Smoking bans causes more DUI deaths
- Thread starter TXsouthpaw
- Start date
chefjeff said:
No Jeff, you have processed the facts incorrectly. Pool does not create ANY of those things. Individual people create those problems. You will find those same issues in nearly any area of life.
It seems most on these forums really need the 3 out in arguing.
Because the public is invited into it.
The law would say that only someone who is currently causing trouble, or has caused trouble in the past, can be not allowed in. Any discrimination against a particular group is expressly forbidden by the law
I'm sure the 100's of pool room owners across the country have and answer to this question. My guess is that there is money to be made (though not much) in servicing people within the guidlines set forth by the law. In fact, one would expect discrimination against groups who do not cause any trouble to other patrons to LOSE business.
I would not. That is why I am very happy about non-smoking laws. They make it possible to go to poolhalls with smokers and non-smokers alike. See, you might not have realized this, but non-smoking pool halls DO allow smokers. They are allowed to some in, play pool, socialize-do all the things the non smokers do. Its great!
No, because *WHAT THINGS ARE THEIR RIGHT* are the things that are voted on. If you lose the vote, then that thing WAS NOT AND IS NOT your right anymore.
If the "owner" of the hall is planning on excercising the privilige of operating a business that is inviting the public in, then yes, at that point he is giving up his right to chose who is on his property. If instead he is not open to the public, and it is a private establishment, then I suppose that he can then choose by whatever method he wishes.
chefjeff said:I'm not sure of your point....Are you saying that malls are not private property?
I said "strip malls or similar private developments".
Did the word "similar" throw you? By "similar" I meant "similar to strip malls".
My point was to illustrate the difference between those sorts of places and pool halls that are built right up to public sidewalks. You tend to have more foot traffic passing by on public sidewalks than you do on the walkways that run along the fronts of strip malls (depending on the neighborhoods/time of day, naturally).
Last time I checked, smokers votes count equally as non-smokers ( in elections ).JamisonNeu said:
branpureza said:
chefjeff said:
Ha, what other drugs do freedom, liberty, and property apply to? That's a joke. Cocaine used to be legal too until they wised up to it. In case you haven't noticed the ban has already started to spread throughout the country... I guess I'll have to wait for those "consequences" you were referring to while you wait outside until you finish your Salem Lights 100s.
This thread is destined to become very long.
I still miss the USA
I know how much our votes count. Do you? Remember election 2000.
JoeyInCali said:
I know how much our votes count. Do you? Remember election 2000.
JamisonNeu said:
Yup. Bush won, fair and square, and EVERY recount verified this. If you REALLY want to know what the American people think of Bush, look at his results in the 2004 election, NOT listen to the very vocal few. He got more votes in the 2004 election THAN ANY PRESIDENT IN U.S. HISTORY.
Now, just like in that election, your vote still counts. Unfortunately, since you are in the (vast) minority in supporting smoking in public establishments, collectively, the votes of smoking rights supporters are much, much, MUCH fewer than those of people who like cleaaaannnnnnn air.
Ain't America great?
Russ
Russ Chewning said:
If you like clean air so much then why ban smokers??? How about oil??? I know for at least 25 years we could have got rid of that pollutant. Pretty sure that causes alot more second hand smoke than someones cig.
It is easier to go after people that won't fight back, no honor in it, but it is easier. Pretty sure the 1% produces 99% of the pollution that is causing lung cancer. Yet people are convinced their dad caught cancer from cigs. That is the biggest sold lie of our decade. Wake up it isn't the smokers, it's the money makers. There ought to be a warning living on earth might cause cancer.
I have seen 5 year old kids with lung cancer they never smoked. It must be that they were next to a smoker.lol people are so easily led. oh ya and leaded...You sure it's not the neglect of the FDA and our government we pay to protect us. They have been letting other countries poison us for 20 years! Remember the tuskegee experiment Russ? Are you sure your not part of the new one? Are you absolutly sure?
I was a soldier once too 82nd Airborne Infantry, I joined at 17. What was your MOS? What brach did you say Russ? You seem to think it adds some kind of credibility to what you are saying. So I thought I would mention my blue cord.
