Wow! And I was just going to see which feel I liked if there is really any differance.
Remove the bumper?
- Thread starter measureman
- Start date
Wow! And I was just going to see which feel I liked if there is really any differance.
Could be a bigger issue than CTE!
Better watch out, harmonics could be a bigger issue than CTE. Often it is the harmonics in a barrel that keeps a rifle from shooting properly. The primary harmonic travels the length of the barrel about four times I believe before the bullet leaves the barrel. Adjusting where the muzzle is at in the harmonic is the key to accuracy, particularly with the rimfires where the secondary harmonics are much closer to the strength of the primary harmonic than centerfires.
It is an interesting question if the harmonic returns to the tip before the tip leaves the cue ball. If so, is it a good thing or bad? At a guess I would prefer to slow the harmonic down enough that it doesn't return to the tip before the tip leaves the cue ball if possible. A cork or leather wrap and a bumper might do just that. I don't know and I don't know how effective linen would be compared to the other wraps.
It is easy to get all the force we need from the initial hit so I don't think I want to concern myself with trying to milk extra work from the returning harmonics. One of my cues has a large hollow in the butt. Wonder where my can of Great Stuff insulating foam is. That should dampen things nicely . . . .
Hu
Better watch out, harmonics could be a bigger issue than CTE. Often it is the harmonics in a barrel that keeps a rifle from shooting properly. The primary harmonic travels the length of the barrel about four times I believe before the bullet leaves the barrel. Adjusting where the muzzle is at in the harmonic is the key to accuracy, particularly with the rimfires where the secondary harmonics are much closer to the strength of the primary harmonic than centerfires.
It is an interesting question if the harmonic returns to the tip before the tip leaves the cue ball. If so, is it a good thing or bad? At a guess I would prefer to slow the harmonic down enough that it doesn't return to the tip before the tip leaves the cue ball if possible. A cork or leather wrap and a bumper might do just that. I don't know and I don't know how effective linen would be compared to the other wraps.
It is easy to get all the force we need from the initial hit so I don't think I want to concern myself with trying to milk extra work from the returning harmonics. One of my cues has a large hollow in the butt. Wonder where my can of Great Stuff insulating foam is. That should dampen things nicely . . . .
Hu
A quick warning about great stuff....keep it away from that beard.
Cuebuddy > been there done that:embarrassed2:.
Stop-no CTE in my thread please.
The resonance changes when you take out the bumper and the cue is definitely louder, I love the fact that you can hear the cue better since that feedback is important to me. I've removed the bumper but cut it in part and hollowed out the center, then glued the two piece to the bottom so it protects the butt cap.
Can send pictures if you like, it's rather messy since I'm not a machinist and I did it free-hand with a dremel. I've done it this way so you get the benefits but also the protection of the bumper it just took a little bit of time and every once in a while you have to check to make sure your glued on bumper hasn't fallen off.
Can send pictures if you like, it's rather messy since I'm not a machinist and I did it free-hand with a dremel. I've done it this way so you get the benefits but also the protection of the bumper it just took a little bit of time and every once in a while you have to check to make sure your glued on bumper hasn't fallen off.
Actually fuji, post a pic here if you can. I'd like to see what you did if you don't mind.
I have 2 bumperless Brunswicks and absolutely love the feel and sound.
I have 2 bumperless Brunswicks and absolutely love the feel and sound.
Sorry to thread jack measureman, but is it ok to take the weight bolt of the lucasi out? I read that its part of the structure of McD's but what about lucasi? i like the lightness without it but i have found no valueable info about taking it out, so i screwed it back in to be safe. Now you glued yours back in, is it part of the structural intergrity of the cue? thanks in advance.
Ģüśţāṿ;2954688 said:
I have no idea as to the structural integrity of leaving a weight bolt out of a Lucasi. I have a habit of taping the cue from side to side on my foot which I think caused the bolt to loosen and make noise. So I just glued it in to prevent that from happening again.And of course I used Chinese made epoxy :thumbup:
So back to bumper or not to bumper that is the question Today I will play with the Pechauer with and with out bumper and report my findings.
So as Paul Harvey would say"Stand by for news!"
Today i played with the Pechauer. I removed the bumper and instead of a "thud" sound it was more of a "plink" which I did not like. Now what I did not pay attention to before was that Pechauer cues have a very small bumper that probably does not absorb much of the vibrations. I will try it next with the mighty Lucasi that has a bigger bumper.
To Gustav : I would suggest you email Lucasi and ask them directly, as emailing McDermott that question gives you an answer of yes, the weight bolt is part of the structural integrity of the cue (as you mentioned you have already read on these forums). Every manufacturer is different though, so I would go straight to the source.
It changes things alot,the balance point for 1 thing. Since the bumper is at the very end of the cue,thats where things are magnified as far as balance.My 98 lambros felt a lil butt heavy so i ran over to mikes shop to see what he could do(im anal on my balance point since i play w/such a lite cue), mike took the cue,put it on a wedge at the balance point,took off the bumper & the balance point moved to where it was perfect for me.Try it if you want but it did change things alot as far as playing 1 hole with the weight just a lil more forward.jmho
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It tells me that some one was bouncing it on the floor causing the rubber to expand and blew the side of the butt-cap out.
How anal are you about the balance point where does it have to be for you?
