Most racks ever run on a Valley bar box

[Straightpool_99]

Isn't this thread a moot point? What major 8 ball tournies are on Valley 7ft tables?

Did you read the OP? The Valley bar box is probably one of the worlds most common tables. It's been the industry standard for bar tables for decades, and is found in every hole in the wall bar as well as more upscale places around the world, except the Commonwealth, where the UK bar tables rule.

It's an easy table to pocket balls on. The rails are usually not too springy, and it is cloth is usually fairly slow. The conditions are there to make big runs possible (when they are not too run down) and they are found everywhere.

I don't care what some you think may or may not be possible. I wanted to know about the things that took place, not what some guy thinks is possible or not. So called- and real "experts" get proven wrong all the time, quite recently on this very forum. They never have to apologize or be held accountable in any way, they simply change their explanations without ever admitting to being wrong. How many pool room "experts" have been proven wrong over the years, I wonder? I guy once told me I would never run 100 balls and should quit pool. While he was probably right about the last thing:grin:, I sure proved him wrong about the 100 balls part. Don't take the words of naysayers such as that guy too seriously. They are usually bitter, nobodies that project their own failures onto others. I say f'em all!

I especially do not care what the main tourneys are played on. They are usually races to 7,8, 9 or sometimes 11...Such a format is not ideal for the big runs, is it? I bet that there are people nobody's ever heard of, in small towns around the world that has run a dozen racks on these tables, as well as pros gambling against local people etc. That was what I wanted to hear about. Thank you to all that contributed such stories. Even if some should turn out to be false, at least by hearing about them we get to check them out.

 

[nine_ball6970]

Did you read the OP? The Valley bar box is probably one of the worlds most common tables. It's been the industry standard for bar tables for decades, and is found in every hole the wall bar as well as more upscale places around the world, except the Commonwealth, where the UK bar tables rule.

It's an easy table to pocket balls on. The rails are usually not too springy, and it is cloth is usually fairly slow. The conditions are there to make big runs possible (when they are not too run down) and they are found everywhere.

I don't care what some you think may or may not be possible. I wanted to know about the things that took place, not what some guy thinks is possible or not. So called- and real "experts" get proven wrong all the time, quite recently on this very forum. They never have to apologize or be held accountable in any way, they simply change their explanations without ever admitting to being wrong. How many pool room "experts" have been proven wrong over the years, I wonder? I guy once told me I would never run 100 balls and should quit pool. While he was probably right about the last thing:grin:, I sure proved him wrong about the 100 balls part. Don't take the words of naysayers such as that guy too seriously. They are usually bitter, nobodies that project their own failures onto others. I say f'em all!

I especially do not care what the main tourneys are played on. They are usually races to 7,8, 9 or sometimes 11...Such a format is not ideal for the big runs, is it? I bet that there are people nobody's ever heard of, in small towns around the world that has run a dozen racks on these tables, as well as pros gambling against local people etc. That was what I wanted to hear about. Thank you to all that contributed such stories. Even if some should turn out to be false, at least by hearing about them we get to check them out.

http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=144095&page=2

Old thread. Looks like Souquet ran 27 racks of 8 ball playing on a 9 footer.

http://billiardsdigest.com/forums/archive/index.php/t-5543.html

Says Jimmy Moore ran 27 racks at $100 a game but does not say what game they were playing.

For all of the people who say these runs are not possible, it isn't like they do this every day or on command. It is a record. I would think the hardest thing for top pros would be to make a ball on the break 20+ times in a row and never scratch.

Most of my packages come to an end due to a dry break.

 

[realkingcobra]

http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=144095&page=2

Old thread. Looks like Souquet ran 27 racks of 8 ball playing on a 9 footer.

http://billiardsdigest.com/forums/archive/index.php/t-5543.html

Says Jimmy Moore ran 27 racks at $100 a game but does not say what game they were playing.

