CSI sponsors Mike Dechaine at Steinway Classic

[justadub]

I do understand the feeling of being "black balled".....and no I don't approve, but when someone holds a grudge for something you may or may not have done it's just life.

Changing someone else's opinion is like changing someone else's tire, it can only happen if both parties agree......and someone has a "jack".

This is my experience anyway.

With all due respect....

Being black balled is "just life"?

This is the part of the whole thing that strikes me as being a problem, when the leader of an organization will actually express that to someone else associated with them.

If it all happened the way it seems, it is tremendously out of line. It is not "just life".

No matter who said what to whose wife. And even that is still yet to be 'splained....

I realize that you are taking up for your good friend. It's to be expected. But please don't think that we, the potential viewing audience, have to accept that kind of behavior.

(Unless we aren't the target audience, which brings us nicely back to the Bonus Ball fiasco.)

Again, I say these things with all due respect to you, JA, MD and anyone else is this little saga. Watching it as an unbiased observer, the whole thing is an embarrassment.

 

[Mr. Bond]

Act IV Scene 3

*character clicks on thread, scrolls down. does double take, jaw falls open*

" what the... "

*picks up phone. insert dialing sound effect*

" beep beep beep - beep beep beep beep..... ring.....ring....."

*other party answers*

"...hello? "

" Hey, its me.... did you see the thread....the csi sponsors mike thread? "

" ...yeah i did, why?"

" no, i mean today...did you read it today?*

"...no, why, what happened....someone talking shit again? "

" dude!....man!....bro!....go look...like now before its deleted....this is nuts "

" ....that bad huh?....or should i say, that good huh lol...."

" jesus man...."

"...alright...i'll check it out ....but you do know i have better shit to do right? "

" lol....no you dont..."

" lol....shut the hell up...pawn stars is important man...i recorded it for a reason "

" lol...catch ya later 'chumlee' "

*click*

End Scene

 

[Mark Griffin]

Now that you mentioned it, JA did send me a text. I am not sure those required a response.

I dont know how to post the 'phone picture' but here is what he has sent me.
On 8/22 at 12:52 PM, he sent - WOW!!!
On 8/22 at 6:49 PM during the Podcast, he sent: Go ahead and say me name. Its ok!!
On 8/22 at 8:13 PM after the podcast: You should say the word that I sent today. Make sure you say the right word cause other people may be watching this too. (can anybody tell me what the heck this means)?


While we are taking texts: on Jul 15 at 8:53PM JA sent the following: As a promoter, i CANNOT believe that you WONT let the BEST players in the world play in your tournament and NOT let WPBL have a booth and the players wear their jerseys. They WOULD be a drawing card for you. That's pretty STUPID!!!!]
I responded: Is this really Johnny Archer? Why not call me?

Jul 16 at 4:58 AM: This is Johnny Archer. I am back in Atlanta so it was late last night but, we can talk in depth tody. Call me. Thanks Johnny

Jul 20 art 8:18 AM: I heard that a guy named Lou said that you showed him some BAD texts from me. Mark, you know I only spoke the TRUTH!!! Be a man and handle it!!Jul 20 at 2:26: I wrote - Explain exactly what you are saying


So - there are the texts with JA. Please note the dates. Our Pro events started on July 17th at 10 AM. I was pretty busy and no time to respond to more requests to open up the field past the limit of 96 players. Which we could not do. Also the WPBL did ask to have a booth - on Friday 12th PM. I did not even know if I had any tables etc. As it turns out, I was promised that the WPBL was wireing all the BB players their back pay on following Mon-Tuesday. Which did NOT happen. I told them on Sunday PM that I would not be able to rent them 2 booths and a table.

We have a dress code and ALL players have to abide- the BB jerseys did not meet that code. Which by the way, no one actually EVER asked me to allow that.

Just a little more info on 'some' of the behind the scenes.
Is this how the ABP/BB handles professional events?

Mark Griffin

They have each other's phone numbers and Johnny has text Mark recently with no response....I do know more, but the core issue is dealing with the issues head on instead of all this "backhanded" behavior.

