Players not being paid at US Open

[TATE]

I find Tate's posts to be informative and well based, but I have to disagree with him here. Knowing the past hx of this event, anyone that wants to keep the trust and the respect of the players should have made certain that things were set up correctly before taking the significant position of tournament director. Ultimately, something like this is Barry's fault, but knowing that many people were going to play because of their faith in him, Jay should have made sure the prize fund was infallible before agreeing to take the position.

That is not a knock on him as a person, or his ability to run a tournament, just an observation on how I would have thought he would approach this opportunity.

Thank you. I too would like to hear Jay's observations. We've all seen just how difficult (impossible) it is to nail Barry down. Maybe Jay can shed some light on this for us too. I haven't spoken to him about this at all.

The other thing is - should AZ Billiards allow Barry to post messages, press releases and so forth to legitimize his actions?

 

[Joe_Jaguar]

Barry is about due for one of his eloquent press releases

 

[JB Cases]

The only way to fix this is for all the sponsors, vendors, streamers and players to boycott the event. No media, no players, no event. He will have to sell the brand. If not after a few years it will be worthless and he isn't stupid. To all those who suggest he lower the purse so he can actually pay the players you still haven't gotten rid if the real problem. Him! How do you expect pool to get on TV or get any real money sponsors when you have the Barrys of the pool world representing the sport. Why do you think he can't pay now.
Of course we have to actually follow through with a real boycott and not belly up to the feed trough with that hog again next year when he decides to dangle a few more carrots in front of our noses.
I personally won't be purchasing the US Open stream or attending the event until Barry no longer owns it.

This assumes that everyone cares about the players getting paid on time. They don't. People go to the us open to experience a pro event and see great pool. That's what they get for a week regardless of whether Barry pays on time or not.

Vendors could care less about Barry's issues as long as enough customers show up. Accu Stats is there to produce a video record of the event.

The only group that should really care and be willing to do something is the players. As long as they continue to show up they forfeit their moral high ground and simply accept that they are gambling on it being a good year for Barry.

But the players want that title. Very few of them have the stones to stay away because of nonpayment issues.

 

[spartan]

Not according to his speech.
He said he was making 100's of thousands.

If someone says he is making lots of money he is either joking or lying. Those who make money by and large keep their mouths shut
Don't hear Bill Gates boast that Microsoft makes billions

Johnny,

He has no involvement in the finances. Jay was called by Barry in June to act as the tournament director. He was sweet talked back into it after resigning due to poor treatment. He gets expenses and a very small stipend for this and only does it to be around the pro pool scene, not for the money.

I am sure Jay feels horrible this is embarrassingly happening again, but he has no control over it. Having Jay there is about the best thing the pro players could have because he's on their side. However, anybody who thinks Barry is "good for it" is downright stupid - I mean flat dumb. I would not trust him for a red cent. In fact, I would say the only reason Barry pays anyone at all is to get them to come back again the next year.


Chris---------------------------->Waiting for the 100% non-payment bomb that will fall when this thing doesn't have a next year.

So basically like a long long Ponzi scheme. Roll and roll the money from year to year. I must say he is small fry to take so long to scam few hundred thousand Definitely not a big time scammer like Madoff or Stanford
Sxxx going to hit the fan

 

[crabbcatjohn]

The only way to fix this

Boycotts are easy to talk about John. Hey, all it will take for us to bring gas prices down, is to boycott Esso for a month. You know how that works eh.

Maybe long before next years Open, we should all put our names on an online Doc that states that none of us will purchase the live Streams nor any DVDs at a later date for the 2015 Open.

Send the petition to Accu Stats. Fans can Boycott the Open, not just the Players.

I had thought that the APB was going to take care of all that jazz a year or so ago. See how well that worked eh.

You know i believe some of the earlier rounds of email type gas boycotts worked to a point. I know if nobody tries, nothing will happen. Should be interesting what Jay has to say....Pretty funny when Barry went off on him with the Marsh mellow gloves on him. lol

 

[ShootingArts]

he was joking, and business as usual

If someone says he is making lots of money he is either joking or lying. Those who make money by and large keep their mouths shut
Don't hear Bill Gates boast that Microsoft makes billions




So basically like a long long Ponzi scheme. Roll and roll the money from year to year. I must say he is small fry to take so long to scam few hundred thousand Definitely not a big time scammer like Madoff or Stanford
Sxxx going to hit the fan

He was joking when he said that about making hundreds of thousands. From the video I saw it seemed he was talking about what some people claim he makes off the US Open. He followed that with the comment about not paying the players. It all fit together at the time.

The way things have went in the last few years I think that more people that follow the US Open would have been surprised if the payouts had been ready at the close of the tournament than those that are surprised it isn't. Barry will pay enough to pacify most people in time for next year's US Open. Rinse and repeat indefinitely!

Hu

 

[robsnotes4u]

Reality is....

I don't know how many of the posters in this thread actually are part of the US Open LLC (or whatever it is called), or paid the entry fee of a player in the tourney. If you are neither of the above it is none of your business when and how the players are paid, as you are not part of the contract of being paid for a certain level of performance.

 

[leto1776]

No wonder the Taiwanese contingent chose to sit this one out. Who in their right mind would travel to the other side of the globe to play in a tournament where you walk away empty handed,even when you finish "in the money?!?!?"

 

[jeffj2h]

I had thought that the APB was going to take care of all that jazz a year or so ago. See how well that worked eh.