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JamisonNeu said:
It's simple. Because I like to compete in pool tournaments. And every bar or pool hall I go into is full of smoke. It gets in my clothes, on my skin, and in my lungs. I have NO CHOICE if I want to compete.
Now, I know EXACTLY where you are going. You are probably going to say how air pollution is so bad that it greatly outweighs the negative benefits of second hand smoke.
Yeah... Maybe in Mexico City. Otherwise, show me the studies that demonstrate how the average person suffers more negative health consequences by breathing day to day, then they do by being exposed to second hand smoke if they work or spend considerable time in a public business.
And, even if air pollution IS more harmful, do you think we as a society are doing nothing to address this? Do you think big business has any right to ***** and complain on how they should be allowed to use mercury in their processes, because, after all, the business is on "private property"?
The great thing is, as long as the 75-80% of the population that does not smoke believes we should curb indoor smoking in public businesses, it's GOING to happen. The smokers have little to no say in it.
Smoking is becoming less and less "cool" in our society, and within the next 15-25 years, the percentage of smokers in America is going to keep going down, cutting the tobacco company profits. As these profits fall, these companies will have less and less advertising dollars, and dollars to use in Congress to lobby.
These arguments won't even exist in 30 years, as smokers will be such a minor part of the population, that no one will even bother to consider their opinion on topics like this.
Yahoo!!!
Russ
You answered quickly Russ. I was trying to edit and I started ranting a little more than my one liner. Funny though your post went there on the other side dind't it.Russ Chewning said:
In England the gun ban has caused more murders with frying pans.
JamisonNeu said:
I am curious. Where in this thread did I ever mention being in the military? Besides my signature? I specifically use this signature to DISCOUNT any idea that I am trying to gain any credibility from my military service. Because if I didn't make it CLEAR that I am not longer in the service, people like you come out of the woodwork to attack me.
I guess some people miss the point.
I also changed my "location" from Baghdad, Iraq to "a trailer" because people would scream bloody murder any time someone thanked me for what I am doing in Iraq.
I guess I can't win for losing, eh?
I was Signal Corps, by the way. Not that it really matters, but it was people like me that made (and currently make) sure that you guys have all the information you need to do your job with less risk of being hurt. We're the ones providing the video feeds so guys with (ZOMG THEY ARE SO GREAT I WISH I HAD ONE OMGWTFBBQ SAUCE) "blue cords" can track insurgents at night with the assistance of UAVs.
I was one of the Signal pukes spending 3/4 of my time away from my family in Germany providing communications for units moving munitions through different countries in Europe.
I've been to S. Korea, Bulgaria, Egypt, Spain, Italy, Croatia, Thailand, Poland, Qatar, Iraq, and a few others I can't recall right away, and spent PLENTY of time away from my family while I was in the military. I found time to go to most of those places AFTER I got married, so all that was in about a 5 year stretch. Doesn't leave much time for bonding with the family, eh buddy?
People like you made me sick when I was in the military. Always looking for something to feel superior over someone else about. I would rather honor the people who see the entire U.S. Army as a TEAM. You sir, are not worth honor.
JoeyA, now THIS man is worth honoring. I don't think I have ever heard him say a cross word to anyone else in the military. He understands that everyone plays their part.
Do you look down on truckers in the military too, Jamison? Sometimes I think about how all those Transportation company kids died in the first year here in Iraq. Remember them? Jessica Lynch, one of them, had both of her legs broken, and was taken by insurgents, and honorable men went and got her back. Maybe some of those men had blue cords.
Maybe you need to reevaluate what the Airborne meant to you, dude. Was it just a status club? Was it something that put you above and beyond other military members? Or was it a different type of service, with a tradition of sacrifice?
A lot of my Signal brethren looked down on Infantry because they often did not have the smarts for traditional Signal jobs. I was NEVER one to do that, and simply thought of them as honorable men who were willing to go face to face with the enemy. And kill them.
Now.. Explain how much better you are than me now, sir.
Russ
ScottW said:
AMEN! I'm glad someone finally brought that point up.
If Jesus came down from heaven and told addicted smokers they're gonna die from it, half would still be smoking.Pii said:
