Ronnie Wiseman stiff's me for $3900

You lost 4500 first go around
won 8000 the second go around with an additional 3900 owed/aired.

I can see where you would be pissed, but really...with end result being what it is...wouldnt you like more pool players like wiseman to stroll through your doors at hattiesburg?

seriously, I hope you get paid in full, you sound like a great guy to gamble with who doesnt air anyone. I just dont like your chances since its gotten down to the people who owe pointing fingers at each other while none of them move to pay off. Maybe you will get lucky and get a settlement and you can write the rest off as a smaller bite than one Incardona wrote about.
 
hemicudas said:
From the first day pool players started traveling the country looking for action, their dream find was a room owner that had a ton of heart and a bank roll to match. A place where they could triple or quadruple their own bank rolls. A place where they could get all the rail action they could stand. A place where the owner was not the only person they could win serious cash playing. A place where the owner would shake their hand and say, tell-um where you got it, on their way out the door.

Shawn's Green Room in Hattiesburg is such a pool room. Ronnie and Scott knew they were in such a place when they got there. Ronnie had previously booked large winners in the place and been paid every dime of the money he had won. No light game or games. Ronnie knew he could come back and get the same quality action and he did.

This time maybe Ronnie wasn't in dead stroke or maybe Shawn was but instead of showing Shawn the same class and respect he was shown, Ronnie, saw a chance to play a class guy for a sucker and did.

Ronnie, obviously owes Shawn the entire sum. How Ronnie was cutting money does not enter into the equation. Shawn deserves to be treated the same way he treats other players.

Pay the man what you owe him, Ronnie.
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Tap Tap Tap. Here is a man who knows the real score. When I had my pool rooms, road players loved to come and play me for exactly that reason. If they won, they got paid EVERYTHING! And they just might get to bet 100-500 or more a game. With substantial side action.
 
Looks like Ronnie Wiseman took a page from KT's debt cures book.
 

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Roy Steffensen said:
Wow, now he doesn't owe anything???

What a piece of shit...

I really, really hope you get your money Shawn. And I hope that this ruins all future action for Ronnie "Actionhound" Wiseman. (But unfortunately I have a feeling it will not happen that way)
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Around 18 years ago late pro player Gary spaeth with his backer was on the road to european countries especially Germany playing pool.During Lexington all stars tournament in continental Inn he told the group of admirers about his experiences in European countries.One of the things he said that stayed in my memory is: When European players loose the bet they immediately pay the money and shake hand with you and they are very gentlemanly unlike American players.:cool:
 
stiff me for $3900

This type of crap is what has given pool such a lousy outlook for so many years. Outsiders look in and think who would want to be involved in a sport like that. Cannot believe RW says he does not owe you anything. I may not have much and worked hard all my life for what little bit I do have, but one thing I have is Respect from other people. I sleep good at night. I dont screw people. Hope it works out better but dosent sound good at this time.
 
Vagabond, what Gary was speaking about was probably the rule instead of the exception; European players are probably a step above Americans as far as class goes (playing pool for money.)

I don't know where or how we, in this country developed such a low-class nature as far as money-players in pool are concerned, but it goes way back, way before I can remember.

That's one reason I stopped playing for money altogether. Just too big of a hassle, even if you lose.

I'm sure Ron Wiseman means well, but rationalizing that he doesn't owe the money is just a state of denial, and I've seen a ton of money players with this same attitude.
 
At this point I tend to agree with Watchez.
I dont think we have heard the real story from anyone yet.
And since I dont think I would ever gamble with anyone for more than a few dollars, the subject holds very little interest as to who actually got one over on who.
However, I am really amazed at some of the responses and opinions posted in this thread.

I met Ronnie Wiseman when I was was working in Detroit and apart from watching him play in some tournaments, I don't know him at all.
He had a reputation as being a strong player and from what I seen he was very good.
Soo ... my two cents worth is that I think it is something that needs to be worked out between the players involved and not judged by a public opinion hearing. I am sure these people will meet again somewhere down the road and settle up one way or another.
 
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?Post?? What do you mean ?Post?? I haven?t stiffed anybody in two weeks!

While scuffling around the pool rooms and bars in Houston in the mid 80's, I can't tell you the number of times I was air barreled. Small stuff and mostly on the last game or final set.

Here are a few observations I've made over the years:

Players who stiff other players come down with a symptom I call "selective amnesia". They can remember every dime that is owed them but, for the life of them, they can?t remember the money they owe anyone else.

If you knock their action by letting other players know that they stiffed you, you will never get paid and you will never get them back on the table for future action.

