There is no need for an apology from you. You hosted the tx but not the PPV.
If i'm ever in that neck of the woods i will certainly stop by and say thanks for hosting this event.
Thanks for the event regardless.
Bob
REFUND DEMANDED for Archer vs. Strickland match!
- Thread starter Snake Plisken
- Start date
There is no need for an apology from you. You hosted the tx but not the PPV.
If i'm ever in that neck of the woods i will certainly stop by and say thanks for hosting this event.
Thanks for the event regardless.
Bob
Yes, it is that hard to understand, why "YOUR" blood is boiling. You lost $25 and have proceeded IMHO to be less than cordial about things "REFUND DEMANDED". How about DEMAND YOU STOP upping your post count on this thread. You've not been here long and this is what you want to pick a fight about.
What about the streamer who lost big time, no sympathy for him?
You wonder why people don't put on more pool events, leave it to one person to trash someone elses reputation and then someone can come on here and say "why aren't there more pool streams"
Feed goes down for 30 seconds you're blowing up someone's cell phone wondering what's up when it will be fixed.
No one jumps from casual to this scale with out some issues, but it could have been fixed next time, now I doubt he will do it a next time. Hope you got $25 worth of complaining.
What about the streamer who lost big time, no sympathy for him?
You wonder why people don't put on more pool events, leave it to one person to trash someone elses reputation and then someone can come on here and say "why aren't there more pool streams"
Feed goes down for 30 seconds you're blowing up someone's cell phone wondering what's up when it will be fixed.
No one jumps from casual to this scale with out some issues, but it could have been fixed next time, now I doubt he will do it a next time. Hope you got $25 worth of complaining.
sorry long - tried to be short but failed
i've read through a buch of these threads and i keep seeing a few things that have me a little depressed. i have had a few days to reflect and am not really angry. just more, well, bummed.
the first thing i keep seeing is that this technology is newer and not perfect and we have to have patience and so forth. well, ok but, i am newer to buying these streams and did not realize the problems they have. i have purchased a few TAR events and the tvmike event in question. the difference in why i haven't gotten upset with the TAR difficulties and did get mad at the tvmike event, is in the way they handled the problems. my bad for being short sighted, maybe justin just has more experience doing the streams and has been there and done that.
the second thing is, everyone says they just should have put it for free because that was working better. that's fine, but then you have to offer the rest of us who paid our money back. period. you can't have a few hundred people pay for something and then just give it away free. i have no problem switching to the free feed but i want the refund. again this is what TAR has done. when they did it with the svb earl match, i didn't take the refund because justin had fixed my issue so early on that i had seen quite a bit of content that only paid viewers had seen and didn't feel i was owed money back. in the case of this stream, i tuned at around noon and by a little after five had seen almost nothing. i would not pay $25 for a meal and then watch the guy next to me eat free.
third, everyone says $25 isn't a lot of money. shut up and take the hit. true, it's not a lot of cash, most of the time. right now my girl is out of work and we are having it rough, especially when it comes to spending money on entertainment. that was supposed our weekend fun. i bought the ppv, some food to cook and that's what we were going to do. i could have taken that money and entered both of us in a weekly saturday tournament that has a $10 entry fee, and one of us finishes in the money once in a while. that would have been at least a few hours out playing and watching pool instead of sitting in front of a black 42" lcd screen with a white spinning circle.
lastly i have said this in a few other posts and i'll try make the point a little better here, since i am not as angry now maybe i'll be more coherent. i am not tech savy. i don't know how to offer real solutions, only suggestions but this is how i feel. if this tech is so new and so unstable and so unpredictable, maybe some streamers, especially newer ones, should do a little more work before they start charging. do you streamers talk to each other or is this a cut throat business (especially since you are not charging alot or making alot [if any])? i think guys like justin and big truck and fast lenny have done quite a bit of this and could probobly help the new guys. are locations scouted before agreeing to do events? do you check to see what they are running and if it's up to suff for what you need? is there any way to help the technically challanged? thankfully i have never had a problem on my end, but justin made a comment that 90% of the problems are on the user end.
i guess in the end i'll be way more careful on how i spend my cash. it seems this is a lot like a coin flip. maybe you'll get what you paid for maybe you won't. i did file a claim with paypal and i have never bashed tvmike. in the end i think he tried. and that's all he really could do. it does really suck that the event had some big sponsors and this turned into a giant cluster. just another thing that looks bad for the game - now who saw that coming? the internet stream being the black eye and not earl and johnny killing each other being the problem.
i've read through a buch of these threads and i keep seeing a few things that have me a little depressed. i have had a few days to reflect and am not really angry. just more, well, bummed.
the first thing i keep seeing is that this technology is newer and not perfect and we have to have patience and so forth. well, ok but, i am newer to buying these streams and did not realize the problems they have. i have purchased a few TAR events and the tvmike event in question. the difference in why i haven't gotten upset with the TAR difficulties and did get mad at the tvmike event, is in the way they handled the problems. my bad for being short sighted, maybe justin just has more experience doing the streams and has been there and done that.
the second thing is, everyone says they just should have put it for free because that was working better. that's fine, but then you have to offer the rest of us who paid our money back. period. you can't have a few hundred people pay for something and then just give it away free. i have no problem switching to the free feed but i want the refund. again this is what TAR has done. when they did it with the svb earl match, i didn't take the refund because justin had fixed my issue so early on that i had seen quite a bit of content that only paid viewers had seen and didn't feel i was owed money back. in the case of this stream, i tuned at around noon and by a little after five had seen almost nothing. i would not pay $25 for a meal and then watch the guy next to me eat free.
third, everyone says $25 isn't a lot of money. shut up and take the hit. true, it's not a lot of cash, most of the time. right now my girl is out of work and we are having it rough, especially when it comes to spending money on entertainment. that was supposed our weekend fun. i bought the ppv, some food to cook and that's what we were going to do. i could have taken that money and entered both of us in a weekly saturday tournament that has a $10 entry fee, and one of us finishes in the money once in a while. that would have been at least a few hours out playing and watching pool instead of sitting in front of a black 42" lcd screen with a white spinning circle.
lastly i have said this in a few other posts and i'll try make the point a little better here, since i am not as angry now maybe i'll be more coherent. i am not tech savy. i don't know how to offer real solutions, only suggestions but this is how i feel. if this tech is so new and so unstable and so unpredictable, maybe some streamers, especially newer ones, should do a little more work before they start charging. do you streamers talk to each other or is this a cut throat business (especially since you are not charging alot or making alot [if any])? i think guys like justin and big truck and fast lenny have done quite a bit of this and could probobly help the new guys. are locations scouted before agreeing to do events? do you check to see what they are running and if it's up to suff for what you need? is there any way to help the technically challanged? thankfully i have never had a problem on my end, but justin made a comment that 90% of the problems are on the user end.
i guess in the end i'll be way more careful on how i spend my cash. it seems this is a lot like a coin flip. maybe you'll get what you paid for maybe you won't. i did file a claim with paypal and i have never bashed tvmike. in the end i think he tried. and that's all he really could do. it does really suck that the event had some big sponsors and this turned into a giant cluster. just another thing that looks bad for the game - now who saw that coming? the internet stream being the black eye and not earl and johnny killing each other being the problem.
I guess I just don't get it..... Why would you come on here, and start this, without contacting Mike first? Sure, there is strength in numbers. But I wouldn't start something like this, basically saying you were scammed or something. I only met Mike once, and don't know much about him. But I would have went to his site, explained the problem, and asked him to make it right. I didn't bother wading thru this whole thread, and probly won't bother.
I sent him a pm on the chat he said no refund. Then had the balls to asked if I'd paid. When someone said the feed sucks his reply was working good here.
master9baller
Banned
Problem with ustream
It has been stated before that refunds direct from the person putting on the stream are impossible as ustream holds payment from the streamer for quite awhile. They want to ensure their payments are received before releasing the payment to the streamer, minus their fees.
I think the consumer or the guys putting on the streams will always be in financial peril as long as Ustream operates this way. For now Ustream and others that host can tell them take it or leave it. There's not enough competition and the few guys doing live streams don't have the clout to change the rules.
This all may change in time, I hope. Absent that anyone who buys these events must understand what can happen and accept it or do not buy them. If it's your last $25, just buy lottery tickets I guess:wink:.
It has been stated before that refunds direct from the person putting on the stream are impossible as ustream holds payment from the streamer for quite awhile. They want to ensure their payments are received before releasing the payment to the streamer, minus their fees.
I think the consumer or the guys putting on the streams will always be in financial peril as long as Ustream operates this way. For now Ustream and others that host can tell them take it or leave it. There's not enough competition and the few guys doing live streams don't have the clout to change the rules.
This all may change in time, I hope. Absent that anyone who buys these events must understand what can happen and accept it or do not buy them. If it's your last $25, just buy lottery tickets I guess:wink:.
He has no business being in the foreground of a business. Behind the scenes, perhaps- but doubtful.
Like I said, I didn't read all the post's
If that was his reply, then I would contact paypal, or your credit card company for a refund. I could understand if only 1 or 2 asked. But if a problem with a bunch. A refund is in order.
If that was his reply, then I would contact paypal, or your credit card company for a refund. I could understand if only 1 or 2 asked. But if a problem with a bunch. A refund is in order.
Your ridiculous post (and btw, there is nothing humble about your opinion) isn't even worthy of a reply. But wtf, why not.
First, my misinformed neanderthal, I never called anyone regarding this match. I have no idea where you get your info from but if you are going to accuse someone of something you might want to get your facts straight first.
Second, I never trashed anyones reputation. I only stated the facts of the situation and anyone that watched the stream from the first day can attest to that.
Third, I don't pick fights. You forced me into a situation to defend myself and my post. If your memory is as weak as your character you might want to go back to the beginning and refresh your memory with your first post.
Fourth, How long I have been on AZ does not make my posts any less valid nor does it give me any less right to express my opinions.
Fifth, Do I have any sympathy for Ustream? Hell no. They are in business to provide a service, and a service which provides them a profit.
This is a business scenario of seller/customer. I have stated that I as well as others that purchased this match understand the technical difficulty aspect of this, what this situation ultimately became about was a customer service issue, period!
Do I care if Miketv does another ppv stream. No, because he hasn't proven to anyone that he is capable of providing quality customer service when issues do arise.
As far as me having issues, yes, I have issues with morons who attack me without provocation and then post inaccurate information stating that I was blowing up someone's cellphone RE: the ppv. Where do you get this sh*t?!
Now crawl back under your rock, or go blow tvmike, or whatever TF you do and stop wasting people's time with your Bullsh*t.
If you want to reply to this, pm me. Others here shouldn't have to be subjected to this, and for that I apologize to everyone on this forum.
Last edited:
The underlying problem seems to be that many of the companies doing business in professional pool, including the promoters, are under-capitalized. So many events seem to be on the come and if the event doesn't go as planned there isn't up front capital to absorb the set back.
When someone buys a stream, purchases a ticket to the event, or most importantly pays an entry fee to a tournament - They're not making a venture capital investment or a loan.
I've known you for what almost 20 years Sam or close to it, and you wouldn't do that, you would do the proper, respectful, thing. You would have PM'd him or shot an email and waited for a response.
You're one of the few good guys Sam.
You're one of the few good guys Sam.
The cellphone comment is a euphemism for the way your acting, i.e. if the stream goes out for 30 seconds you'd be on the phone complaining.
Neanderthal? I wouldn't agree, but if it makes you feel better, roll with it.
You did trash him, if you don't think you trashed him, put yourself in his shoes and see if you were him would you feel trashed based on your comments, and I think you will find that you would. He feel's trashed as evident by his post.
Time on the forum usually gives others a way to gauge your personality and if someone was out of line based on that personality or course of previous actions taken by that person. You wouldn't place a bet with someone who was on here for a few months with a few posts, but you'd be more likely to place that bet if they had 5 years and 10k posts. Works the same way with opinions, if you post you probably are on the site more and probably read more posts so you know whats going on. It's nothing new saying that someone with time in or someone who does something for the industry gets treatment over someone who doesn't.
When he said things looked fine there, they probably did look fine for him, far be it from him to question someone from the pool world to see if what they were saying was correct or not. right?
Not really interested in blowing anyone, but thanks for telling me to go do that. It seems that you could have handled this behind the scenes, but then again, your "blood is boiling" over $25 not a 10k Buska or Szam
Neanderthal? I wouldn't agree, but if it makes you feel better, roll with it.
You did trash him, if you don't think you trashed him, put yourself in his shoes and see if you were him would you feel trashed based on your comments, and I think you will find that you would. He feel's trashed as evident by his post.
Time on the forum usually gives others a way to gauge your personality and if someone was out of line based on that personality or course of previous actions taken by that person. You wouldn't place a bet with someone who was on here for a few months with a few posts, but you'd be more likely to place that bet if they had 5 years and 10k posts. Works the same way with opinions, if you post you probably are on the site more and probably read more posts so you know whats going on. It's nothing new saying that someone with time in or someone who does something for the industry gets treatment over someone who doesn't.
When he said things looked fine there, they probably did look fine for him, far be it from him to question someone from the pool world to see if what they were saying was correct or not. right?
Not really interested in blowing anyone, but thanks for telling me to go do that. It seems that you could have handled this behind the scenes, but then again, your "blood is boiling" over $25 not a 10k Buska or Szam
What's sad is this was a really terrific match - some of the best playing I've seen in a long time coming from two legendary champions - and it should have been an amazing viewing experience.
I feel bad for Mark Cantrill. He put this together nicely and the players gave it their best shot. Nick Varner was great in the booth.
It was a first class production unnecessarily marred by technical issues. I for one would like to hear an explanation of what went wrong.
