Are you suggesting Shane is using CTE or one of its variants with this post?
TAR Podcast #8 - Shane - Fransisco - Shane Talks About His Aiming Method
- Thread starter Fast Lenny
- Start date
Are you suggesting Shane is using CTE or one of its variants with this post?
I use the side of the shaft to aim. It works for most shots. Engligh does not matter as long as you are only 1 cue tip away from center. If you are cutting the ball to the right, just aim the right side of the cue to the contact point on the object ball.
Nothing can be simpler. Use whatever english you want. It works.
When I miss it's because I didn't put a good stroke on it and missed the contact point.
It makes the game "easier". Just forget about the cue ball and aim the side of the cue at the contact point on the ball. If you stroke the side of the cue correctly, you will make the shot way more times than you will miss.
Works for me when I stroke it properly. Even thin cuts.
I just don't know why?
I showed it to my Son, and he said that he does it this way when he cuts a ball to the right. He also said it doesn't work for him if he is cutting to the left,
So there you go. I guess it won't work for everybody every time? My shot making has improved using it though for sure. That's not saying much. lol
Nothing can be simpler. Use whatever english you want. It works.
When I miss it's because I didn't put a good stroke on it and missed the contact point.
It makes the game "easier". Just forget about the cue ball and aim the side of the cue at the contact point on the ball. If you stroke the side of the cue correctly, you will make the shot way more times than you will miss.
Works for me when I stroke it properly. Even thin cuts.
I just don't know why?
I showed it to my Son, and he said that he does it this way when he cuts a ball to the right. He also said it doesn't work for him if he is cutting to the left,
So there you go. I guess it won't work for everybody every time? My shot making has improved using it though for sure. That's not saying much. lol
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Look at me! Look at me!! I'm playing Effy!! I'm playing in a $75 tournament, race to 3, playing Effy!!! I got lucky and drew EffY!!!!! Can you believe it!!!!?!?!!? LOOK HOW BIG MY HEART IS!!!!!! HOLY SH!T-FCK!!!!! My heart is the size of the Empire State Building cause I got Effy on a random draw!!!!!!
Me and Tony Crosby
Me and Evgeny Stalev
WOW! I played two champions in one year too! That must mean my heart is the size of Jupiter!!! My nuts are so big I can't walk!! I need a Hover-round or a Segway to tote my mega nuts around because I drew two champions in a $75 open event.
I'm coooooool.... just like Lou Figawhatever. ;-)
I love ya dave and I understand. but I dont want this to turn into a typical aiming system thread. I get it. lou likes to be lou... but I would like this to actually stick around. I think this could end good if we give it a shot. Let lou and patrick say what they want... I wanna hear thegood stuff.
I'm watching the loop now.
I haven't seen SBV pivot yet.
With the score 6-2 SVB, Busta stroked the 10-ball with the tip to the left side of the cueball then went to the center on the last stroke and missed the 10.
Then after it seemed like stopped pivoting and started practice stroking dead center base of the cueball.
I haven't seen SBV pivot yet.
With the score 6-2 SVB, Busta stroked the 10-ball with the tip to the left side of the cueball then went to the center on the last stroke and missed the 10.
Then after it seemed like stopped pivoting and started practice stroking dead center base of the cueball.
Very interesting but I'm not sure I would call it a system as much as a guideline or rule of thumb. What I mean is he says for thin cuts to the left: left side of shaft to right edge of ball; lesser cuts middle of shaft to right edge of ball and for closer to straight right edge of shaft to "almost" the right edge of the ball.
But how does he determine at what specific cut angles to make the switch and adjust his reference points? Basically I think he said he does it by having hit so many shots aiming has become automatic and he doesn't have to think about it. But he doesn't have a "method" for determining which of his reference points to use. And this is without introducing english.
To me that is not exactly a system. It's still very much a feel and experience thing with him, IMHO. I know system guys will want to call this a system. I'm not a system guy, but I know they exist. I just don't know that I would exactly call this one.
But how does he determine at what specific cut angles to make the switch and adjust his reference points? Basically I think he said he does it by having hit so many shots aiming has become automatic and he doesn't have to think about it. But he doesn't have a "method" for determining which of his reference points to use. And this is without introducing english.
