Pattern racking
- Thread starter Roy Steffensen
- Start date
IMO any time you let the players gegt there hands on the balls there will be shenanigans!
You ever watch old video of say McCready or Earl racking?.....those killers threw the balls in the rack with almost a carefree attitude.....smashed em open and ran out.
Now the players look at the balls in their hands first, then "place" them in at will.....this is no good IMO. The rules say RANDOM!.....which in itself is a real "grey" word.
We all know, or should know a few patterns good for us, and a few bad for them. I learned it from a study Nick Varner did about 15 years ago where they broke and charted 1000 racks and wrote an article about it. I think it might have been in BD or Snap magazine maybe?
G.
I agree Gerry. I hated the touching of the one ball after I rack the balls. I see lots more of that happening now with some of the young boys. i think they have followed a bad habbit possibly from us!!
I know a very high profile playa that placed chapstick on his finger and then made it look like he wuz trying to get the one frozen, placing the gell like substance on the one(for some reason)?????
pattern racking and the WPBA
The last I knew pattern racking was the standard deal in the WPBA. The ref racks for the TV games but the ladies are able to give him the pattern they want. Oddly enough the ladies haven't perfected breaks to take full advantage of pattern racking so it hasn't became an issue for them.
For the record, I support "pattern racking" in any game where the numbers or patterns on the balls means anything. "Random" only means as random as the racker cares to make it. In nine and ten ball I support having one legal pattern and the mirror image of that pattern so there is no advantage to breaking from one side of the table or the other. I favor breaking from the box too and I'm fine with spotting the money ball on the break. The game shouldn't be over for real or for all intents and purposes after the break.
On coin op tables I do favor the money ball in on the break being a win or a loss if you scratch too just because there has to be something in place to cover coin operated tables.
It is impossible to enforce "random racking" so we should have standard patterns that can be easily enforced. I would favor a pattern to make running out tougher, not easier.
Hu
The last I knew pattern racking was the standard deal in the WPBA. The ref racks for the TV games but the ladies are able to give him the pattern they want. Oddly enough the ladies haven't perfected breaks to take full advantage of pattern racking so it hasn't became an issue for them.
For the record, I support "pattern racking" in any game where the numbers or patterns on the balls means anything. "Random" only means as random as the racker cares to make it. In nine and ten ball I support having one legal pattern and the mirror image of that pattern so there is no advantage to breaking from one side of the table or the other. I favor breaking from the box too and I'm fine with spotting the money ball on the break. The game shouldn't be over for real or for all intents and purposes after the break.
On coin op tables I do favor the money ball in on the break being a win or a loss if you scratch too just because there has to be something in place to cover coin operated tables.
It is impossible to enforce "random racking" so we should have standard patterns that can be easily enforced. I would favor a pattern to make running out tougher, not easier.
Hu
IMO, pattern racking in pool is the equivalent of playing the ball "up" in golf. It creates a distinctive advantage for the player. For Donny, pattern racking is the edge what could have helped him beat Shane. I definately think it was an advantage for him. Unfortunately, his lack of execution in safety play, push outs, and runouts is was beat him.
Pattern racks
I live in Japan and I deal with this every day because the balls are set up like with a sardo rack.I would never play rack your with any of the better players here.I know the wing ball is going in EVERY BREAK so I rack to prevent the run out where in the states you rack to prevent the balls from going in.I cant rack high on the spot or low or tilt the rack to throw off the angles.All the tables are set up the same way I havent used a rack in 8 years!
I live in Japan and I deal with this every day because the balls are set up like with a sardo rack.I would never play rack your with any of the better players here.I know the wing ball is going in EVERY BREAK so I rack to prevent the run out where in the states you rack to prevent the balls from going in.I cant rack high on the spot or low or tilt the rack to throw off the angles.All the tables are set up the same way I havent used a rack in 8 years!
Let's not forget about those finger lickers. That's a move for sure. Don't ever let the racker touch the balls after the rack is removed.
Damn finger-licking rack riggers.
bigdaddy58
Registered
Shane v. Mills
On Shane's pattern, while I was there watching, was different than stated earlier, however it was the same every time. It went like this:
1
2 4
8 9 3
5 6
7
I didn't' pay attention except that the 2 was ALWAYS behind the 1 and the 3 was on the right wing (from the foot of the table) The both broke from the exact same spot EVERY SINGLE TIME.
I was sitting about 4' from the table and am positive about the placement at least up to the 3 ball. rw
On Shane's pattern, while I was there watching, was different than stated earlier, however it was the same every time. It went like this:
1
2 4
8 9 3
5 6
7
I didn't' pay attention except that the 2 was ALWAYS behind the 1 and the 3 was on the right wing (from the foot of the table) The both broke from the exact same spot EVERY SINGLE TIME.
I was sitting about 4' from the table and am positive about the placement at least up to the 3 ball. rw
a funny
Corey and Efren were lagging for the break in the semi's or finals of the one pocket at the DCC. Efren won the lag and Corey jumped in and carefully wiped both balls used to lag with on his shirt.
Hmmmmmmmmmmmm!
Hu
Let's not forget about those finger lickers. That's a move for sure. Don't ever let the racker touch the balls after the rack is removed.
Damn finger-licking rack riggers.
Corey and Efren were lagging for the break in the semi's or finals of the one pocket at the DCC. Efren won the lag and Corey jumped in and carefully wiped both balls used to lag with on his shirt.
Hmmmmmmmmmmmm!
Hu
Okay, I give up: Why is the 2-ball always in the back of the rack?
This....
If the event allows pattern racking, so be it.....players should take full advantage of the rules....