They're both adults, I have confidence they will come to an understanding, and I'm pretty sure it won't be using Mike as a liaison.

 

[punter]

Do you really thing this sponsorship was about "raising the ethics of the game".....I believe it was the contrary, there was very little "ethical" about this sponsorship announcement. It appeared like it was wrapped in insolence seasoned with audaciousness and, served with pomposity.

Posting a sponsorship to "get back at Johnny Archer" and those that followed and supported Bonus Ball is silly. If someone wants to sponsor a pro player, that's great and I encourage it, but not to "get back at someone or something".....that's not cool.

I have no issues with Mark personally, although I would be surprised at anyone taking this approach regarding sponsorship. It's bad enough that the players can't get the sponsorship they deserve, but to taunt them and then take a "high moral ground" is insulting to more players than just Mike and Johnny...it stirs up negativity and controversy among many players and that's unhealthy for the billiard industry as a whole.

Any sponsorship should be about the player and what he's done and what he can do for the sponsoring company. Lashing out at Johnny Archer by sponsoring Mike is a back handed compliment to Mike and a direct "internet slap" to Johnny Archer. Any way you slice it people will look at it as immature at best and I'm pretty sure he did it in an emotional state or would have thought twice about taking this position.

This post, finally, says what you wanted to. It should have been your first post in the thread. You make some valid points.

 

[CJ Wiley]

"It's always darkest before the dawn".

With all due respect....

Being black balled is "just life"?

This is the part of the whole thing that strikes me as being a problem, when the leader of an organization will actually express that to someone else associated with them.

If it all happened the way it seems, it is tremendously out of line. It is not "just life".

No matter who said what to whose wife. And even that is still yet to be 'splained....

I realize that you are taking up for your good friend. It's to be expected. But please don't think that we, the potential viewing audience, have to accept that kind of behavior.

(Unless we aren't the target audience, which brings us nicely back to the Bonus Ball fiasco.)

Again, I say these things with all due respect to you, JA, MD and anyone else is this little saga. Watching it as an unbiased observer, the whole thing is an embarrassment.

If you follow politics you'll see that it is "just life," and of course "life isn't fair"....look at the examples with the republicans and democrats....listen to the news channels (which I strongly advice against).

I got barred from the TAR by someone I can't remember meeting (over something I can't remember doing), and I'm ok with it, it's his option to so as he pleases......it's all of our options to do as we please, that's the good thing about America (as long as no laws or broken, or you don't get caught)

"It's always darkest before the dawn"........all this chaos is actually encouraging.

 

[justadub]

If you follow politics you'll see that it is "just life," and of course "life isn't fair"....look at the examples with the republicans and democrats....listen to the news channels (which I strongly advice against).

I got barred from the TAR by someone I can't remember meeting (over something I can't remember doing), and I'm ok with it, it's his option to so as he pleases......it's all of our options to do as we please, that's the good thing about America (as long as no laws or broken, or you don't get caught)

"It's always darkest before the dawn"........all this chaos is actually encouraging.

Well then, for the sake of the argument....

Marks sponsorship if MD is "just life", yet you took great umbrage with that, seemingly...

Forgive me, I'm just trying to find a handhold as we all fall over the cliff. (Not gonna try and match you with the philosophical stuff, but I'll give it a whirl, seems like the thi.g to do)

 

[punter]

Well then, for the sake of the argument....

Marks sponsorship if MD is "just life", yet you took great umbrage with that, seemingly...

Forgive me, I'm just trying to find a handhold as we all fall over the cliff. (Not gonna try and match you with the philosophical stuff, but I'll give it a whirl, seems like the thi.g to do)

Life is the teacher.:wink:

 

[klone]

OMG, cannot believe all this I'm reading... Text messages being publicized, dirty laundry being aired out on the Web, etc.

Please, I ask everyone for restraint and common courtesy. Pros like JA and CJ have been my inspiration when I started pool playing, and now that I am older I also enjoy following the triumphs of younger players like MD. And I have no gripe with ABP, CSI, BB, TAR, etc. and wish each nothing but success.

All this public bickering does nobody any good, and will only turn off pool fans. Can't we all just get along?