Well, does anyone know what the APB or Johnny are doing? Here is what Johnny posted two days after the 2013 US Open, on October 21, 2013:

"I want to let everyone know that every player at the US open has been paid in full. A lot of people pitched in to help to make this happen. Thanks to everyone involved (you know who you are). The players received their checks within 2 hours after they were eliminated. It was a very smooth process. This should have set a precedent in all future events. Pool made a big step this week. I pool would go as well as the open did last week then all events will be successful. Thanks to everyone for supporting the ABP so we could get this done. Thanks to Barry and Shannon for working with us for making this US Open successful. Thanks, President of ABP
Johnny Archer"
http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=337818



Then in a follow-up on October 27, 2013:

"First I would like to say thank you to Barry, Shannon, Dennis Walsh and Art Wiggins for making this US Open a success when it comes to the payouts. We all came up with a formula that will definitely work for many years to come. As far as Barry saying bad things to me the answer is yes. We both have said many bad things to each other all year long. But that is between us and we have shook hands and moved on. Bottom line is every player has been paid in full and that is what the issue has been. Nothing else. I look forward to playing in the 39th US Open in 2014 (if I am still playing). HaHa. I hope this answers some questions. Now let's move on from this and get into Mosconi Cup mode and go kick some European butt. Thanks to all of you for being such great fans of this sport!! See you in Vegas, JA"
http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=338496

 

[BasementDweller]

None of our business???

That's just silly. It's the freakin U.S. Open for goodness sakes.

I really wish Matchroom would take this over. It really is a great tournament and a Major one at that!

 

[spartan]

I don't know how many of the posters in this thread actually are part of the US Open LLC (or whatever it is called), or paid the entry fee of a player in the tourney. If you are neither of the above it is none of your business when and how the players are paid, as you are not part of the contract of being paid for a certain level of performance.

If it were an underground private VIP tourney where not any public can attend, then your statement may be true.
But since it is the Open, the public are stakeholders so your statement shows that you have no idea about Business Law 101

:grin:

 

[robsnotes4u]

If it were an underground private VIP tourney where not any public can attend, then your statement may be true.
But since it is the Open, the public are stakeholders so your statement shows that you have no idea about Business Law 101

:grin:

How are you a stakeholder. Do you have stock in the company? Please show me any contract that shows you are a stakeholder. What legal recourse do you have if the players are not paid? Do you claim any profit/loss on your taxes?

I repeat it is none of your business.

 

[mantis99]

I don't know how many of the posters in this thread actually are part of the US Open LLC (or whatever it is called), or paid the entry fee of a player in the tourney. If you are neither of the above it is none of your business when and how the players are paid, as you are not part of the contract of being paid for a certain level of performance.

This was a really wierd post. Why wouldn't this be note worthy news for pool fans, especially when they have to decide whether or not to spend their hard earned dollars supporting the events and promotions run by someone who does this?

 

[owll]

How are you a stakeholder. Do you have stock in the company? Please show me any contract that shows you are a stakeholder. What legal recourse do you have if the players are not paid? Do you claim any profit/loss on your taxes?

I repeat it is none of your business.

Well when I consider going to play in the tournament, stuff like this is my business, and i for sure would like to know when payouts are in issue, so that i will know not to waste my time/money going there.

 

[Johnnyt]

I find Tate's posts to be informative and well based, but I have to disagree with him here. Knowing the past hx of this event, anyone that wants to keep the trust and the respect of the players should have made certain that things were set up correctly before taking the significant position of tournament director. Ultimately, something like this is Barry's fault, but knowing that many people were going to play because of their faith in him, Jay should have made sure the prize fund was infallible before agreeing to take the position.

That is not a knock on him as a person, or his ability to run a tournament, just an observation on how I would have thought he would approach this opportunity.

I too respect Tate and his informable posts. I just think he's too close to the situation and Jay. Of course in the end Barry is to blame for non-payment, but I do believe Jay's name and stamp of aproval was responible for at least 20 more players signing up and throwing there $750 in the ring. Johnnyt

 

[buddha162]

Well when I consider going to play in the tournament, stuff like this is my business, and i for sure would like to know when payouts are in issue, so that i will know not to waste my time/money going there.

Why are you wasting time responding to this nonsense. I don't give a damn if it's our business; this is an open forum and we can talk about anything we want to talk about.

Carry on.

 

[sjm]

I don't know how many of the posters in this thread actually are part of the US Open LLC (or whatever it is called), or paid the entry fee of a player in the tourney. If you are neither of the above it is none of your business when and how the players are paid, as you are not part of the contract of being paid for a certain level of performance.

Are you kidding? Those who attend or purchase the stream are clients of the US Open. The US Open is a product we like to purchase, and the payment issue threatens the existence of the product. It's our business.

 

[spartan]

How are you a stakeholder. Do you have stock in the company? Please show me any contract that shows you are a stakeholder. What legal recourse do you have if the players are not paid? Do you claim any profit/loss on your taxes?

I repeat it is none of your business.

You are confusing stakeholder with shareholder.
Yes we are not shareholders but we are stakeholders.
Read it up before you start shooting. Isn't that simple

 

[jeffj2h]

Allow me to steal a reference from theology and declare myself a "soft agnostic" when it comes to the US Open. In theology, a "hard agnostic" believes they don't know if God exists and neither do you. A "soft agnostic" believes they don't know if God exists but, hey, who knows.

If the US Open were within driving distance of Dallas, I'd go see it for the history and chance to see world class players. Given that the players are not boycotting it, neither would I. But I respect anyone that feels they should boycott it.

 

[ribdoner]

blah...blah...blah...wtf happened to "right" and "wrong"???