If the event calls for a random rack, and someone pattern racks, they are cheating......random is throwing the balls in the rack, putting the 9 in the middle, and racking them tightly.....I like Worm's analogy of playing the ball up.....rules of golf state that you play the ball as it lies.....it doesn't mean you give yourself a perfect shot by fluffing your lie....you do so, your score doesn't count, unless local rules call form clean and place due to weather or course conditions.....
People ***** about no money in golf or the fact that kids don't play.....why watch or teach your kids a sport where it's OK to cheat as long as you don't get caught....
8Ball48043, the 2 ball in the back will bounce off the foot rail and go up table, leaving it near the 1 ball, simplifying the pattern. Minimizing the up and down the table requirements on the first couple balls is most important because of the greater difficulty in avoiding other balls. The fewer balls on the tabe, the less this is a problem.
bigdaddy58
Registered
shane v mills again
I play sometimes in the Jacoby Carolina tour and they require you put the 2 BEHIND THE NINE but enclosed with the bottom ball. In most cases the one ball will end up at the head of the table while the two stays at the foot, causing at least a table length position play. With the two ball in the bottom position, it will almost certainly go back up table close to the one ball somewhere. While the side break is designed to make the one ball in the side, when breaking from within the box and using a soft break the one will rarely go and invariably ends being shot in the right hand corner of the head of the table (viewing from the foot). The two will be nearby most of the time. The 3 ball racked on the on the wing will be in the same position 80% of the time after the break. The only thing keeping these guys from running every rack is a bad roll. It's obvious that these guys have uses hundreds of hours figuring out where the balls will go on a patterned rack. In fact, Shane spent many an hour the day before at Strokers' working on JUST THE BREAK. BORRRINNNG. Bring back 14.1 or even 8 ball or bring on 10 ball. These guys were playing for $10 large and cheating? Cheating to win at any sport deminishes the game and the players. Hell tee it up, play hard. rw
I play sometimes in the Jacoby Carolina tour and they require you put the 2 BEHIND THE NINE but enclosed with the bottom ball. In most cases the one ball will end up at the head of the table while the two stays at the foot, causing at least a table length position play. With the two ball in the bottom position, it will almost certainly go back up table close to the one ball somewhere. While the side break is designed to make the one ball in the side, when breaking from within the box and using a soft break the one will rarely go and invariably ends being shot in the right hand corner of the head of the table (viewing from the foot). The two will be nearby most of the time. The 3 ball racked on the on the wing will be in the same position 80% of the time after the break. The only thing keeping these guys from running every rack is a bad roll. It's obvious that these guys have uses hundreds of hours figuring out where the balls will go on a patterned rack. In fact, Shane spent many an hour the day before at Strokers' working on JUST THE BREAK. BORRRINNNG. Bring back 14.1 or even 8 ball or bring on 10 ball. These guys were playing for $10 large and cheating? Cheating to win at any sport deminishes the game and the players. Hell tee it up, play hard. rw
bigdaddy58
Registered
Grandpa, did you attend the Shane v. Mills? Did you get to watch the guy fall off his stool and knock himself out? I was talking to his buddy that said "it happens at least once a month" What's the New Orleans t-shirt say "I don't have a drinking problem. I drink, I fall down, I get up....No Problem"
Regardless of the racking, it was a great match. Both Donny and Shane showed a ton of heart.. and both needed to. Shane looked out of the match several times and I'm honestly shocked he won by the way he was acting. He really felt the heat. Seems Donny just ran out of steam. If it went off again, I would bet on Donny, again.
Shane threw himself off way too much trying to break like Donny. Once he switched to the hard break, it changed the game to his favor. But at that point, it was a race to 30.
I lost money, but was a good match and Im glad I got to see them duke it out. Hopefully Donny will get out more and show everyone he can win without rack your own.
Shane threw himself off way too much trying to break like Donny. Once he switched to the hard break, it changed the game to his favor. But at that point, it was a race to 30.
I lost money, but was a good match and Im glad I got to see them duke it out. Hopefully Donny will get out more and show everyone he can win without rack your own.
I was about 3ft from that guy when it happened. Crazy.
An interesting solution. I doubt many would pass the break. It will speed up the game too. These days too much time is wasted in checking the racks.
True and there are just too many variables for the average player to calculate when checking.
Its nearly impossible to get a perfect rack every time as well.
The table condiditons change minute to minute and game to game.
With the 2 in the back it tends to stay in the kitchen on the soft break. When Shane broke hard it would go back and forth between the short rails unless it was kicked by another ball. Along a line between the diamonds on the side the rack was broke from. Donny's break would leave it in the kitchen while Shane's hard break would go 2 to 3 rails and end up around the side pocket.
Thanks John, I'll try that.
RD3P
Banned
i dont know anyone who can break the balls to where they end up in the same spot on the table.
anyone that plays pool knows that an inch one way or the other makes all the difference....i dont care what order the balls are in...you still have to run the rack. sure you can rack to where youll pocket the wingball and mabee get the one and two ball close to eachoter 3or 4 out of 10 times, but even then thats asking alot. if a guy could break the balls exact every time then there is no reason why he shoouldnt runnout %90 of the time.
i do wish pros would play more 8ball and strait pool tho
anyone that plays pool knows that an inch one way or the other makes all the difference....i dont care what order the balls are in...you still have to run the rack. sure you can rack to where youll pocket the wingball and mabee get the one and two ball close to eachoter 3or 4 out of 10 times, but even then thats asking alot. if a guy could break the balls exact every time then there is no reason why he shoouldnt runnout %90 of the time.
i do wish pros would play more 8ball and strait pool tho
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