u gamble???HA ha sorry Im from Tx..Jokin just jokin buddy...U gonna make it to the Texas open?
And in My opinion gamble helps for sure..I think every great player started out gambling with the exception of maybe a couple...
Does gambling improve your game?
- Thread starter Sw10balltour
- Start date
u gamble???HA ha sorry Im from Tx..Jokin just jokin buddy...U gonna make it to the Texas open?
And in My opinion gamble helps for sure..I think every great player started out gambling with the exception of maybe a couple...
I'm kind of on the fence about this,and always have been.
To an extent,it HAS improved mine,but only as it relates to tournament play,if that makes sense.
I'm not a "gambler" in the purest sense. Occasionally,I might bet like 50 bucks on say the Super Bowl,or back in the day when you could go to a major tournament and find the right guy and bet on individual matches where the line is too strong.
But,you won't see me belly up to a machine with it's back to the wall sayin "come get some",or sitting in a 20/40 cash game,putting my cues up as collateral,etc.
On the other hand,with let's say 5k a month I could set on fire and never miss it,who knows?
To me,playing pool for money is a calculated risk more than a gambling proposition,which I equate to casino-type stuff.
Let's face it though,how many people out there will give you 115% effort without some kind of monetary reward at the end?
Even if you find a player that will try to kill you so to speak for free,how often do you find people that can run out all day and not have something to show for it? Hence my participation in betting on myself.
I've always used the stuff I've learned playing for the cash to improve my overall TOURNAMENT play.
When finding good,winnable games was easier in my neck of the woods and I'd make a good score,in my mind this was my reward for outplaying whoever it was that night,and buy CD's,shit like that. The money was always secondary to the win itself,and the quality of play that led to it.
That was also in a period when disposable income was plentiful.
These days,if I come up with 500 cash I can just use anyway I want,I have more constructive uses for it than just go looking for a player of near-pro speed to shoot that money at,that will play EVEN.
I've never wanted to really live off what I make playing pool,unless it was pure tournament winnings. I figured out a LONG time ago that unless I wanted to live in my car and turn it into a grind and find sponsorship,it wasn't gonna happen,even back in the PBT days.
However,my competitive fire is unextinguishable,and since decent tournaments are basically dead in my area,betting on myself still helps me improve. Tommy D.
To an extent,it HAS improved mine,but only as it relates to tournament play,if that makes sense.
I'm not a "gambler" in the purest sense. Occasionally,I might bet like 50 bucks on say the Super Bowl,or back in the day when you could go to a major tournament and find the right guy and bet on individual matches where the line is too strong.
But,you won't see me belly up to a machine with it's back to the wall sayin "come get some",or sitting in a 20/40 cash game,putting my cues up as collateral,etc.
On the other hand,with let's say 5k a month I could set on fire and never miss it,who knows?
To me,playing pool for money is a calculated risk more than a gambling proposition,which I equate to casino-type stuff.
Let's face it though,how many people out there will give you 115% effort without some kind of monetary reward at the end?
Even if you find a player that will try to kill you so to speak for free,how often do you find people that can run out all day and not have something to show for it? Hence my participation in betting on myself.
I've always used the stuff I've learned playing for the cash to improve my overall TOURNAMENT play.
When finding good,winnable games was easier in my neck of the woods and I'd make a good score,in my mind this was my reward for outplaying whoever it was that night,and buy CD's,shit like that. The money was always secondary to the win itself,and the quality of play that led to it.
That was also in a period when disposable income was plentiful.
These days,if I come up with 500 cash I can just use anyway I want,I have more constructive uses for it than just go looking for a player of near-pro speed to shoot that money at,that will play EVEN.
I've never wanted to really live off what I make playing pool,unless it was pure tournament winnings. I figured out a LONG time ago that unless I wanted to live in my car and turn it into a grind and find sponsorship,it wasn't gonna happen,even back in the PBT days.
However,my competitive fire is unextinguishable,and since decent tournaments are basically dead in my area,betting on myself still helps me improve. Tommy D.
