Washing the CB
- Thread starter lfigueroa
- Start date
So what if everyone decides, "Oh. Having the CB cleaned every dozen or so shots cuts down on skids. I think I'll start doing that."
Then, you have problems because of time, CBs and/or markers being dropped and moving balls (like they were during LVC run), and you're introducing the likelihood of arguments about where exactly the CB was.
And say, if one clean ball is good, can you logically deny that cleaning the whole set is even better? I mean, why stop at cleaning one ball when you have nine to 15 other potential culprits on the table?
So why stop there, if chalk and crap on the balls is the issue? THEN guys can ask for the whole table to be brushed and the pockets and ball returns wiped down every 14 shots.
Chalk ends up on the table, rails, returns, pockets, and balls. It's pool. Get over it. My point was that if there's a hair or an obvious chunk of crap on the ball, fine, have it removed. That happens. But cleaning the CB very 14 shots -- that's bull-shee-toe.
Lou Figueroa
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Cleaning the cue ball and the other balls is important in 14.1, especially at the DCC. Why? Because everyone having a high run dreams of breaking Mosconi's record. To be an official World Record, there are certain certifications required. Not all high runs could be considered as breaking the record.
So why is it important now? Diamond pockets are smaller with a longer shelf requiring more accuracy and a skid during a high run could be disastrous.
So why is it important now? Diamond pockets are smaller with a longer shelf requiring more accuracy and a skid during a high run could be disastrous.
Of course. But IMO the mountain should get steeper the higher up the player climbs. Yes, the CB and OBs and table get dirtier the longer the run goes on. Perhaps the humidity (and sweat) factor goes up too.
And that's what makes a high run so great. We should't be putting escalators on Mt. Everest.
Lou Figueroa
What's an extra 96.05555555555556 hours among friends:grin: I can see how it could be a problem with a venue the size of DCC. There would have to be rules put in place to control it if it was a common practice among players.
As it happens, someone sent me a link and I just ordered one.
It doesn't come with Michaela.
So we should put sand on the high jump track???
Oh no, not at all - I've always thought spelling in English is a joke so I was playing
along with the game.
Dale
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Pinkies out?
Since its not a true dbl elim. event, these kinda things come up. Match play, ya do see guys wiping down whitey while some are still rackin' no big deal.
Unusual....sounds right.
But come on Lou, remember were dealing with pool players.
And being able to do this probably gave him an advantage, and pool players are Always lookin' for that little extra somethin''''
.:thumbup2:
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Very Excessive
I thought the cue ball being cleaned in Lee Vann's run was way,way to many times.I geuss cleaning the cue ball every now and then like after every 4 racks or so wouldn't be so bad but at an average of 2 times a rack if I might say so is to much or is that nit picking.I suppose since it happened when he wasn't in a match it wasn't so bad but, if it was in a match would it have been ok for the other player to object to the cue ball being cleaned so much.
Many players had many runs end on a skid and it sucks but that's the game. I think its important not to alter the game once it starts. I think there is no doubt many players would have many higher runs if the cue ball was cleaned this many times especially Willie Mosconi.
The game of 14.1 cleaning the cue ball a lot makes a huge difference compared to all the other games concerning breaking the balls apart as the cue ball can have more spin and speed to do so which is not needed in 9 ball,10 ball,one pocket etc.Running 225 by anyone is a huge feat and being that was Lee Vann is a bonus and if he learned better pattern play and cue ball control there is no doubt he could run over 200 every month he plays as he is a machine that could easily go hours without missing a ball.
I personally have run over 200 many times and my high run is 311 in which ended on a skid which could have happened from a couple of things and if the cue ball was cleaned maybe the run would have been longer.I try and have all the balls cleaned before a run starts and have never cleaned the balls playing 14.1 once a run started unless there was something on the cue ball like a piece of hair or lint.
At least Lee Vann's run was using a neutral towel with no silicone or wax on it.Lee Vann's run didn't set any record but there are many runs that can have a small * or ? next to the run in my opinion from excessive cleaning or using a personal towel with something on it or putting the cue ball in their pants pocket to clean or polish.
When Jay Helfert had to leave the Tournament directors job at the US Open 9-Ball Tournament last year I had to take his place and part of the job was to Referee the matches and in 1 GAME Corey Deuel had me clean the cue ball 4 times. After the match he apologized and said with so much at stake including making the Mosconi Cup he hated to lose from a skid and I told him I understood but I thought it was excessive.
All in all its a Gentleman's game and I only wish my health gets better soon to be able to put up some good runs and enjoy playing again.
I thought the cue ball being cleaned in Lee Vann's run was way,way to many times.I geuss cleaning the cue ball every now and then like after every 4 racks or so wouldn't be so bad but at an average of 2 times a rack if I might say so is to much or is that nit picking.I suppose since it happened when he wasn't in a match it wasn't so bad but, if it was in a match would it have been ok for the other player to object to the cue ball being cleaned so much.
Many players had many runs end on a skid and it sucks but that's the game. I think its important not to alter the game once it starts. I think there is no doubt many players would have many higher runs if the cue ball was cleaned this many times especially Willie Mosconi.
