mlalum
Banned
Well I didn't say Justin did anything wrong. I said that when we argue it's my opinion that we disagree on his arguments.
Alex being Alex
- Thread starter sizl
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Well I didn't say Justin did anything wrong. I said that when we argue it's my opinion that we disagree on his arguments.
My "addiction" comment on Alex stems from the numerous times over the years where him and alcohol are discussed in the same sentence. There's more than what went on at the DCC. Not to drop the Billiards Digest cardgrin
If you can make it 10 days at derby and only drink one night, you don't have a drinking problem.
TAR brought us free action for a week. Dippy playing 1p for days on end and we get free entertainment. Dippy wants Frost to commentate, who is going to say no? We can all turn the volume down. If you didnt want to listen, you didnt have to. Dippy gives Frost $500.00 for it and Frost quits after an hour. It was entertaining. I wasn't the only one laughing. The Frost incident changed the pace of the night and added some color. Beav and TAR you have nothing to be sorry for. We were watching people gamble for our entertainment and it was FREE.
Thanks TAR! You rock! All the commentators did a great job.
Thanks TAR! You rock! All the commentators did a great job.
What the hell are you talking about?
I'm here talking about the Frost deal. I told you what happened and my opinion on it. What more responsibility am I supposed to take ? Just because I hold a different view on what constitutes an outrage and realistic answers to it than you doesn't mean I am dodging anything.
What exactly would you have me personally do to "take responsibility" for the Frost thing? Beav and I discussed it and agreed if a similar situation occurred in the future it will be handled different. Should I have issued a press release? Maybe call you for your input on the crisis?
Just because I don't choose to condemn everyone and everything because they are not perfect at all times does not mean I do not hold other people and myself to a standard I think appropriate and practical. When that
standard is not met I file it away and try to learn from it rather than post endlessly about how everything sucks.
As for the Alex deal I do feel someone made a bad choice to let the match go on. I am also fairly certain all involved will do things differently should something like this ever come up again and that is good enough for me. Just like with us and the Frost situation.
I posted most of what follows in the 14.1 forum but I think it belongs in this thread also.
I was there with Bill (I scored the game) so let me tell you what I know.
Alex wanted to forfeit the game. He was talked into playing it by Danny Diliberto, who told him he shouldn't disappoint all the people waiting to see the game. In response to someone (maybe Bill, I don't remember) saying Alex was in no condition to play, Danny said "don't worry, he'll play great, he'll play great." I love Danny, but he was wrong on that one. Alex was indeed in no condition to play.
There were a lot of people waiting for the game, but I think half of them were there to see the Alex show as opposed to top notch 14.1. If you remember the opening break, Alex called a one in a hundred shot and busted them open like it was an eight ball rack. He probably wanted Darren to run a hundred and get it over with. In his condition and with only $700 on the line (2500 vs. 1800), he didn't want to play any more pool that night. After eight days of pressure he chose to blow off some steam prematurely and he can rightly be criticized for that.
Believe me, Bill and I also wanted Darren to run a hundred and get it over with without further embarrassment. Bill did his best to keep Alex in line, warning him not to talk when Darren was shooting, but Alex couldn't stay quiet for long.
Some armchair quarterbacks think Bill should have stopped the contest, but would that have been better than what actually happened - Darren winning easily in a fairly quick game? I don't think so. There was no doubt that Darren would win, it was just a question of how often Alex would get to the table. The expected happened, people had some laughs and the game ended without the further controversy of an unsportsmanlike conduct ruling - something that happens once in a blue moon. I think Bill did just the right thing under the circumstances, people had a good time laughing with Alex and nobody got hurt.
I also thank Bill for not abandoning me in the final game. It was originally intended that he would get some sleep - he had to get up at 4 am for his flight - and I would run and score the final game by myself. Thanks, Bill, for staying and doing your best to keep things in line. I would have been at sea trying to do it by myself.
As for Alex - yes, he was in the wrong, but I can't think of another player that spreads more goodwill for pool wherever he goes. He is the modern day version of Minnesota Fats - a real crowd pleaser - and it seems everybody's friend. I don't really know him personally, but he is one guy who always seems happy and makes you a little happier when you're around him.
And kudos to Darren Appleton for having a good sense of humor about the whole thing. He could have lost his temper but he stayed cool and went with it.
