Bonus Ball starts May 30th

[SterlingArcher]

Not all businesses fight against each other. BB has hurt me to this point and so I should be against them in all aspects but as I have said before I do want them to do well. I also am hesitant in ALMOST agreeing that they are putting up the money and can do what they want alsthough I think there has to be a different way. I can also see that for what I can gather as to what they are trying to do, a weekly show at the same time everyweek without interuption is the right way to do it. Thats why the tonight show is on at the same time everyday or the big sitcoms are on at the same time. They want to become part of your weekly calender. Still there has to be a better way to do it. I don't know 100% that there is because I have not put enough thought into all the aspects.
Just to go back to pool rooms fighting. I have booked exhibition tours in small towns where there were only 2 pool rooms. I expect conflict but in some cases the first pool room owner I call will ask if I called ABC Billiards yet. I tell them no and they tell me they are going to talk to them about it. They call the other pool room and see what they have going on at that time and if they would like to hold the exhibition or if they have any interest in holding it. They make sure that nothing is going on with eachother and believe it or not have sponsored part of the exhibition and helped promote it in another pool room. I know this is a simplyfied version of what we have here and isn't at cut and dry and the whole pool biz but just saying that not everyone is against everyone.

I agree with a lot of what you said, but if there was a better way to schedule things, you wouldn't see sports seasons compressed into the schedules they are or tv shows done in seasons. If you spread things out too long people lose interest and like you said don't become part of your week.

I hope the other events don't end up shutting down, especially if bonus ball doesn't work out, but I can't see how it would be in bonus ball or the player's best interest to spread things out longer than the 26 weeks they already have set up.

 

[SterlingArcher]

This is different. We're talking about having the equivalent of two leagues in the same sport. I'm not mentioning any regional tours/tournaments here.

I've worked in the professional tennis industry long enough to know about scheduling conflicts, appearance fees, cancellations with press conferences and millions of dollars at stake. I won't go into details because clearly you're not talking from experience but just from watching ESPN News. I happen to know how people get hurt from the inside, it's never any fun.


What I'm saying is that a lot of players will chose to play big, trademark events like Matchroom's, CSI's, and that will hurt Bonus Ball too.

For example, World Pool Masters is a guaranteed $1,500 and a possible $20,000 in a week-end.


I'm just saying, with the World 10-Ball cancellation today and Bonus Ball having a 6-month delay for its launch, it's getting really tough being a pool player these days.

Good luck guys;

Agreed, and if BB did not contractually obligate their players to make their events they should schedule around huge things like matchroom. If they didn't contractually obligate players or work with them, then they deserve to be left in the dark when a player takes off to play.

 

[jpparmentier]

We asked the players which events they wished to attend, and scheduled around most of them (6 out of 10). Your list is actually inaccurate, so here's a corrected list:

WEEK 1-2
False. We scheduled around the WTBC for all players who were planning to attend (now cancelled)

WEEK 3
False. UTBC. This is being resolved as we speak.

WEEK 8
Correct. It's local, so it's unavoidable.

WEEK 9
Correct. It's local, so it's unavoidable.

WEEK 10
False. All players who wish to attend have had their teams scheduled off from 4 games down to 1, and for all but 2 players, the conflict has been eliminated completely.

WEEK 13
False. All players who are attending the 14.1 have been scheduled off that week.

WEEK 15
False. All players who are attending the W9BC have been scheduled off that week.

WEEK 21
Correct. Some even requested the conflict to motivate them not to attend.

WEEK 22
Correct. This was our final week of the season, and thus unrealistic to schedule around.

WEEK ??
False. World Cup of Pool, where we talked to Matchroom and scheduled off the players who may attend.

Nathan, I wasn't trying to be Correct or False. This list you just wrote is still in the works and not complete, so I understand that you're trying to work things out.

What I was writing was there was a scheduling conflict. The fact is, there is. Players and spectators, viewers on the internet will have to chose what to attend to, what to watch.

I'm not correct or wrong on a list, I was trying to list things.



You didn't answer on the 52 weeks thing. False or Correct ?

 

[jpparmentier]

Agreed, and if BB did not contractually obligate their players to make their events they should schedule around huge things like matchroom. If they didn't contractually obligate players or work with them, then they deserve to be left in the dark when a player takes off to play.

Nathan just posted a list showing they've already started to work things out, which is good.

 

[nathandumoulin]

Nathan, I wasn't trying to be Correct or False.

lol, sorry, I wasn't implying you were right or wrong, but rather if there was a conflict or not. I should probably have said yes/no, rather than correct/false.

In any case, events will be going on at the same time, but since players won't need to decide between the two, the damage is reduced. Sure, it's not perfect, but it's an improvement over the last schedule that was done months ago by someone else, that was random draw without regard to anything or anyone.

You didn't answer on the 52 weeks thing. False or Correct ?

As for the 52 weeks thing, the 26 week season wasn't intended to be at this time of year when there are so many other events. It was planned to be during the off season. The construction issue and then the high cost of rent has forced us to start the season immediately upon completion of the venue.

