tourney when they are actually taking money out of it. It is dishonest to call something a money added tourney when you're not even paying out the entry fees. Green fees should only be 10-15% of the entry, any more than that is robbery IMO.

I probably will never play a GSBT event and am not casting dispersions. I am just stating what I feel is right. In other words, I don't know what GSBT does did etc.. and am not specifically commenting on what they do did whatever, but if a tourney is billed as a money added tourney. then the green fees should be disclosed in advance and the money added should be in addition to the remainder of the entry fees. Anything less is dishonest, there's no way around that.

Jaden
 
Ktown D said:
I wasn't going to mention anything about this because I found it pretty funny but.....

http://forums.azbilliards.com/search.php?searchid=6004843

Coincidentally, a lot of your posts seem to occur in the same threads that "Geno" posts in. "You" seem to have many questions that "Geno" just seems to have the answer to. He is very handy to have around isn't he?

Not all of your posts center around "Geno", I can see that, but most of the others usually revolve around something seemingly derrogatory involving other tours or promoters. It is also uncanny how you just happen to remember certain unfortunate occurrances involving some tours or promotors.

I am sure I am the only one that has noticed this, maybe I am just reading too much into it. I mean, it could be a coincidence couldn't it?????:scratchhead:
Click to expand...

I think it best to apply "Occam's razor" to this quandry. "All things being equal, the simplest solution tends to be the correct one."
 
I will not go so far as call it "dishonest" as Jaden did, but the observation by the OP is valid...whatever the motivation may be.

1500 added should be just that.
I guess, the actual question is "added to what?"
The assumption is its added to the entries, but that's not the case.
Added to the entries after administration and green fees are deducted? Sounds about right. Well it sounds about right until that number exceeds the "added" monies...at that point it just gets silly and "seems" like enron like math.

This is a popular tour with some great players and I wish em the best going forward. I do however think they may want to adjust the wording of such promotions. ....and I'm not saying they did anything wrong at all. But its easy to understand how anyone could.

Best of luck gsbt...and I'll see you folks when you swing back through my way.
 
Last edited:
geno said:
NOT CORRECT, they never responded to the event in question in Mobile (they responded only to the payouts for the current event in question). The payouts as listed on IP for that event in Mobile have never been addresses. As that is exactly what the payouts were. And that is an undisputed FACT.

As mentioned in an earlier post. Things like that should never be accepted.

I won't speak for the RO but I do know he was PISSED OFF and so were the players from this and each event they did this at.
Click to expand...

You probably think it's better to make the added money right THEN you can go and rig the raffles huh ! ???

MMHMMM much better that way. sell the raffle items for cheap to the winner to be and pocket all the raffle money.
 
oldzilla said:
You probably think it's better to make the added money right THEN you can go and rig the raffles huh ! ???

MMHMMM much better that way. sell the raffle items for cheap to the winner to be and pocket all the raffle money.
Click to expand...

Oldzilla as a former lurked here I have to tell you that you are way out of line on your accusation. To bad I had to make this my first real post but I thought you should know that you are way off base on that.

Jerry
 
1344fry said:
Oldzilla as a former lurked here I have to tell you that you are way out of line on your accusation. To bad I had to make this my first real post but I thought you should know that you are way off base on that.

Jerry
Click to expand...

Well welcome to the forum. I do have to say you are MAYBE correct BUT
on the other hand I think that Janis should just keep his mouth shut.
I've seen what he does and it was way worse when he first started.
Do you remember how much he used to gouge out of the money back then !

Anyway no biggy. Welcome !
 
oldzilla said:
Well welcome to the forum. I do have to say you are MAYBE correct BUT
on the other hand I think that Janis should just keep his mouth shut.
I've seen what he does and it was way worse when he first started.
Do you remember how much he used to gouge out of the money back then !

Anyway no biggy. Welcome !
Click to expand...

You mean back whe his entry fees were 30 and he kept 5 for registration fees. Yeah. I wish more tours would gouge like that. Lol.

Thanks 4 the welcome.
 
:embarrassed2: I give up. It just struck me very odd that Janis would be one to throw stones @ GSBT.

You all may know alot more about MJ than I do.
But why would he do a thing like that ? That idk, do you ?

Anyway, carry on and enjoy ! :)
 
I have seen a zillion arguements concerning greensfees vs added monies with TD costs on the side !

Maybe these things should be more transparent.

I went to events 30 years ago in Fla and when they said it was x amount added it was just that. But it was easier to see because there was no greensfees and the rooms did the event themselves, no cost at all !

You do not see that kind of event anymore !
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top