Chris
I feel bad for Mark Cantrill. He put this together nicely and the players gave it their best shot. Nick Varner was great in the booth.
It was a first class production unnecessarily marred by technical issues. I for one would like to hear an explanation of what went wrong.
Chris
not sure it was worked out
I bought the ppv and the only thing I got 1/2 of the time was audio...
asked if i did something wrong and got every excuse..
reload
log off
log in
reload
reboot system
wrong browser window
reload
log off
log in
refresh
etc etc
I tried for an hour and a half on sat and another hour on sunday...paid $25 for nothing. No solution was ever offered, just a big "its not my fault and you can file a dispute if you arent happy.:angry:
Thanks for the rip off mike!!!
I bought the ppv and the only thing I got 1/2 of the time was audio...
asked if i did something wrong and got every excuse..
reload
log off
log in
reload
reboot system
wrong browser window
reload
log off
log in
refresh
etc etc
I tried for an hour and a half on sat and another hour on sunday...paid $25 for nothing. No solution was ever offered, just a big "its not my fault and you can file a dispute if you arent happy.:angry:
Thanks for the rip off mike!!!
I don't understand why you guys feel like you were ripped off on purpose. Mike was doing the feed live when he tried to help people who paid and could not see the video.You will be refunded your money after you file a dispute with P.P. It was a great match except for Shawn's commentary. The safety play was amazing.Now relax and go file.:wink:
Quoted the part that some people seem to be missing. This is why Ustream holds the funds for the length of time they do. Dispute the transaction, trust me someone can send money via paypal and file a dispute on that payment right after, blocking the funds from being withdrawn by the paid party and those funds will be returned to the sender if the person who recieved the money cannot prove delivery of a product. And that product CANNOT be intellectual property because it is impossible to prove it was received. I have gotten burned on reversed funds on paypal before, trust me in 1 minute that money is no longer going to Ustream if you simply reverse the payment.
filed a dispute
I filed my dispute with pay pal today and I requested a full refund of the $25.
We'll see what happens.
I think if enough people file, pay pal will see that this is a massive fraud that was run on many people....(I dont care about "its not my fault" "technical flaws" or any of that).
The product (the PPV) was not received as advertised...that constitutes fraud and is deserving of a refund.
I filed my dispute with pay pal today and I requested a full refund of the $25.
We'll see what happens.
I think if enough people file, pay pal will see that this is a massive fraud that was run on many people....(I dont care about "its not my fault" "technical flaws" or any of that).
The product (the PPV) was not received as advertised...that constitutes fraud and is deserving of a refund.
Fraud is a little harsh. While it obviously was not handled well, I don't think anyone set out on a premeditated plan to to swindle you out of your money. Quite the opposite. I think they had the best of intentions but things went wrong and the resulting problem probably could have been handled better.
Last edited:
I just got home and have read through a number of these posts. WE STAND GOOD for any refunds. What upsets me more than anything is I know some of you personally. I am amazed that some of you who know me have such little faith in me that you could not call me and ask whats up. Instead you decided to come on here and bash my event, You know who you are. Its cool if you have a problem and as I have explained we will deal with it, just shocked that you didn't call me first.
I will be reviewing all threads about this weekend and will post my thank you to those involved and also trying to clear up any problems with each thread I see.
Mark,
I will be reviewing all threads about this weekend and will post my thank you to those involved and also trying to clear up any problems with each thread I see.
Mark,
As one of the sponsors of this event, and having a lot more that $25 invested, I feel like this should be said....
All those that have insinuated that we were all out to "make a buck" and that Mark Cantrill was ANYTHING but dedicated to the viewers of this event, better pull up now. Mark did everything he could do once the streaming issues were known. You should be so lucky as to have Mark put together such an event as he helped us do. Many sponsors combined to put up thousands of dollars for this event, knowing that their investment was more than likely a donation. Maybe you ought to be thanking them for getting this match together at all, for giving you the opportunity to see two truly great players in this format. Our hope is that those that didn't get what they paid for, will receive some sort of satisfaction. Flame away....I'm your huckleberry....
Chris
All those that have insinuated that we were all out to "make a buck" and that Mark Cantrill was ANYTHING but dedicated to the viewers of this event, better pull up now. Mark did everything he could do once the streaming issues were known. You should be so lucky as to have Mark put together such an event as he helped us do. Many sponsors combined to put up thousands of dollars for this event, knowing that their investment was more than likely a donation. Maybe you ought to be thanking them for getting this match together at all, for giving you the opportunity to see two truly great players in this format. Our hope is that those that didn't get what they paid for, will receive some sort of satisfaction. Flame away....I'm your huckleberry....
Chris