Schmidt/Harriman--Any updates?

[Fatboy]

Danny winner

400-255

Danny 3 100 ball runs


they are back tomorrow 4:00 central

ppv 6:00 pm central

one pocket
'

3 100 ball runs in a race to 400 is amazing, thats what it takes to beat John S.

These guys who say that the 14.1 players of the past were stronger players I disagree with. I'm the worst straight pool player ever so my opinion isnt comming from the best source, but I can play other games, and I know the equipment now is different, faster cloth, tighter pockets and new balls, not mud balls that open up a bit better when you go into the stack, but I have Balabushkas that move the balls to much on 860 that would be great cues on Stevens cloth, with mud balls to make up for the sluggish equipment of the past, there are smaller pockets now, so that makes thiings tougher. Ok so whats the point, I truely believe that Mosconi's 526 would have been beat if more people played 14.1 and I believe that were a few years away from it being beat, Either of these two guys tonight on a 8' box that Mosconi made the 526 on are capable of beating it.


I hope John S. wins tomarrow and the next day. So we can have the rubber match. He is capable.

congrats to both for grinding it out,

 

[spoonie]

pool match

Was'nt able to get logged on tonight,have watched most of the other ppv.
When I clicked on the site it said it could'nt locate the site where you pay.
I never had any trouble before......

 

[Scottster]

Wow.. Danny must have shit out to beat the "AZ Billiards" proclaimed best USA Straight pool player by 145 balls... definately a fluke....

 

[turbo billards]

yea

at one point danny was only down 168 to -1 haha sick isnt it

 

[av84fun]

3 100 ball runs in a race to 400 is amazing, thats what it takes to beat John S.

These guys who say that the 14.1 players of the past were stronger players I disagree with. I'm the worst straight pool player ever so my opinion isnt comming from the best source, but I can play other games, and I know the equipment now is different, faster cloth, tighter pockets and new balls, not mud balls that open up a bit better when you go into the stack, but I have Balabushkas that move the balls to much on 860 that would be great cues on Stevens cloth, with mud balls to make up for the sluggish equipment of the past, there are smaller pockets now, so that makes thiings tougher. Ok so whats the point, I truely believe that Mosconi's 526 would have been beat if more people played 14.1 and I believe that were a few years away from it being beat, Either of these two guys tonight on a 8' box that Mosconi made the 526 on are capable of beating it. I hope John S. wins tomarrow and the next day. So we can have the rubber match. He is capable.

congrats to both for grinding it out,

Of course you could be right...and it would be a wonderful thing to see but I doubt it. 100 runs are fantastic but they are 426 short.

I honestly don't know the average pocket widths back in the day...or the shelf depths or the facing angles...but I do know that the vast majority of 14.1 shots are made on the foot half of the table so there's only 6 inches difference from center to the foot rail and 3 inches from center to the side rails and any SLIGHT advantage in shot length could easily be over shadowed by more congestion.

Ball quality is an issue as you pointed out but I am not sure that the balls back in the day played as true as they do now...so I have no opinion as to whether today's balls are an advantage or disadvantage. But my GUESS is that today's balls are an advantage since of the old technology produced balls that were more true, then we would still be playing with that technology....it seems to me.

Still, I would love to see it happen...I just don't think it will mostly because today's players don't practice or play the game nearly as much as was the case back in the day.

Regards,
Jim

 

[Luxury]

I think I may have picked a winner. It ain't over yet. That Harriman don't rattle.

 

[jay helfert]

Of course you could be right...and it would be a wonderful thing to see but I doubt it. 100 runs are fantastic but they are 426 short.

I honestly don't know the average pocket widths back in the day...or the shelf depths or the facing angles...but I do know that the vast majority of 14.1 shots are made on the foot half of the table so there's only 6 inches difference from center to the foot rail and 3 inches from center to the side rails and any SLIGHT advantage in shot length could easily be over shadowed by more congestion.

Ball quality is an issue as you pointed out but I am not sure that the balls back in the day played as true as they do now...so I have no opinion as to whether today's balls are an advantage or disadvantage. But my GUESS is that today's balls are an advantage since of the old technology produced balls that were more true, then we would still be playing with that technology....it seems to me.

Still, I would love to see it happen...I just don't think it will mostly because today's players don't practice or play the game nearly as much as was the case back in the day.

Regards,
Jim

I remember seeing the table that Mosconi made his historic run on. That poolroom was still there well into the 60's. I lived in Dayton so Springfield was only 20 or so miles away. I believe it was an A.E. Schmidt over size 8'. This was the most common size table around the Midwest back then.

These were good tables (remember they were competing with Brunswick Anniversaries and Sport Kings), with straight cut pockets, fairly deep shelves and openings under 5". Not as tough as a Diamond today, but not as soft as one might think. Mosconi played on slow cloth with clay balls in 1956 (or was it 1954). I'd like to see any current player try to match that. They might have trouble running 100 balls.

Of course, if any present day player runs over 526 on a Diamond table, he will deserve the recognition he will receive. Same for a triple shimmed Gold Crown.

 

[Johnnyt]

Congrats to Danny. I have to say I came very close to giving someone 2/1 for $100(me taking John) when John opened with 112. Then I remembered what Yogi said, and pulled it back. I finally got a winner on one of the action matches...I broke even. Johnnyt

 

[easy-e]

Wow.. Danny must have shit out to beat the "AZ Billiards" proclaimed best USA Straight pool player by 145 balls... definately a fluke....

I think you are the only one saying this is a fluke. I know you were being sarcastic, but who was it directed towards?