If you knock their action hard enough, they will:
Say they owe you nothing because you knocked their action ala RW according Shauwn.
Say they paid off in full and owe you nothing,
Say they never played you in the first place and owe you nothing.
Say they won and you stiffed them.

Or get really pissed off and want to fight. I didn't like this one much because I'm 0-11 in bar fights. LOL

Years ago, word spread about bad action but not at light speed like it does today. Like Buddy Hall said, "The biggest knocks on action today are cell phones and the internet."

Smorg is right on point. They just won"t be visiting Shauwn?s pool room again in the near future as this is business as usual and the really sick part is hardly anyone will remember this six months from now.

Stones
 
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Pool As Usaual

Everything I Have Read Thus Far Sounds Like The Same Old Song And Dance. I Never Was A Good Player By Any Lengths But Everyone Liked Playing Me For One Reason... If You Won You Won Something And You Got Paid Every #$#@$ Dime Of It. I Have Met Shawn On Several Occasions He Is A Super Guy With A Great Room And Will Match Up And Play Anyone And What Hes Got And Can Get A Hold Of Is In Action. Now On The Other Side You Have People Like Ronnie Who I Have Also Been Around A Few Times (mainly In Detroit When I Lived There For A Brief Stint) Who Pray On Guys Like Shawn Who Have A Decent Game A Lot Of Heart And A Ton Of Gambling Ronnie Beat Him Last Time And Went Back To Get More. But It Didnt Work This Time And He Got Lapped Playing One Pocket What A Joke And A Guy Puts In Xxx Amount Of Time Beating A Champion Like Ronnie And Doesnt Get Compensated And People Wonder Why Everyone Always Quits This Pathetic Game Thats Why Because Of Predators Like Ronnie Who Get Beat Down Then Dont Compensate They Guy For Doing It Its A Joke As Is This Game!!!!!!!!!


Shawn Good Luck On Your Money Sounds Like You Will Need It
Catcha Next Time Im In Hattisburg



Jason Ling
 
hemicudas said:
From the first day pool players started traveling the country looking for action, their dream find was a room owner that had a ton of heart and a bank roll to match. A place where they could triple or quadruple their own bank rolls. A place where they could get all the rail action they could stand. A place where the owner was not the only person they could win serious cash playing. A place where the owner would shake their hand and say, tell-um where you got it, on their way out the door.

Shawn's Green Room in Hattiesburg is such a pool room. Ronnie and Scott knew they were in such a place when they got there. Ronnie had previously booked large winners in the place and been paid every dime of the money he had won. No light game or games. Ronnie knew he could come back and get the same quality action and he did.

This time maybe Ronnie wasn't in dead stroke or maybe Shawn was but instead of showing Shawn the same class and respect he was shown, Ronnie, saw a chance to play a class guy for a sucker and did.

Ronnie, obviously owes Shawn the entire sum. How Ronnie was cutting money does not enter into the equation. Shawn deserves to be treated the same way he treats other players.

Pay the man what you owe him, Ronnie.
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Ronnie "I won't post from coast to coast" Wiseman, PAY UP !!!!
 
Not His Problem

Neil said:
Shawn: Sorry this happened to you. I know personally how much it sucks. (not from Ronnie) Some say you deserved it for not posting. No, you don't deserve it. But, when you lay your 'peter' out on the table and dare someone to smack it, rest assured, someone eventually will!

Trying to look at all sides of what you posted, I can understand Ronnie's way of thinking. I seriously doubt Scott and Justin would have hung around if they weren't 'in' with Ronnie. In his eyes, he paid you. The rest was on them.

Where Ronnie is wrong, and he has to take the heat for it, is that the game was set up with you and him. Not the others. Regardless of who all is in on the bet, it's Ronnies' bet, and his responsibility. But if it where me, I would be looking just as hard at Scott and Justin as I would at Ronnie when it comes to any more gambling with them involved.

Sometimes people forget we live in an 'open' world nowdays. And a lot of info gets spread around real fast. Remember- it only takes one "aw sh!t" to erase a thousand "attaboys"! And people tend to rember stepping in that 'stuff' a lot longer!
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His deal was with Wiseman not Scott and the other guy, so Wiseman owes him the money. If Wiseman got stiffed by Scott and Justin then thats his problem. This is another example of why pool wont be moving to the the bigtime anytime soon. When you have pro pool players stiffing people, and Pro's like Corey Duel who set their buddy up (Johnny Archer) to play a golf hustler..and the hustler beat Johnny out of 90 grand!! Where I come from guys doing stuff like this would get a beating ...at least a really good beating and then they would know whats up. Try doing this stuff on the south side of Boston. Ronnie wouldnt have made it out of the pool room because everybody in the room would have been on him.
 