 

[CJ Wiley]

we're all critically flawed. Some of us just hide it better than others.

Well then, for the sake of the argument....

Marks sponsorship if MD is "just life", yet you took great umbrage with that, seemingly...

Forgive me, I'm just trying to find a handhold as we all fall over the cliff. (Not gonna try and match you with the philosophical stuff, but I'll give it a whirl, seems like the thi.g to do)

I'm happy for Mike, the point is not to use it as a weapon of mass az destruction, against Bonus Ball, ABP, and/or Johnny Archer.....celebrate how great and deserving Mike is, not that he's getting it to "strike back" at the evil empire of JA/BB/ABP. .

It's ok, we're just getting some entertainment as opposed to watching FOX or CNN.....no matter how we slice it we're critically flawed. Some of us just hide it better than others.

There's a part of me that wants to get involved in a players organization and another part of me that says NOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!

So I'll just stay as neutral as possible, but I do have an alliance to the Pro Players through similar life experiences.....and my only agenda is to see all of us do better.

'The Game is my Teacher'

 

[Banks]

Well then, for the sake of the argument....

Marks sponsorship if MD is "just life", yet you took great umbrage with that, seemingly...

Forgive me, I'm just trying to find a handhold as we all fall over the cliff. (Not gonna try and match you with the philosophical stuff, but I'll give it a whirl, seems like the thi.g to do)

Lol, dontcha like the two-faced attitude of it? Apparently you can't call people on their bullshit, but "that's life" when someone is intentionally screwed. My response to that is a big old gfy. Don't care if you're a pool pro, billionaire or a bellhop, that's what I think.

Edit: not directed towards you, dub.

 

[JCIN]

If you follow politics you'll see that it is "just life," and of course "life isn't fair"....look at the examples with the republicans and democrats....listen to the news channels (which I strongly advice against).

I got barred from the TAR by someone I can't remember meeting (over something I can't remember doing), and I'm ok with it, it's his option to so as he pleases......it's all of our options to do as we please, that's the good thing about America (as long as no laws or broken, or you don't get caught)

"It's always darkest before the dawn"........all this chaos is actually encouraging.

Call it barred if you want. I call it not working with someone I have no desire to work with.

You are in the bar business so I know you have seen this sign:

No difference here.

Same reason I dont have a problem with Johnny telling Mike to go sit on a short stick.

 

[justadub]

I'm happy for Mike, the point is not to use it as a weapon of mass az destruction, against Bonus Ball, ABP, and/or Johnny Archer.....celebrate how great and deserving Mike is, not that he's getting it to "strike back" at the evil empire of JA/BB/ABP. .

It's ok, we're just getting some entertainment as opposed to watching FOX or CNN.....no matter how we slice it we're critically flawed. Some of us just hide it better than others.

There's a part of me that wants to get involved in a players organization and another part of me that says NOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!

So I'll just stay as neutral as possible, but I do have an alliance to the Pro Players through similar life experiences.....and my only agenda is to see all of us do better.

'The Game is my Teacher'

And since we're having such a fine, polite time with this...

Someone wielding their "influence in the industry" and holding it over anothers head isn't "mass destruction", but seemingly very specific targeting. That is better, huh?

See how this works? Guess its "just life".

AZB is the teacher

 

[CJ Wiley]

we, in the bar business call it 86th.

Call it barred if you want. I call it not working with someone I have no desire to work with.

You are in the bar business so I know you have seen this sign:

No difference here.

Same reason I dont have a problem with Johnny telling Mike to go sit on a short stick.

I said there's no problem on my end, just making an example.....we, in the bar business call it 86th. It would be better if I could remember meeting you, but maybe you never introduced yourself, only you would know I guess.

 

[cleary]

I said there's no problem on my end, just making an example.....we, in the bar business call it 86th. It would be better if I could remember meeting you, but maybe you never introduced yourself, only you would know I guess.

The game is the teacher.

 

[CJ Wiley]

The great thing about life is it's always changing.

And since we're having such a fine, polite time with this...