Practice is what keeps you in stroke, but competing is what keeps you fit to bring your skills to the table in competition. If it's gambling or playing for time, or playing in a tournament, I'm always a lot sharper if I play others regularly.
If I don't compete for awhile, when I do I'm a lot more nervous and don't play my best. We all can play great alone, but put some heat on and then let's see how we do. If I gamble, I just play cheap and that's enough to keep me sharp - but I admit it's be awhile since I've really matched up for anything more than time, dinner, or whatever.
Chris
If I don't compete for awhile, when I do I'm a lot more nervous and don't play my best. We all can play great alone, but put some heat on and then let's see how we do. If I gamble, I just play cheap and that's enough to keep me sharp - but I admit it's be awhile since I've really matched up for anything more than time, dinner, or whatever.
Chris
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You're speaking for me too. I was stuck for a few years before I really started playing for money. Since then, every shot I take means something. It makes losing that much worse and winning that much better, no matter how much you bet. I still have a long way to go til I'm even decent. But I can tell you, it's improved my game and it's only getting better.
The biggest thing I think it does is puts more importance on playing the "right" shot and understanding the odds.
I've heard the great Pinoys always play workout sets for $20 to create incentive. In the states this attitude is not common, tho it should be. When Busta/Luaut were in town 15 yrs ago, Busty gladly played $20 sets, Luat wanted more of a bet, so, I played Busta even and Luat with a few on the wire, was fun and a good workout.
Same here.
gambling
There are pros & cons to either side of this issue. Keep in mind though that tourneyment play that actually pays any amount of real money is a recent development. When I was coming up with very rare exception they didn't exist. You had a lot of 5 & dime gigs, but not much that paid anything. In such an event the amount of pressure certainly has a plateau, not a very high one either. Today there are reasonable tourneyments that pay some decent coin. Also today I believe there are more quality players available for each event ergo more pressure.
Practice, drills, instruction, casual play all have their place in improving a playeers ability. But the mental part of the game is essential to positive growth. This in my experience is best accomplished by competition. While tourneyments provide pressure & competition they are structured with lull periods. Gambling on the other hand especially grinding is a constant pressure. Different people respond different. I have seen players who play great till $ enters the picture & I have seen others who played lackluster at best till $ showed up. We all have our own strengths & weaknesses.
I did come up gambling & contrary to a previous post I read not all gamblers look for the weak to prey upon. I looked for better players or at least like speed. I did play tourneyments & league, but we always gambled afterwards. Nothing sharpens your mental game like having $ taken out of your pocket. The stakes are relative, among friends reasonable amounts. If you are trying to climb the ladder the stakes increase. When I make a mistake gambling & it cost me $ my concentration increases exponentially. My mistakes decrease, my game improves & my winning % increases. When I am playing well, performing properly & winning I will consciencely or not be aware of what I am doing right & continue to expound upon that thereby improving my game through correct repitition. I will add here winning or losing I can learn from my opponents & use that to improve my game. I learn from what I do right , my mistakes & what my opponents do. Gambling provides me with one means to focusing my attention. This carrys over to all aspect of my game.
However I do not find it necessary to always gamble. I sincerely love the game. Many has been the time that players wanted to play me but did not want to gamble. I have absolutely no problem playing for the fun of the game. Damn I'm long winded!!!! :embarrassed2: Anyway that's my bit fellows. Good luck & good pool Billy Bones :thumbup:
There are pros & cons to either side of this issue. Keep in mind though that tourneyment play that actually pays any amount of real money is a recent development. When I was coming up with very rare exception they didn't exist. You had a lot of 5 & dime gigs, but not much that paid anything. In such an event the amount of pressure certainly has a plateau, not a very high one either. Today there are reasonable tourneyments that pay some decent coin. Also today I believe there are more quality players available for each event ergo more pressure.
Practice, drills, instruction, casual play all have their place in improving a playeers ability. But the mental part of the game is essential to positive growth. This in my experience is best accomplished by competition. While tourneyments provide pressure & competition they are structured with lull periods. Gambling on the other hand especially grinding is a constant pressure. Different people respond different. I have seen players who play great till $ enters the picture & I have seen others who played lackluster at best till $ showed up. We all have our own strengths & weaknesses.