To me that is not exactly a system. It's still very much a feel and experience thing with him, IMHO. I know system guys will want to call this a system. I'm not a system guy, but I know they exist. I just don't know that I would exactly call this one.
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I see you just joined, so you may be unfamiliar with some of the previous discussion on this aiming method.
Here are two threads from the past regarding aiming the edge of the stick at the contact point (not what Shane does):
http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=223087
http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=210645
http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=210645
Unfortunately, the second thread is very long because it got derailed into debate about another aiming system called CTE. But I think the two threads may give you quite a bit more information about the aiming system you use (which we called the Mullen Method because of a video made by a Mr. Mullen).
There is no pivot for those who are wondering, I have never done that before.
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No not cte, just interesting that he only breaks it down to 3 lines of aim. One line works up to a certain angle than he goes to the next line. Now someone needs to figure the exact angle he makes the change. It doesn't seem to matter to Shane as he does it automatically, which is the way it should be done. That won't be good enough for some people, so that is why we need someone to examine the angles farther.
P.S. I'm not smart enough and would rather be hitting balls.
Shane gave a lesson last year at the Derby for an hour and the question asked initially is how do you aim when you shoot and he talked about that for alot of the time. That guy who bought the lesson paid a hundred bucks for an hour or so, there were a few others in the room which was where we have the straight pool the Bob Jewett Derby City 14.1 Challenge the lesson was given on the back table by the door.
The result of the lesson was he uses the following parts of the shaft - left side, center and right side. He lines those up with following parts of the object ball - left side, center and right side. He shot quite a few shots during that time as he went he said what was using to aim one shot would be center - center that would be a straight in shot. With slight angle changes he would use different parts of the shaft to line up with different parts of the object ball. He did not go into allowing for english and contact induced throw or speed. He would get behind the shot and decide how he was going to aim it was extremely efficient.
He did not go into aiming extremely thin shots as I believe this system would hit a limit and edges of the shaft would not be on any part of the object ball. For his system to work for him his setup is extremely repeatable and he gets behind the shot line very square. I did not ask him anything about a dominant eye or head alignment. Also he did not cover distance from the object ball as those three places on the object ball become smaller as the object ball is farther away I do not know what that distance has to do with the aim but I thought i would throw that in for thought.
Shane has hit multiple million balls so he is also a user of the HAMB system. When you select a system and you add the HAMB to that first system, that first system becomes very strong/ Also if you use multiples of the HAMB on it along with plenty of the WIRB system (Want It Real Bad) the world is in trouble. Shane has done that and he has the heart of a champion and his mind is clear he has great eyes and he is a good guy. I am a Shane fan and hope he gets it done tonight in the TAR 24 match with Busty who won Day 1 (I want a Day 3.
The result of the lesson was he uses the following parts of the shaft - left side, center and right side. He lines those up with following parts of the object ball - left side, center and right side. He shot quite a few shots during that time as he went he said what was using to aim one shot would be center - center that would be a straight in shot. With slight angle changes he would use different parts of the shaft to line up with different parts of the object ball. He did not go into allowing for english and contact induced throw or speed. He would get behind the shot and decide how he was going to aim it was extremely efficient.
He did not go into aiming extremely thin shots as I believe this system would hit a limit and edges of the shaft would not be on any part of the object ball. For his system to work for him his setup is extremely repeatable and he gets behind the shot line very square. I did not ask him anything about a dominant eye or head alignment. Also he did not cover distance from the object ball as those three places on the object ball become smaller as the object ball is farther away I do not know what that distance has to do with the aim but I thought i would throw that in for thought.
Shane has hit multiple million balls so he is also a user of the HAMB system. When you select a system and you add the HAMB to that first system, that first system becomes very strong/ Also if you use multiples of the HAMB on it along with plenty of the WIRB system (Want It Real Bad) the world is in trouble. Shane has done that and he has the heart of a champion and his mind is clear he has great eyes and he is a good guy. I am a Shane fan and hope he gets it done tonight in the TAR 24 match with Busty who won Day 1 (I want a Day 3.
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A couple of thoughts:
First off, it's kind of interesting that he says he doesn't know what a "ghost ball" is. I think the fact that he taught this shaft system to himself is also important because what that tells me is that what he is deploying is a personal reference system, as opposed to a geometrically perfect aiming system. What I mean by that is that his reference system works for him, given the way he sets up, sees the balls, and strokes his cue. Others would most probably have to refine and redefine something like this for themselves to essentially create their own personal versions of the system and may find various levels of success with it because no one else sees nor strokes the balls like Shane.