For all of the people who say these runs are not possible, it isn't like they do this every day or on command. It is a record. I would think the hardest thing for top pros would be to make a ball on the break 20+ times in a row and never scratch.

Most of my packages come to an end due to a dry break.

Record's are records when the accomplishments can be verified with facts, as in the 14.1 record of 526 balls being ran.

 

[Skippy27]

You get 49 other people to put up $100 and I think Shane or a couple other top players would dedicate a couple days to playing barbox 8 ball on a valley.

The dollar amount needs to be worth their time and $100 won't get them in the box.

If they are paying $100 ($5k for your way) every time they fail, then I bet they won't even try it as they know the odds of them doing it are pretty much zilch.

 

[nine_ball6970]

Record's are records when the accomplishments can be verified with facts, as in the 14.1 record of 526 balls being ran.

Would be pretty easy to verify if Ralf did it by asking him and seeing if there were any witnesses to the run.

 

[nine_ball6970]

If they are paying $100 ($5k for your way) every time they fail, then I bet they won't even try it as they know the odds of them doing it are pretty much zilch.

Why would they have to pay money when they don't do it? That was not what I proposed.

The odds are definitely miniscule but it is not out of the realm of possibility for a top pro to run 20+ racks on a valley.

They would need some sort of incentive to try to do it. Setting a record only matters to the posters on AZ.

 

[nine_ball6970]

Sounds like that might have been the US Open 8-Ball Championship, played in July, 2015. The B&R percentage for the 17 streamed matches in that event was 52%. Here is the my stats thread on that event: http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=403403

Also, see post #3 of that thread for a comparison of 8-Ball on 7-footers vs. 9-footers. Pretty similar stats.

Out of curiosity, what was the break and run percentage for Dennis and Mike D respectively?

I was there for the finals and it felt like whoever got the first shot after the break ran out in all but one game. Pure offense and running many tough racks. Mike lost because he broke dry a couple times.

 

[Get_A_Grip]

Dave Matlock

I'm surprised that nobody has mentioned Dave Matlock. Here is an old thread that mentions that Dave has run 23 racks in a row, as well as other people having run over 15 and 18 racks.

http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=197655

 

[chitownnorth]

I'm surprised that nobody has mentioned Dave Matlock. Here is an old thread that mentions that Dave has run 23 racks in a row, as well as other people having run over 15 and 18 racks.

http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=197655

The guy that posted that didn't remember if it was a bar box or a 9' table. And it was a 9 ball game, not 8 ball.

 

[Get_A_Grip]

The guy that posted that didn't remember if it was a bar box or a 9' table. And it was a 9 ball game, not 8 ball.

Yeah, I didn't read that thread in detail. But I'm sure that I've heard that Matlock has run many racks of 8-ball on a bar box. Maybe someone that is "in the know" can chime in and tell us how many 8-ball racks Matlock has run.

 

[realkingcobra]

Would be pretty easy to verify if Ralf did it by asking him and seeing if there were any witnesses to the run.

That's a good starting place.

 

[Skippy27]

Why would they have to pay money when they don't do it? That was not what I proposed.

The odds are definitely miniscule but it is not out of the realm of possibility for a top pro to run 20+ racks on a valley.

They would need some sort of incentive to try to do it. Setting a record only matters to the posters on AZ.

Because that is what a BET is. If you bet you can do something and someone bets you that you can't, then you pay for your failing and they pay for your success. That is the incentive -to win and not pay. Even pro players are not above that simple concept.

What kind of world do you live in that it works differently than that?

 

[Ken_4fun]

Question

Glen or others might know.

When Keith McCready was tearing up the West Coast and Dave Matlock was killing the Midwest, and Joey was on East Coast.

Were they all playing on Valley Bar Boxes all over the country (in the 1970's)?

Thanks for answering.

Ken

 

[nine_ball6970]

Because that is what a BET is. If you bet you can do something and someone bets you that you can't, then you pay for your failing and they pay for your success. That is the incentive -to win and not pay. Even pro players are not above that simple concept.