Finally, to those complaining about paying good money for a bad game - correct me if I'm wrong, but you either paid 9.95 for all day Saturday or 5.95 for the last chance Saturday night special, which included the 9 ball final games and whatever straight pool was shown after. To my knowledge, Accu-stats wasn't offering a straight pool only option. I don't see how anyone can think they got cheated unless they think only straight pool counts as pool, which is an extreme position. 9 ball is a beautiful game also when played by these guys.
I was there with Bill (I scored the game) so let me tell you what I know.
Alex wanted to forfeit the game. He was talked into playing it by Danny Diliberto, who told him he shouldn't disappoint all the people waiting to see the game. In response to someone (maybe Bill, I don't remember) saying Alex was in no condition to play, Danny said "don't worry, he'll play great, he'll play great." I love Danny, but he was wrong on that one. Alex was indeed in no condition to play.
There were a lot of people waiting for the game, but I think half of them were there to see the Alex show as opposed to top notch 14.1. If you remember the opening break, Alex called a one in a hundred shot and busted them open like it was an eight ball rack. He probably wanted Darren to run a hundred and get it over with. In his condition and with only $700 on the line (2500 vs. 1800), he didn't want to play any more pool that night. After eight days of pressure he chose to blow off some steam prematurely and he can rightly be criticized for that.
Believe me, Bill and I also wanted Darren to run a hundred and get it over with without further embarrassment. Bill did his best to keep Alex in line, warning him not to talk when Darren was shooting, but Alex couldn't stay quiet for long.
Some armchair quarterbacks think Bill should have stopped the contest, but would that have been better than what actually happened - Darren winning easily in a fairly quick game? I don't think so. There was no doubt that Darren would win, it was just a question of how often Alex would get to the table. The expected happened, people had some laughs and the game ended without the further controversy of an unsportsmanlike conduct ruling - something that happens once in a blue moon. I think Bill did just the right thing under the circumstances, people had a good time laughing with Alex and nobody got hurt.
I also thank Bill for not abandoning me in the final game. It was originally intended that he would get some sleep - he had to get up at 4 am for his flight - and I would run and score the final game by myself. Thanks, Bill, for staying and doing your best to keep things in line. I would have been at sea trying to do it by myself.
As for Alex - yes, he was in the wrong, but I can't think of another player that spreads more goodwill for pool wherever he goes. He is the modern day version of Minnesota Fats - a real crowd pleaser - and it seems everybody's friend. I don't really know him personally, but he is one guy who always seems happy and makes you a little happier when you're around him.
And kudos to Darren Appleton for having a good sense of humor about the whole thing. He could have lost his temper but he stayed cool and went with it.
Finally, to those complaining about paying good money for a bad game - correct me if I'm wrong, but you either paid 9.95 for all day Saturday or 5.95 for the last chance Saturday night special, which included the 9 ball final games and whatever straight pool was shown after. To my knowledge, Accu-stats wasn't offering a straight pool only option. I don't see how anyone can think they got cheated unless they think only straight pool counts as pool, which is an extreme position. 9 ball is a beautiful game also when played by these guys.
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Amazingly enough, according to another thread, that someone greatly influencing the decision for Alex to play or forfeit was not the referree or the TD but the Accu-stats commentator. :grin-square:
"Alex wanted to forfeit the game. He was talked into playing it by Danny Diliberto, who told him he shouldn't disappoint all the people waiting to see the game. In response to someone (maybe Bill, I don't remember) saying Alex was in no condition to play, Danny said "don't worry, he'll play great, he'll play great." I love Danny, but he was wrong on that one. Alex was indeed in no condition to play."
In the future, if a similar situation were to arise, the refs should consult with a astrologer or a Accu-stats commentator, if one is available. Who says pool isn't like a soap opera? :grin:
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A side note.
OK I said all I wanted to say in the 14.1 forum and Bill M has cleared up a lot of the nonsense and "who shot johns". I dont care anymore. Its over. But since his name was brought up in this thread I would like to commend the Beav for the great job he did with the TAR transmission. Just as I do with JFred over at accu-stats.
I have followed TAR since the inception and The Beav has grown so much into a great commentator and voice. He excels in keeping the show running and knows a lot more about the game and the people who surround it. His situation with the Scott Frost debacle will only make him
a stronger host thus making TAR an institution. Great Job Beav. Now teach the Canucks about 1 pocket will you.
Mr Wu
OK I said all I wanted to say in the 14.1 forum and Bill M has cleared up a lot of the nonsense and "who shot johns". I dont care anymore. Its over. But since his name was brought up in this thread I would like to commend the Beav for the great job he did with the TAR transmission. Just as I do with JFred over at accu-stats.