Secondly, every good player, once past the actual true physics, eventually begins to develop their own personal reality about the game. IOW, regardless of the physics, you may have found that if you do one thing with a grip, or bridge, or stroke, something very specific will consistently happen on the pool table. Sort of like when an accomplished player tells you that if you relax your grip, or use a shorter stroke, the balls will behave differently, even though the science guys would say otherwise. So that is you personal system or reality and the physics be damned because it works, for you. Shane is an unbelievable player and the fact that he has developed his own system(s) tells you how far down the rabbit hole he has drilled to find a systematic approach to the game to achieve a super high level of performance.
Lastly, I don't think any of the aiming system non-believers have ever railed against *all* aiming systems -- just the particularly scurrilous claims made by the advocates of one or two systems. The "oil" is still out there
Lou Figueroa
I agree Lou, it is where to aim not how to aim what makes a pro pro. Shane missed the shot in the video because ball threw on him and forgot to make that adjustment due to the heat of moment, or CB skidded on him when he shot.
I think the issue for most of us non-pro players would be consistent head position. If it isn't consistent our eyes will be at a different angle hence a different pictures much like putting English on a cue leads to different results versus a center ball hit
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have nothing to do with head position, Patch eye was a pro player with two eyes, had an accident and lost one of his eyes completely, he shoots with one eye better than he used to shoot with two eyes, he is 85 years old and still shoot great. The head position is not for eyes it is for your arms, to make sure they are consistent and in line
Once you learn where to aim you will make balls. 95% of any shot is before you go down on the shot, the 5% is to make sure you are lined up, warm up strokes and ensure your tip is where it is suppose to be.
For this and any system of aiming save feel, one needs some geometry to percieve angles and to relate it to where to aim.
You can use your stick to determine what the angle is to the target/pocket with respect to the CB to the OB. If you know the angle and where to aim, in this case, the fractional segments of the shaft to the center of the OB or the edge of the OB about its equator (2 very identifiable points of aim), one can find a repeatable way to effect the shot required.
Try it.:wink:
You can use your stick to determine what the angle is to the target/pocket with respect to the CB to the OB. If you know the angle and where to aim, in this case, the fractional segments of the shaft to the center of the OB or the edge of the OB about its equator (2 very identifiable points of aim), one can find a repeatable way to effect the shot required.
Try it.:wink:
I aim the left or right edge of the shaft about a quarter inch or so off of the object ball, depending on the distance between balls. The closer cuts require slightly more offset.
Best,
Mike
That is it! Sorry! I thought from reading the first few posts that this was his system. It's not. My bad.
His does seem more complicated though? I like simple.
Pat is back?
Yes, I like to be me, so sorry (not). As to your quote from the overgrown frat boy who is otherwise on my Ignore List along with Cookie, Petey, Champ, Murdock, Pablo, and I forget who else (God, how I miss the Super Ignore feature): no, it just means you have pair, unlike all the other passengers in the AZ Clown Car.
Lou Figueroa
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Yes. And as others have alluded, Naji -- he has hit a million balls.
The thing is: he gave an off the cuff description of how he aims. But chances are he didn't go into everything he utilizes to aim, especially for different types of shots. The danger, for some, is believing this is the whole enchilada and believing that what works for Shane will work for everyone. Some guys, no doubt, would get benefits out of using Shane's approach. But that would be for the very same reasons people get benefits from other aiming systems, as outlined on Dr. Dave's web site -- primarily because it introduces elements of consistency, focus, and identifiable parameters.
Chances are no one else out there sets up like Shane, or sees the balls like Shane does, or has Shane's footwork, bridges, grip, stroke, and motions. Few, if any, have his focus, concentration, insight, work ethic, and pure experience with the game. Nor do they have the infinite number of balls Shane has hit under their belt. But, all of a sudden, everyone is trying this and, woo wee, "It works!" That's good, because it will be refreshing to argue something besides CTE
Lou Figueroa
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Great point about HAMB, elvi.
And if you want to see a circus, watch Rafael Martinez play
Lou Figueroa