 

[Gerry]

VERY good 14.1 last night. 100+ on a Diamond is excellent pool! both guys played up to expectation, and they will tell you when playing 14.1 even to 400 you are always looking over your shoulder.....your never far enough ahead! I wouldn't mind seeing 4 blocks of 250....1 early, 1 late over 2 days. No question whos playing best that weekend!

as far as the old equipment....MANY top flight old skoolers will tell you the clay balls DIDN'T skid like plastic does, and thats what stopped Danny's run at 133? Skids are the biggest problem with todays equipment IMO. Thats why they kept cleaning the balls.

I'm very much looking forward to the 1 pocket tonight.

 

[Tablemechanic]

Wow.. Danny must have shit out to beat the "AZ Billiards" proclaimed best USA Straight pool player by 145 balls... definately a fluke....

Scott,
I think it is because of the table he has to practice on now. I wish them both good luck, I am friends with John and Danny. I am glad to see two of the best all around players in the world play each other.

Steve

 

[Blackjack]

Congratulations to Danny! IMO, he is making a statement with that straight pool performance, and it will be very difficult for anybody to win against Danny in the all around format. He's just that damn good.

 

[Terry Ardeno]

Thanks T.A.R.!

I also would like to offer sincere congratulations to Danny. Wow! Beating Schmidt, who just beat Ortmann....Very good win indeed!

Is the pecking order being re-established? If a talent like that (Harriman) decides to stay with pool and continue to give his all, who knows what other exploits he has in him?

I also have great confidence in the solidness of John Schmidt's game, as well as his tenacity. He's still likely to win the next bunch of matches against anybody he plays. He's still a great player also.

There's still a lot of pool yet to be played.....

 

[Ktown D]

Danny handed him his ass........plain and simple.

Glad I didn't bet much on John.

 

[xianmacx]

Danny handed him his ass........plain and simple.

Glad I didn't bet much on John.

I concur. Im glad I didn't bet too much also..haha

Danny is showing alot of people how much heart he has. Down by 150 and goes right into the high run of the night.

IMO for a TOP tier player (us open, mr 400) JS gets weak when someone fires back at him.

Ian

 

[Terry Ardeno]

IMO for a TOP tier player (us open, mr 400) JS gets weak when someone fires back at him.

Ian

Ian,
I've heard that said about other players at times, but never JS. That's an interesting observation. Can you elaborate on what you see that gives you that impression? I'm curious as to what you saw that makes you think that.
Thanks.

 

[ShootingArts]

balls

The old clay balls weren't as inclined to skid but the trade off was that you had to consider how each and every ball in the rack rolled. It was very rare to have a set of balls that rolled the same. I played with clay balls some, I'm not that old but the equipment I played on was. How hard to hit a ball and what shot you were willing to try to make depended on which ball you were shooting at. It wasn't enough to know the shots, you had to know each ball also.

No need to take my word for which balls were harder to play with though. Joe Davis' entire autobiography was online the last I knew although I have lost my bookmark. He talks about the runs and scores soaring when they changed to the much more consistent plastic balls. The level of execution is greater today however I do think that the knowledge and understanding needed to play the game at the highest level was greater on the old equipment.

All of this being said, there is no doubt in my mind that Mosconi's record would fall if 14.1 had a resurgence in popularity for five years or so.

Hu

VERY good 14.1 last night. 100+ on a Diamond is excellent pool! both guys played up to expectation, and they will tell you when playing 14.1 even to 400 you are always looking over your shoulder.....your never far enough ahead! I wouldn't mind seeing 4 blocks of 250....1 early, 1 late over 2 days. No question whos playing best that weekend!

as far as the old equipment....MANY top flight old skoolers will tell you the clay balls DIDN'T skid like plastic does, and thats what stopped Danny's run at 133? Skids are the biggest problem with todays equipment IMO. Thats why they kept cleaning the balls.

I'm very much looking forward to the 1 pocket tonight.

 

[Salamander]

Some of you people are being unrealistic. Straight pool is a game of runs, where it is not unusual for players to "shut out" one another. Suppose after one of these 100 ball runs, John (who has been on ice for 1/2 hour)gets out of the chair and is faced with with a very difficult shot and/or safety. He misses, and Danny starts another long run. Shut outs happen in this game. They are both great straight pool players. In my opinion they would both have to play blocks of straight pool over several weeks, like Mosconi, Crane, Balsis, etc... for me to have an opinion as to who might be the better straight pool player.

I hope that John comes back and plays competative 1 pocket today....and not just because I to have some side action on the outcome.

Regards,

Doug

 

[worriedbeef]

Ian,
I've heard that said about other players at times, but never JS. That's an interesting observation. Can you elaborate on what you see that gives you that impression? I'm curious as to what you saw that makes you think that.
Thanks.

I can sort of see where he's coming from. I think John himself has said in the past that he does have a tendency perhaps a bit more than most to feel the pressure a bit more and dog a few shots.

Nevertheless he's a fantastic player, and definitely one of the best in the world at the moment.

 

[xianmacx]

Ian,
I've heard that said about other players at times, but never JS. That's an interesting observation. Can you elaborate on what you see that gives you that impression? I'm curious as to what you saw that makes you think that.
Thanks.

Terry,

Durring the first all around, I noticed it more in the 10 ball set. He made a few error that were not pro level errors (imo). That one very easy 10 ball that he missed, (it might have skidded). Last night in the straight pool match, he had a cut into the side pocket and he hit it with a super "dog" stroke and the ball just simply didn't reach the pocket. People might say he had to do that to hold shape, but I think he just plain dogged it. Again this is all IMO but it seems like his arm getting a smidge tight when the pressure is on. Not taking anything away from him, he is one of the top american players. Just my observations and for the record, I have bet on him both times.

Ian