I have followed TAR since the inception and The Beav has grown so much into a great commentator and voice. He excels in keeping the show running and knows a lot more about the game and the people who surround it. His situation with the Scott Frost debacle will only make him
a stronger host thus making TAR an institution. Great Job Beav. Now teach the Canucks about 1 pocket will you.
Mr Wu
Ditto. Beav does a great job.
There would have been no stream without Beav this year. I was out sick for half the trip and would of packed it in if it wasn't for Beav, Dave and Nathan. Dave and Nathan went down with the crud late in the week putting even more weight on Beav and he handled it like a champ.
Anyone who enjoyed any part of the TAR stream this year got to see it because he put in a fantastic effort all week. Dave and Nathan with Runout Media picked up a lot of my slack as well and I really appreciate all the work all of them did.
Pool has not changed and most likely will not, just the names and faces change IMO. Most people you meet in the small pool sub culture know this. It is 50/50 that the people you meet are either good people or scumbags, a little more than the regular world but not by much.
I love the game and also the gambling too, I enjoy the fun spectator part that you see on Accu-Stats and then the darker side which people would not widely see in the past which you get a small taste of on TAR. Does TAR benefit the sport, sure they do, the appeal of it all is it being somewhat uncensored. I did not hear what went on with Frost on TAR personally, just a few people who spoke about it, I was sleeping like a good lad I believe.
I try to contribute positively to the game but am not perfect and have showed my a$$ at times too but most will say I am a good guy. I really think this year will determine whether I expend much more time and energy into it all and perhaps I will withdraw a bit because some stuff I just do not care for some stuff when you get really deep behind the scenes. I still will enjoy the game just a bit more privately like I did in the past and keep improving because that makes it joyous for me. I will be in a pool room or bar someplace looking for a sucker or two and maybe I will see you there. :smile:
P.S. Wasn't that Hustler movie great?, didn't we all want to be Newman taking down the scores and picking off the suckers?, he got drunk and showed his a$$ too. :wink:
I love the game and also the gambling too, I enjoy the fun spectator part that you see on Accu-Stats and then the darker side which people would not widely see in the past which you get a small taste of on TAR. Does TAR benefit the sport, sure they do, the appeal of it all is it being somewhat uncensored. I did not hear what went on with Frost on TAR personally, just a few people who spoke about it, I was sleeping like a good lad I believe.
I try to contribute positively to the game but am not perfect and have showed my a$$ at times too but most will say I am a good guy. I really think this year will determine whether I expend much more time and energy into it all and perhaps I will withdraw a bit because some stuff I just do not care for some stuff when you get really deep behind the scenes. I still will enjoy the game just a bit more privately like I did in the past and keep improving because that makes it joyous for me. I will be in a pool room or bar someplace looking for a sucker or two and maybe I will see you there. :smile:
P.S. Wasn't that Hustler movie great?, didn't we all want to be Newman taking down the scores and picking off the suckers?, he got drunk and showed his a$$ too. :wink:
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This needs to be quoted a few times for all the guys condemning alex...
Wow, what an unfortunate incident, but I can't say I'm all that surprised! Alex is one of my favourite pool players.
I know he was probably sorry he didn't snap the overall DCC title, but if he did, I have a feeling he would have gambled the prize money away pretty soon.
It is frustrating to see one of the best pool players ever destroying himself like this...:frown: Yes, people say that he always has a smile on his face, but does that mean he's a happy person?
He doesn't need critics, he needs help and support. I wish somebody would help him somehow (not financially because money would only ruin him further). His pool game is as good as humanly possible. All his problems are away from the pool table. You don't need to know him personally to see that...
I know he was probably sorry he didn't snap the overall DCC title, but if he did, I have a feeling he would have gambled the prize money away pretty soon.
It is frustrating to see one of the best pool players ever destroying himself like this...:frown: Yes, people say that he always has a smile on his face, but does that mean he's a happy person?
He doesn't need critics, he needs help and support. I wish somebody would help him somehow (not financially because money would only ruin him further). His pool game is as good as humanly possible. All his problems are away from the pool table. You don't need to know him personally to see that...
After reading all the posts it is obvious to me (and has been for a long time) why there is no professional pool for men - its bad conduct. At least bad conduct is the MAJOR factor. No self respecting business/corporation is going to shell out hundreds of thousands of dollars and then be represented/associated with a ton of horendous behavior like has happened over the years.