Rubber bumpers
That may have been me. A couple of days ago I posted in a thread about South West cues -how much I like them and how I always take out the bumper. I prefer a high pitched resonance sound, and the crisp feel that comes from hard tips, dense wood, ivory or similar ferrules, and no dampening by the rubber bumper. Someone on here recently described it as hitting 2 ball peen hammers together face to face. That's pretty close. Not everyone likes this hit, some prefer the soft thud, which feels dead to me. Some cues have a great sound even with a rubber bumper. Szambotis, both Gus and Barry, make sweet music that you can recognize from across the room. Every cue is different, but most times taking it out does make some difference. A previous poster said the bumper was invented to cut the sound in poolrooms, and I wonder if they meant the sound of a cue hitting a ball, or the cues tapping on the floor? I don't feel the need to protect the buttcap as it is hard phenolic, the floor is carpet, and I don't bang it down (not real hard, anyway
). For what it's worth, the picture of the broken buttcap in this thread is almost always caused by banging the cue on the ground causing the rubber inside it to expand and blow the buttcap apart. I've replaced many of those. If the rubber had been out, it probably would still be in one piece
That may have been me. A couple of days ago I posted in a thread about South West cues -how much I like them and how I always take out the bumper. I prefer a high pitched resonance sound, and the crisp feel that comes from hard tips, dense wood, ivory or similar ferrules, and no dampening by the rubber bumper. Someone on here recently described it as hitting 2 ball peen hammers together face to face. That's pretty close. Not everyone likes this hit, some prefer the soft thud, which feels dead to me. Some cues have a great sound even with a rubber bumper. Szambotis, both Gus and Barry, make sweet music that you can recognize from across the room. Every cue is different, but most times taking it out does make some difference. A previous poster said the bumper was invented to cut the sound in poolrooms, and I wonder if they meant the sound of a cue hitting a ball, or the cues tapping on the floor? I don't feel the need to protect the buttcap as it is hard phenolic, the floor is carpet, and I don't bang it down (not real hard, anyway
). For what it's worth, the picture of the broken buttcap in this thread is almost always caused by banging the cue on the ground causing the rubber inside it to expand and blow the buttcap apart. I've replaced many of those. If the rubber had been out, it probably would still be in one piece
really interesting, great post...
Good rifle info. As far as "slowing down" a harmonic frequency, I don't know if you mean the velocity through the cue, but that should be a constant. The variable components should be the dynamic range of frequencies due to dampening and the energy amplitude of those frequencies. I will have to think about this some. Here is how I look at energy from these waves going back into the cueball from a vibrating cue: remember the old test to find a cue balance point? Hold up the cue level with two index fingers spaced apart toward the ends. Then slowly slide your index fingers toward each other. The frictional forces (static, kinetic or both depending on how fast you slide your fingers) alternate from the left finger to the right and back again as the forces temporarily overcome each other. Eventually the fingers should end up touching close to the balance point. I theorize that because of "equal and opposite reactions" the cuetip pushes the cueball, the cueball pushes back, the cuetip pushes again, etc., depending on the elasticity of the tip, and eventually the two separate. A frenchman centuries ago found an equation proving that increased contact time increases energy transfer and I think these alternating forces affect that depending on longitudinal vibration.
If the harmonics you are talking about are longitudinal waves it seems like the shorter the wavelength the more of these interactions occur during contact time, so more energy is transferred (pressure waves?) However, if the waves have a transverse component (and it seems like any off-center hit would cause some transverse component) then the contact time and possibly location could be altered. If you bang your hand on your shaft and feel the vibration on the side of the cue you instinctively know that there are some transverse waves going on. I wish Bob Jewett would weigh in on this issue. It fascinates me- sorry for the long posts.
Good rifle info. As far as "slowing down" a harmonic frequency, I don't know if you mean the velocity through the cue, but that should be a constant. The variable components should be the dynamic range of frequencies due to dampening and the energy amplitude of those frequencies. I will have to think about this some. Here is how I look at energy from these waves going back into the cueball from a vibrating cue: remember the old test to find a cue balance point? Hold up the cue level with two index fingers spaced apart toward the ends. Then slowly slide your index fingers toward each other. The frictional forces (static, kinetic or both depending on how fast you slide your fingers) alternate from the left finger to the right and back again as the forces temporarily overcome each other. Eventually the fingers should end up touching close to the balance point. I theorize that because of "equal and opposite reactions" the cuetip pushes the cueball, the cueball pushes back, the cuetip pushes again, etc., depending on the elasticity of the tip, and eventually the two separate. A frenchman centuries ago found an equation proving that increased contact time increases energy transfer and I think these alternating forces affect that depending on longitudinal vibration.
If the harmonics you are talking about are longitudinal waves it seems like the shorter the wavelength the more of these interactions occur during contact time, so more energy is transferred (pressure waves?) However, if the waves have a transverse component (and it seems like any off-center hit would cause some transverse component) then the contact time and possibly location could be altered. If you bang your hand on your shaft and feel the vibration on the side of the cue you instinctively know that there are some transverse waves going on. I wish Bob Jewett would weigh in on this issue. It fascinates me- sorry for the long posts.
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Hu...I know what you meant, it's just what you said. The tip does not ever 'leave' the CB. The CB leaves the tip...1/1000th of a second after contact. 
Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com
Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com
Interesting topic. Some cues just have a distinctive solid resonant ring and feel that makes them special. You feel the hit through the pads of your fingers.
Fwiw: JohnnyP of Azb has done some very interesting experimentation re cue vibration feedback involving visual display and measurement.
Maybe worth a PM. JohnnyP is a smart guy. And one of the good guys.
And a dedicated practioner of the dreaded 'L' drill.
(uh oh-might av killed his action-sorry Johnny):grin-square:
Take care