How about in the Philippines

jay helfert said:
Tap Tap Tap. Here is a man who knows the real score. When I had my pool rooms, road players loved to come and play me for exactly that reason. If they won, they got paid EVERYTHING! And they just might get to bet 100-500 or more a game. With substantial side action.
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Hey Jay,

What would have happened to Ronnie in the Philippines if he pulled this move? How do they handle things over there? I know you have posted about going over there several times and wondering if you could give us your insight on their way of doing business.
 
hmmm

i just dont understand why people cant just be up front about money .....i have played people if they dont have the money they always tell me before hand or if we are playing a set and one of us get broke and want to keep playing just tell the the other guy and make arrangements....and if ronnie would had been more honest and told him he probably would had kept playing anyways and just put ronnie on a tab and since they had played before it wouldnt had been a problem but now ronnie has lost good action but i guess some people cant think correctly
 
turbo billards said:
i just dont understand why people cant just be up front about money .....i have played people if they dont have the money they always tell me before hand or if we are playing a set and one of us get broke and want to keep playing just tell the the other guy and make arrangements....and if ronnie would had been more honest and told him he probably would had kept playing anyways and just put ronnie on a tab and since they had played before it wouldnt had been a problem but now ronnie has lost good action but i guess some people cant think correctly
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They did have an arrangement ....you need to re-read this entire thread slooooowwwwwwwwweeerrrrrrrr
 
in the Phillippines

DrawtheRock said:
Hey Jay,

What would have happened to Ronnie in the Philippines if he pulled this move? How do they handle things over there? I know you have posted about going over there several times and wondering if you could give us your insight on their way of doing business.
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I'm not sure but when I was in the Phillippines during my Navy days, they always warned me about a "filipino haircut"....
 
"What would they do in the Philippines if you don't pay up?"
The same thing as they USE to do here before there were forty pages of lawyers in every local phone book and you went to jail for trying to collect your own money. Meanwhile company executives and 90% of Washington get a slap on the wrist for stealing millions.

Pull that stuff 40 or 50 years ago and the whole room would take you outside and beat you close to death if you didn't have the money or a car to sign over. I'm sure there are a lot of places in the US that you wouldn't get away with it now. If it was done to me at my age I'd pay to have someone collect for me. And know I haven't been watching too many movies. (been there, done that). You stiff me for money and I'll pay double what I'm owed to get even. I know one thing he wouldn't be at Turning Stone playing in a major tournament like nothing ever happened. Johnnyt
 
Johnnyt said:
"What would they do in the Philippines if you don't pay up?"
The same thing as they USE to do here before there were forty pages of lawyers in every local phone book and you went to jail for trying to collect your own money. Meanwhile company executives and 90% of Washington get a slap on the wrist for stealing millions.

Pull that stuff 40 or 50 years ago and the whole room would take you outside and beat you close to death if you didn't have the money or a car to sign over. I'm sure there are a lot of places in the US that you wouldn't get away with it now. If it was done to me at my age I'd pay to have someone collect for me. And know I haven't been watching too many movies. (been there, done that). You stiff me for money and I'll pay double what I'm owed to get even. I know one thing he wouldn't be at Turning Stone playing in a major tournament like nothing ever happened. Johnnyt
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Johnny where I grew up in Dayton, they had guys who specialized in collections, among other things. They WOULD get your money, but they usually charged 50% to collect. Mostly they worked for bookies, but they hung around the poolrooms, and were more than willing to collect on a pool debt.

I had a problem once at Winks over a measly $30 (this was the early 60's), and I knew I wasn't going to get paid. I had beaten some kid playing $2 9-Ball. One of the tush hog collectors was watching our game. The next day he handed me the $30. He told me the first one was free, but from then on I had to pay, and he just winked at me. Of course that kid wouldn't look cross eyed at me after that. I had no idea what happened to him to make him pay, and I never asked.

I did learn one good lesson from that experience a million years ago. After that, I would only go five games on the wire before paying at $2 a game, and if I was betting $5 (One Pocket), it was pay after two games. And they had to show me some money first! This saved me a lot of grief down the road.
 
Yes we had collectors in the poolrooms, bars, and back room casinos in NY. Myself, I used bikers after the Viet war. Most of them still had a taste for blood. Johnnyt
 
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