The game of 14.1 cleaning the cue ball a lot makes a huge difference compared to all the other games concerning breaking the balls apart as the cue ball can have more spin and speed to do so which is not needed in 9 ball,10 ball,one pocket etc.Running 225 by anyone is a huge feat and being that was Lee Vann is a bonus and if he learned better pattern play and cue ball control there is no doubt he could run over 200 every month he plays as he is a machine that could easily go hours without missing a ball.
I personally have run over 200 many times and my high run is 311 in which ended on a skid which could have happened from a couple of things and if the cue ball was cleaned maybe the run would have been longer.I try and have all the balls cleaned before a run starts and have never cleaned the balls playing 14.1 once a run started unless there was something on the cue ball like a piece of hair or lint.
At least Lee Vann's run was using a neutral towel with no silicone or wax on it.Lee Vann's run didn't set any record but there are many runs that can have a small * or ? next to the run in my opinion from excessive cleaning or using a personal towel with something on it or putting the cue ball in their pants pocket to clean or polish.
When Jay Helfert had to leave the Tournament directors job at the US Open 9-Ball Tournament last year I had to take his place and part of the job was to Referee the matches and in 1 GAME Corey Deuel had me clean the cue ball 4 times. After the match he apologized and said with so much at stake including making the Mosconi Cup he hated to lose from a skid and I told him I understood but I thought it was excessive.
All in all its a Gentleman's game and I only wish my health gets better soon to be able to put up some good runs and enjoy playing again.
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For anyone stimulated via this thread to see or order one of the position markers
(mighty hard to find in my experience) just being helpful, no proprietary interest:
I’ve been playing 14.1 for 64 years and this is the best price (see link below) that I've ever seen ($4.73), on one of these hard to find ball position markers (and with free shipping yet). I sincerely hope the mold maker and the ejection mold operator get at least a fair living wage at the Chinese manufacturing plant, and are adult workers. No chance of OSHA-quality health standards for them unfortunately.
I ordered one and mine arrived from China only a week after ordering and it's not only beautiful, flawlessly clear acrylic, but it's dead-on accurate with regard to an extremely perfect fit against the standard 2 1/4 cue ball. Not a whisker of a gap.
http://www.suntekstore.com/goods-13002254-Crystal+Position+Marker+for+Snooker+Pool+Ball.html
(They also sell one that’s perfect for Snooker-size balls.)
Arnaldo
(mighty hard to find in my experience) just being helpful, no proprietary interest:
I’ve been playing 14.1 for 64 years and this is the best price (see link below) that I've ever seen ($4.73), on one of these hard to find ball position markers (and with free shipping yet). I sincerely hope the mold maker and the ejection mold operator get at least a fair living wage at the Chinese manufacturing plant, and are adult workers. No chance of OSHA-quality health standards for them unfortunately.
I ordered one and mine arrived from China only a week after ordering and it's not only beautiful, flawlessly clear acrylic, but it's dead-on accurate with regard to an extremely perfect fit against the standard 2 1/4 cue ball. Not a whisker of a gap.
http://www.suntekstore.com/goods-13002254-Crystal+Position+Marker+for+Snooker+Pool+Ball.html
(They also sell one that’s perfect for Snooker-size balls.)
Arnaldo
I have no horse in this race but here's how I will do it when I rule the world:
* In rotation games and 8-ball, you can clean the ball between racks or after a foul (i.e., any time you can legally pick up the cue ball.)
* In 14.1 you can clean the ball after a scratch or you can get an official to clean the ball between racks.
One exception: if the match allows player breaks, an official can clean the cue ball during a player breaks.
In other words, under my benevolent rule you can't stop the game just to clean the cue ball. The penalty for an infraction shall be a "Turtle Baker".
* In rotation games and 8-ball, you can clean the ball between racks or after a foul (i.e., any time you can legally pick up the cue ball.)
* In 14.1 you can clean the ball after a scratch or you can get an official to clean the ball between racks.
One exception: if the match allows player breaks, an official can clean the cue ball during a player breaks.
In other words, under my benevolent rule you can't stop the game just to clean the cue ball. The penalty for an infraction shall be a "Turtle Baker".
So you're playing nine ball and your opponent misses the 7 due to a horrible skid. To get on the 8 you need soft inside english -- a stroke which is relatively prone to skids. You look at the cue ball and it has two dozen blue spots on it because your opponent is using a new brand of chalk that really sticks to the cue ball.
Is it fair for you to ask the ref to clean the cue ball?
Bob,
You know better than to try and use logic here. jeesh...I mean, what are you trying to do, make sense?! :thumbup:
So I had two different responses written and deleted them both because in this case, I agree with two contradictory opinions on this:
From the player's point of view, "I'm playing for my livelihood and need equipment in good shape; they replace baseballs every time they touch the ground!"
From the spectator's view, "quit stopping the match to clean the cue ball and play!"
I think the ultimate, and wholly unrealistic, solution is:
1. Institute a governing body for pool that enforces stuff
2. Define equipment rules that dictate characteristics of chalk such that chalk doesn't gunk up the cue ball.
3. Only allow cleaning the cue ball during natural breaks in the match.
Given the estimates I have seen of a 1/200 chance of a skid, that may well be exactly the difference between a 225 ball run and a 155 ball one. Sounds, to me, like more people should be making the same request. I just don't see the macho appeal in losing because of some dirt.
Thank you kindly.