Season 2 will be scheduled during the off season, or at least most of it. By Season 3, we hope the 26 weeks will run purely in the off season, and then most other events can run without repercussion.

 

[PETROBOY]

How much is the ppv for a match and does that only get you one match or the whole day?

 

[JumpinJoe]

It would be nice to see season 1 start before we get to season 3.
Just saying.

 

[jpparmentier]

Season 2 will be scheduled during the off season, or at least most of it. By Season 3, we hope the 26 weeks will run purely in the off season, and then most other events can run without repercussion.

Now that's common sense. Back to square one

I do hope nobody gets hurt and that the players can have a regular income out of all this, but what a mess...

 

[cleary]

It would be nice to see season 1 start before we get to season 3.
Just saying.

I'lll take some odds and say we never see season 3. Gonna need some good odds though.

 

[jpparmentier]

I'lll take some odds and say we never see season 3. Gonna need some good odds though.

you mean season 3 of Big Tony ? we're still waiting for season 2...

 

[APA BRIAN]

Maybe there is some...looking out for those who don't need it going on here. If your a pro player signed onto this league, I imagine a guaranteed paycheck supersedes the possibility of a big pay day in a major tournament. Nathan was able to address scheduling conflicts that some posters have had concerns about. And those that in fact do conflict, as Bonus Ball I would just say, We know, and our players still want to attend our events instead. For those that don't, we accommodate them when possible.
I own a small business, a bar in fact. We sit in a marina with other bars/restaurants as well. It has happened more than once, that these other places will "borrow" an idea or two for a promotional night. That's fine. I brought this up, just to point out that, far from trying to be sensitive to others scheduling needs. Some places schedule in order to conflict.
This is a free market economy, I see no reason why those behind BB shouldn't have the attitude...really a conflict of schedule you say? Well when we get started, well see who wants to be where. There are no guaranteed contracts at the U.S. Open.

 

[SpiderWebComm]

This is what tilts me. The math. Take your 1.2 million and add the million dollar prize fund plus rent,production costs, insurance, utilities and all the other costs of operating a 13,000 sq ft venue.

Its a $2 million dollar season on the low end. There is NO SHOT to cover the nut let alone ever actually make money. But hey....its nothing new in pool. Dude gets some money, does everything his way without having a clue what he's doing, messes everything up for a short time then goes bust and is never heard from again. Its the American way. This too shall pass.

^^^^^ this. Lalalala I'm not listen to your logic lalallalalalala!

Where on earth is their revenue going to come from? I just don't see this getting sold to tv.

When the UFC first came out years ago, nobody had a clue about mma but boy those flash knockouts were exciting! Nobody will have a clue about what they're watching and it won't have flash knockouts.

I don't think any pool game will make pool interesting. The people/characters will...sadly few exist. If there were interesting pool players, they should focus on the banter while the actual game is an "also-have." Almost like poker machines in a pool room. The pool tables are there for misdirection and a face for the business.

Sent from my DROID BIONIC using Tapatalk 2

 

[lfigueroa]

Not that I disagree with this concept, but I have a question just for debating purposes:

Say BB doesn't schedule around the US Open(or pick whatever tour or tournament will fit your example best, I don't care)....what is the worst thing that can happen to BB for burning this goodwill?

I'm seriously asking the question, as I may very well be overlooking something important. I just don't see where they have much to lose.

hmmm, if you're starting up a business like BB, what is the value of good relations with people already in the pool industry?

Well, of course that is not knowable, particularly without intimate knowledge of the business model in question. However, in a situation like this it is PR101 to establish good relations with those already in the business, as well as the gatekeepers and the opinion leaders in the community at large. And the reason is that those folks can help you, or hurt you, in ways that are obvious and in ways that you cannot begin to imagine.

This is some basic PR stuff, at which, to date, BB has been consistently poor at, IMO.

Lou Figueroa

 

[lfigueroa]

Interesting..... What if you could come to Vegas go see a live pool "show" featuring the best players in the World, in an arena with cushy seats while having a beer and some popcorn surrounded by lights and entertainment and showgirls. What if you could even gamble on this at the same time...... hmm..... sounds interesting

lol. I hope this isn't the business model.

Lou Figueroa

 

[Fatboy]

If (and this is a gigantic huge IF) they could get the Las Vegas casino sports books to take action on, and support the Bonus Ball action, showing the matches in the casino books and promoting the betting on them while people also bet the horses and other sporting events that could go a LONG way to generating viewers and interest and may give them some down the road sponsorship options (The Las Vegas Dice turn into the Las Vegas Legionaires, sponsors by Caesars Entertainment Corp and thus putting alot of money in, in return for advertising time, banners, and possibly hosting a match or two in one of their own casinos.

Ailine companies are also a huge possibility for a sponsorship deal, they have close connections to Las Vegas and could very easily work in a very positive ad campiagn linked to bonus ball IF it was to start generating significant viewership. They link in nicely to the casinos as well. Beer or liqour companies also could link into the action nicely.