Some of you that only live in the pool world are so used to bad behavior that you see little or nothing wrong with it. Well, mainstream America sees a lot wrong with it and thus the state of pool we are in now.
Some of you think Earl Strickland is a GOD and can do no wrong, when the fact is he almost single handedly destroyed the last mens pro pool tour.
A lot of the previous posts justify Alex's behavior by saying "haven't you been drunk and embarassed yourself?" How pathetic and blind and, unfortunately, common those statements are.
I am sure that I will take a lot of flack over this post, and as I do, I will just shake my head and say "now tell me how unfair it is that there are no big corporate sponsors so that you can make a decent living playing pool".
PS: I have no doubt that the reason Alex was not stopped by the powers that be was because someone didn't have the guts to stand up for decency and stop him because they justified his behavior by thinking "well I got drunk one time and that makes it ok" or "there will be a lot of pissed off spectators and we don't want that".
LOL!
Some of you that only live in the pool world are so used to bad behavior that you see little or nothing wrong with it. Well, mainstream America sees a lot wrong with it and thus the state of pool we are in now.
Some of you think Earl Strickland is a GOD and can do no wrong, when the fact is he almost single handedly destroyed the last mens pro pool tour.
A lot of the previous posts justify Alex's behavior by saying "haven't you been drunk and embarassed yourself?" How pathetic and blind and, unfortunately, common those statements are.
I am sure that I will take a lot of flack over this post, and as I do, I will just shake my head and say "now tell me how unfair it is that there are no big corporate sponsors so that you can make a decent living playing pool".
PS: I have no doubt that the reason Alex was not stopped by the powers that be was because someone didn't have the guts to stand up for decency and stop him because they justified his behavior by thinking "well I got drunk one time and that makes it ok" or "there will be a lot of pissed off spectators and we don't want that".
LOL!
lol, no shat! I was there for 4 nights and got hammered, ummmm...4 nights! And, I don't think I have a drinking problem. It was the first time I had drank in like 3 months.
Alex got drunk one night, lol. Not a big deal in my opinion. Did he make an ass of himself? maybe. If I had a dollar for every time I made a slight ass of myself while drunk I'd be rich.
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I think you'd only have a $1.00 if you consider the times you made a slight ass of yourself. Sorry, couldn't pass it up. Hope all is well with the new job and such - hate I wasn't at DCC to contribute to the drinking.
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Maybe one day when pool players are as virtous and upstanding as NFL players all will be right with the world.
Pool is not a major spectator sport with major sponsors here because it is a close second only to grass growing as a spectator event to 99.99 % of the people in this country.
All this uproar about Alex was in reality only actually seen by maybe 1000 people. The real damage will be done by all the people who didn't actually see anything but have vociferous opinions of why it is yet again another indictment of the suckiness of pool repeated ad nauseum for years to come with all the marks on the list. Never ceases to amaze me that the people who claim to like pool are some of the first to cut it down at every opportunity.
Terry,
We stop for a stop sign because IT IS THE LAW.
What I stated about Freddy was FACT not an opinion.
Personal choices in life are not as simple as you would like the to be. Most are based on things that happened in ones' past or are based on ones' teachings.
We have juries to enforce the LAW. As far as I know there is no law that says it is illegal to play a pool match while under the influence. You seem to be confused between what you think and what is the law.
You seem to want to impose your sense of morality on other people. That is not your right to do. Everyone must make there own decision on how to run their life. If they make a wrong choice and injure another person then they have broken a LAW and will be punished accordingly.
Bill Stroud
Alex is not an employee. He is the sole proprietor of Pagulayan Inc.
He can show up drunk if he chooses.
That, and your statement before - that we would only have the DCC all three years if the drunk ones would be out for 2 years.
Yeap, that in my eyes is one of the reasons why pool will never be a major sport.
I am not an american, but all I can say is ..................
..dont ask what your country can do for you, ask what you can do for your country
Maybe some pool players should think about the sentence and put "pool" instead of "your country". :wink:
BILLIARD as a whole is an acknowledged olympic sport since some years, but players over here seems like they dont know that.
Alcohol in Billiard is officialy DOPING, and off course its really bad for our sport !!
The same for any kind of drugs - nothing more to say about that in my opinion - ban them all.
Eric"h" ------thinks its time for a professional pool organisation in the US for men
Bill,
it´s the law, too, that billiard is a sport where drugs and alcohol is DOPING :grin-square:
Eric"h" ----- loves billiard as a sport, not a drug-party