What kind of world do you live in that it works differently than that?

LMAO. So you want to bet someone $100 that they can't run 20 racks. Steal much? You said it is impossible so what kind of odds would you give them?

My suggestion wasn't a bet. It was simply people putting up money to see if pros would attempt it. A prize of sorts. Obviously if nobody does it, then you don't pay out.

 

[cueman]

No, a C player can't break and run 3 racks. I do not believe it. Any player who can is not a C player (in my opinion).

When I left Georgia for Missouri in 1993 Atlanta for several years had been running some large monthly handicapped tournaments. There were only three divisions A, B and C. The A division had what I would call top amateurs and pros. B division is what I played in. And C players were from fairly good to the very bottom. There were some C players who might catch a gear and run 3 racks on a bar table, but it would be a really rare occurrence as they were so inconsistent that they never won anything and kept being allowed to play in the C division.

Now that I am back in Georgia many rooms now run crazy handicaps that make it take all night to play a weekly event. It has taken my desire to stay active in the local tournament scene away.

My point is that the "C" player might be in an area that ranks people more like the old Atlanta system did. The old Atlanta system also only allowed players to play their own ranked players until the finals when they gave up a spot. They also only had two divisions per tournament.

 

[cueman]

Glen or others might know.

When Keith McCready was tearing up the West Coast and Dave Matlock was killing the Midwest, and Joey was on East Coast.

Were they all playing on Valley Bar Boxes all over the country (in the 1970's)?

Thanks for answering.

Ken

Valleys were pretty much it for bar tables in the south at the time. But there were a lot of 9 footers also. But to make a point, if you come forward into the early 80's in Georgia, Paul Turner was beating just about anyone who would get on a Valley 7 footer with him consistently.

Go to the late 80's and early 90's and Efren dominated the 8 Ball Valley bar box championships he played in consistently.

People can say what they want about luck being the biggest factor on a bar box. But it sure is funny how some people just seem to have so much consistent luck on a bar box.

 

[fastone371]

I am sorry, but I do not believe any of this. With 8 ball (and on a very small 7 foot bar table), there is usually at least 1 trouble ball that you need to break out to complete your run. If you broke and ran 12 racks straight, that is super strong. You are either a pro level player, or you got lay outs after the break that were not too difficult. 8 ball on a 9 foot table is a different story. Less chance for trouble balls, but still very difficult I think.

I have a Gold Crown with 4 1/2" pockets and a standard 7' Valley, both at home in my basement. I can break and run 8 ball on the Valley much easier then the GC. Same with playing the 9 ball ghost, I can beat him on the Valley but not the GC..............yet.

 

[realkingcobra]

Glen or others might know.

When Keith McCready was tearing up the West Coast and Dave Matlock was killing the Midwest, and Joey was on East Coast.

Were they all playing on Valley Bar Boxes all over the country (in the 1970's)?

Thanks for answering.

Ken

Most all coin op pool tables back then we're Valley bar boxes, and we're the only bar boxes ever supplied during tournaments.

 

[watchez]

I always heard that Dennis Searing ran a large number of racks in a row playing 8 ball on a bar table -- double digits but don't remember the exact amount. Maybe someone can ask him.

Roberto played Shane Winters on a Diamond bar table a few weeks ago - 8 ball, race to 10. Roberto was down 2-1 and Shane never shot again until Roberto was on the hill and believe it was a kick shot. Pretty sure they don't even have Diamond bar tables in the Philippines.

 

[jasonlaus]

I always heard that Dennis Searing ran a large number of racks in a row playing 8 ball on a bar table -- double digits but don't remember the exact amount. Maybe someone can ask him.

Roberto played Shane Winters on a Diamond bar table a few weeks ago - 8 ball, race to 10. Roberto was down 2-1 and Shane never shot again until Roberto was on the hill and believe it was a kick shot. Pretty sure they don't even have Diamond bar tables in the Philippines.

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