I think it Bonus Ball has any hope of surviving it better link in very closely to Las Vegas, push the fact they are there, show shots of the strip in the promo's and intros to each match (From fabulous Las Vegas... blah blah blah) you know the spiel. This match brought to you by "name sponsor here" who send in their "name of their team here" showing awesome shots of a Las Vegas casino, people winning massive amounts of money while partying it up and getting served drinks by stunning looking stewardesses, against soandso airlines own "name of team here, while showing some awesome pick of a 747 taking off from some awesome resort paradise, then showing some smoking hot model/pretending to be a stewardess in a mini skirt and low cut blouse serving some guy in first class a double scotch on the rocks.

IMO that is a model that "might" actually work. It actually links in to the whole "team" part of the bonus ball theme nicely. TBH I think the cities the teams are associated with is a wasted opportunity/needs to be changed, as sponsors start to support teams the cities should be replaced by the companies that sponsor them, so the Las Vegas Dice instead become Caesars Legionaires, the whole city thing is wiped right out. The Atlanta Scorpions become the United Scorpions or the Delta Scorpions, ect...

the NBA couldnt get the books to take action IF they moved a team there, it was the Kings (I think) if the NBA cant get gaming to book action within the state of NV BB has ZERO chance,

I posted all this before, Boxing and MMA, are regulated by the NSAC Nevada State Altheltic Commission, its for contact sports, goes back to the mob days. they wanted live events customers could bet on, they got it.

well the mob is long gonee and the NSAC (google it) is still in full force and effect, so if we have the pool players in the ring then we could bet on them, but not on pool. aint gonna happen.

its well documented, and i only lived in Vegas 20+ years, i know what i'm talking about, i;ll eat a szamoti the day BB has their action on the "Board" at a book.


later

 

[bfdlad]

the NBA couldnt get the books to take action IF they moved a team there, it was the Kings (I think) if the NBA cant get gaming to book action within the state of NV BB has ZERO chance,

I posted all this before, Boxing and MMA, are regulated by the NSAC Nevada State Altheltic Commission, its for contact sports, goes back to the mob days. they wanted live events customers could bet on, they got it.

well the mob is long gonee and the NSAC (google it) is still in full force and effect, so if we have the pool players in the ring then we could bet on them, but not on pool. aint gonna happen.

its well documented, and i only lived in Vegas 20+ years, i know what i'm talking about, i;ll eat a szamoti the day BB has their action on the "Board" at a book.


later

Eric, it was the Sacramento kings that the Maloof family wanted to bring to vegas you are correct. I may also mention that the maloof brothers also own most of the Bud distributors on the west coast and I believe Louisiana (Could be wrong) They also own "The Palms" hotel and casino. Now the fact they own a casino may have had something to do with it but still thats a powerful little group and if they could not get it done it makes it hard for me to believe that someone like Larry (No disrespect but he don't own a NBA team or a casino) can get it done.

 

[bfdlad]

the NBA couldnt get the books to take action IF they moved a team there, it was the Kings (I think) if the NBA cant get gaming to book action within the state of NV BB has ZERO chance,

I posted all this before, Boxing and MMA, are regulated by the NSAC Nevada State Altheltic Commission, its for contact sports, goes back to the mob days. they wanted live events customers could bet on, they got it.

well the mob is long gonee and the NSAC (google it) is still in full force and effect, so if we have the pool players in the ring then we could bet on them, but not on pool. aint gonna happen.

its well documented, and i only lived in Vegas 20+ years, i know what i'm talking about, i;ll eat a szamoti the day BB has their action on the "Board" at a book.


later

by the way I hope all is well with you man.

 

[real bartram]

by the way I hope all is well with you man.

Lets play some bonus ball

 

[JumpinJoe]

Lets play some bonus ball

lmao
lol
rofl

 

[Cory in DC]

I may not be representative, but here goes. One thing BB/WPBL are offering that TAR and Accustats don't is that BB is advertising "Access to ALL Matches, Any Time!" That means I can (in theory) buy a BB subscription and then watch matches when I'm able to!

Live streaming is great, but for those with a wife, kids, and a full time job, it's just not that useful, at least in my experience. I just don't have 6 hours in a row to spare, and if I did, I'd be shooting pool. For example, I can't tell you how much I want to see the Efren/SVB one-pocket match, but the times don't work. I'd gladly pay the posted price or more if TAR could make it so I can watch it when I want.

Accustats makes older matches available through video on demand, but that's (1) not their premium content and (2) only sold for a 24-hour window (as opposed to one complete view or a subscription model). DVDs are ok, but in the age of Netflix, Hulu, Roku, and iPads, the only time I ever, grudgingly, turn on a DVD player is to watch Accustats and TAR matches. Grudgingly because of the 1990s era medium, not the content--I'll be firing up the DVD player when my "Make it Happen" one pocket DVDs arrive, in fact. Back to the point, DVDs are just plain outdated and inconvenient, which is presumably why TAR doesn't sell them anymore.

Long story short, if there are a lot of people out there like me--and having a spouse, job, and kids is pretty common, especially among those with a little money to spend on their hobbies--then there's an untapped group of customers out there for someone.

Cory