Someone wielding their "influence in the industry" and holding it over anothers head isn't "mass destruction", but seemingly very specific targeting. That is better, huh?

See how this works? Guess its "just life".

AZB is the teacher

The great thing about life is it's always changing....so what's said today will mean something different later.....that is the reality of life, it's always evolving....or devolving.

I would predict {in the not so distant future} Mike and Johnny will be ok with one another.

"Time is the Teacher'

 

[watchez]

Mark G. - you can post my texts to you, just not the pictures I send.

CJ - not taking sides - I don't know of any conversations with you and the members of TAR - but I remember you there. You didn't do well. You were in the back corner table practicing by yourself with your gal, trying to get in stroke. Strange, i remember you were dressed up like you were ready to go to da club.

 

[justadub]

The great thing about life is it's always changing....so what's said today will mean something different later.....that is the reality of life, it's always evolving....or devolving.

I would predict {in the not so distant future} Mike and Johnny will be ok with one another.

"Time is the Teacher'

One would hope so.

The industry is too small for it to be otherwise. Hell, the world is too small.

Being A Grown-Up is The Teacher

 

[CreeDo]

I'm kind of glad CJ said it. I thought the same thing when I read the first post.
It comes off like:

"We did this to get back at JA because he's trying to force Mike to join ABP and Bonus Ball".
That's a pretty big conclusion to jump to, and I think it needs a little more explanation/proof.

Is Johnny really ranting and raving over the mere fact someone took a pass on ABP/Bonus Ball?
Because to me it looks like he's mad about specific comments, and he chose to ignore
those comments initially until that "For all you Johnny Lovers" post woke up some lingering resentment.

I don't think JA fires off angry texts at someone who says "I appreciate the offer,
and I respect what you're trying to do but I'm just gonna go my own way."
I don't think he takes it so personally he's gonna try to wreck someone's career over it.

As unprofessional as the text messages were, it also seems unprofessional
for someone like Mark to get involved.
Mean comments about the ABP and angry text responses are petty, low level stuff.
It's beneath a major industry player to take sides on something like that.
It's like the CEO of verizon getting into a pissy Twitter catfight with someone on the board of directors.

Sponsorships should be based on merit, not because a random idle comment 9 months ago
happened to piss of johnny archer. Mike deserves a sponsorship and probably got mistreated by Johnny,
but IMO Mark you coulda announced sponsorship with zero explanation,
and you'd get your hint across without fanning the flames.

 

[watchez]

Sponsorships should be based on merit,

How do you quantify merit?

 

[Mark Griffin]

Creedo,

I agree with a lot of what you say - but as one who deals with this stuff a LOT,
sometimes it requires a bigger hammer to get someone's attention.

TOO much has happened in the last year - and the powers that be - never respond.

I despise ANYONE who threatens another person because of political or philisophical differences.

I think half truths can cause damage.

All I want is for pool to improve. I have decided that trying to work with the current pro players in the current format is not going to work. We will be deciding what we will do in the next 4-6 months. But it will not be the big open fields. And to a degree that is unfortunate - but I do blame the power politics and BS that so many of the US players have practiced.

How many of these 'super stars' actually helped out with the junior players? (answer: SVB, Dechaine, Jennifer Baretta, Mika Immonen, Dennis O, Busty, Cory Deuel, Ralf, Appleton, Jason Lynch, Lee Brett, Pelinga, Lumbardo, Michael Yednek. See any missing names?) Remember we had 96 pro players in attendence.

With labor, freight and added money costs, we probably spent close to $100,000 putting on 3 US Open events. Yet the ONLY people that really complained about charging late fees - or demanding we open the field - or to be allowed special priveleges - were the higher USA/ABP players.

Why do the foreign players adapt so much better? Maybe I just dont understan the issues - but it has run its course with me. Normally I am a pretty passive guy - but we busted our ass making this happen and I dont think that a lot of players appreciate it. So lets try something a little idfferent for a couple of years and see how it works.

I am not saying I know what is the right thing to do - but I do know what some fo the wrondg things are! - lol.

Wishing everyone the best in billiards. If anyone has a question or comment for me : markg@playcsipool.com

Mark Griffin