I did come up gambling & contrary to a previous post I read not all gamblers look for the weak to prey upon. I looked for better players or at least like speed. I did play tourneyments & league, but we always gambled afterwards. Nothing sharpens your mental game like having $ taken out of your pocket. The stakes are relative, among friends reasonable amounts. If you are trying to climb the ladder the stakes increase. When I make a mistake gambling & it cost me $ my concentration increases exponentially. My mistakes decrease, my game improves & my winning % increases. When I am playing well, performing properly & winning I will consciencely or not be aware of what I am doing right & continue to expound upon that thereby improving my game through correct repitition. I will add here winning or losing I can learn from my opponents & use that to improve my game. I learn from what I do right , my mistakes & what my opponents do. Gambling provides me with one means to focusing my attention. This carrys over to all aspect of my game.
However I do not find it necessary to always gamble. I sincerely love the game. Many has been the time that players wanted to play me but did not want to gamble. I have absolutely no problem playing for the fun of the game. Damn I'm long winded!!!! :embarrassed2: Anyway that's my bit fellows. Good luck & good pool Billy Bones :thumbup:
You sir sound like a man that truly loves the game. I really respect that. I have seen too many decent players lose their passion for the game and become obsessed with their next big score. You would never see these guys just playing for fun because to them pool really wasn't fun anymore. I have always thought that was sad. It doesn't surprise me that many top players end up putting down their cues and heading to the poker tables.
Gambling doesn't directly improve your game. SPARRING improves your game immensely. If you can get into heated competition where both players want to win and both have to try extremely hard to win, both players will see dividends after a few sessions. Sparring can be for thousands of dollars or it can be for a soda or even just pride, it all depends on what kind of stakes get your juices boiling. It usually doesn't work too well if the match up is one sided or if there is heavy weight involved because the game is changed too much from actual competition in either case. You have to create a situation where both players are playing exactly how they would in a tournament finals to get the best results.
I would argue that sparring has improved my game beyond any amount of practice that I could have done alone, although it is often helpful to practice by yourself if you find weak spots in your game. The most difficult part of this is finding a sparring partner that will try as hard as you for whatever stakes you want and who isn't just trying to relieve you of your paycheck and who is available to play often. Also, having multiple sparring partners always helps so you don't just get used to playing against one style of play.
I would argue that sparring has improved my game beyond any amount of practice that I could have done alone, although it is often helpful to practice by yourself if you find weak spots in your game. The most difficult part of this is finding a sparring partner that will try as hard as you for whatever stakes you want and who isn't just trying to relieve you of your paycheck and who is available to play often. Also, having multiple sparring partners always helps so you don't just get used to playing against one style of play.
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Excellent post! :thumbup: That said, I believe that "putting something" on the line helps to build "heart" under pressure...which is something that cannot be taught. It only is developed through combat...either in the 'pit' or on the tournament table.
Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com
Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com
Some people need motivation to focus better.
There are many things that can help you to focus better.
Gambling could be one of them.
If you pay attention, you will play better.
Most people pay attention when they have money on the line.
Some people pay attention when they have anything on the line.
A few people pay attention when they approach any table.
A couple of people pay attention when they walk in the pool room.
There are many things that can help you to focus better.
Gambling could be one of them.
If you pay attention, you will play better.
Most people pay attention when they have money on the line.
Some people pay attention when they have anything on the line.
A few people pay attention when they approach any table.
A couple of people pay attention when they walk in the pool room.
My perspective.... if we were able to ask this same question on here 20 years ago, I think the results would strongly favor gambling improves your game. As we see it now, it seems to be the opposite. There has definitely been a change in the way pool players think in the US. Unfortunately, the proof is in the pudding. We have one top tier young player now (SVB), 20 years ago i'd say we had 15 or 20. And people know how much Philipinos love to gamble, right? And look at them.
I think one of the strongest points to make here is, depending on where you live, there aren't enough good tournaments to play in. I do think good tournaments can improve a person's game immensely, but this route is not always possible. If you wanna play strong pool to your highest potential, it is very likely that you must gamble.
I think one of the strongest points to make here is, depending on where you live, there aren't enough good tournaments to play in. I do think good tournaments can improve a person's game immensely, but this route is not always possible. If you wanna play strong pool to your highest potential, it is very likely that you must gamble.
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Well said.I agree with all of that.John B.
Gambling won't always improve your skills, but it sure as heck will teach you how to win. I'm talking about improving your strategy to be able to win, and not always having to run balls to do it. Safety play, playing percentages and so on. I believe your game management skills will be what improves the most. Execution is something you learn and develop through practice, not in a game situation.
My 2 cents.
Dave
My 2 cents.
Dave
I think gambling will help u focus but not play better...no matter how much money that is on the line will tell you the right odds on whether to take a really hard cut shot or to duck and play safe...If you do gamble tho & book a few losers..it will make you re-evaluate your game to see where you most need improvement on....JMO
gambling 2
Dave those are the skills of a Pool Player. Once you reach a certain level pocketing balls is a piece of cake. I can pocket balls all day long either hand. Every pool shooter out there can pocket balls. But there is a huge difference between pool shooters & pool players. It is huge. The skills you describe is what makes a person a pool player & a winner. I will however take minor exception to the last sentence. True enough practice can teach you the "how to" portion & you will attain a certain level of profiency, but the ability to truely execute is learned under pressure in real game situations where you can lose & where losing actually means something & conversely where you can win & winning is an objective you truely wish to achieve. There is no substitute for that. It developes what the "Hustler" character "Eddie Felson" referred to as Character in a pool player. Good stuff.
Chinchilla post is very valid indeed. As a player from that era,... I completely concur. Very good stuff all around fellows. I do believe I will post a new thread on my personal perspectives on the subject of gambling in pool. Good luck & good pool fellows. Billy Bones :thumbup:
Dave those are the skills of a Pool Player. Once you reach a certain level pocketing balls is a piece of cake. I can pocket balls all day long either hand. Every pool shooter out there can pocket balls. But there is a huge difference between pool shooters & pool players. It is huge. The skills you describe is what makes a person a pool player & a winner. I will however take minor exception to the last sentence. True enough practice can teach you the "how to" portion & you will attain a certain level of profiency, but the ability to truely execute is learned under pressure in real game situations where you can lose & where losing actually means something & conversely where you can win & winning is an objective you truely wish to achieve. There is no substitute for that. It developes what the "Hustler" character "Eddie Felson" referred to as Character in a pool player. Good stuff.
Chinchilla post is very valid indeed. As a player from that era,... I completely concur. Very good stuff all around fellows. I do believe I will post a new thread on my personal perspectives on the subject of gambling in pool. Good luck & good pool fellows. Billy Bones :thumbup:
I'll say one thing with respect to your post, I think i'm just stating what you said differently:
What really gets a player playing good is losing, the more the better. I have seen this too many times and I know it is the truth. The more it hurts (=losing a bunch), the more capacity there is for improvement. You can't really get this playing 10 dollar tournaments.
Regards! I'd rep you twice but it wont let me
TheThaiger
Banned
I disagree.
The problem with pool (in the UK at least) is, there's too many moderate players with very low levels of intelligence, who think they're the best thing since sliced bread, with a unique talent. They lie, cheat and scam their way around a table, and this deters casual players from playing the game more seriously. They won't play unless there's an easy score on the cards, and give nothing back to the game whatsoever.
Pool is dying because of gambling and lowlifes. Pool needs to attract a more educated and refined crowd. It desperately needs to modernise.
Sorry wise one but can't agree here at all. Anytime you get up and play with some sort of pressure on yourself, you are forced to focus and remember what has happened and to put the ball down.
i have seen a few who play real well for AIR, but rarely for very long.
Sorry but without the competition, I just don't see the point of the game.
When playing alone, welll as they say, "Water runs downhill"!
And absolutely no disrespect intended here!
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