My Thoughts on Earl and TAR 22

Calling someone a name is not slander. I'm not defending Earl's actions --- please don't take it that way. I'm working this from the other side of the equation---- trying to get everyone to see that Earl is mentally ill and to be more understanding.

I have a bipolar person in my family, so I'm more sensitive to the reality of the situation. The same way a tourettes person can't help ticks and outbursts, Earl can't control his behavior (without medication, as he apparently doesn't take). That's a fact, people.

So, while people are marching up the hill with pitch forks and torches, you should probably take a time-out and google bipolar illness and read the wikipedia entry on the topic. It might shed some light on what you're witnessing and make you a hair more sensitive.

I think people look at Earl as if he's a dick -- and although he acts like one, it's not his fault --- and that's the truth of the matter.

That said, it's up to TAR whether or not to be around it in the future.

I have no doubt what you say is in some form correct. I don't hate Earl. I think he's one of the most interesting people I have ever met. I just won't ever let him represent me again. If he called me on the phone right now and said he needed something to get some form of medical help I would do what I could for him.

My mistake was hubris in thinking I could create an environment that would change behaviors I have seen before. Earl is just Earl on that we agree. I just didnt have a full grasp of what that is.
 
Yes it would. I was simply being honest in why we put the match together. The first match was stressful as hell in a room I had absolutely no control over. I thought that if we changed the environment, paid Earl a guaranteed fee win or lose, got him staked to a 60/40 (his way) deal that things would go smoother. As I said in the OP I was wrong.

If you expect me to apologize for trying to make money you are barking up the wrong tree. Making profitable matches means everyone gets paid and people get to see something they otherwise wouldn't. It also means I get to stay in business.

Please show me where I said anything about the image of the game. Also please show me where I said the numbers stink. I said customers essentially voted with their wallets on what they think of Earl's antics. I pay attention to what customers say. It was my fault for thinking Earl could be Earl without flipping the switch all the way.

If we had made more money on this match than any other I would still say the same thing. I do this because I love it and I get to do cool shit with some cool people. I accept that I'll probably end up with less than what I started with. That allows me a certain freedom to do and say what I really think. If all I cared about was the bottom line I would be far far far away from doing anything with professional pool.

Sure it would be the same,if you dont know by now that JUSTIN ,cares about his veiwers and live audience,then i dont know what to tell you,i believe JUSTIN will not put up with his custermers being treated like they were from EARL THIS go around,and that is what JUSTIN is saying in his post!
 
I have been a TAR supporter from the start. I will continue to be, What really makes me sad is that Diamond is coming out with a ten foot table, And if Earl cant be part of that action it just wont mean as much to me. I hope he is not banned from playing because I really enjoy watching him play. I will understand if he is, I just wont like it.

His lack of respect for people around him will be all of our losses. Because the man can do things with a cue not many can.
 
If TAR is around in twenty yrs, and the sport takes off during that time, this vintage footage will be used for yrs to come for pure entertainment, tho at this time we're not thinking that way.
I've seen vintage TV clips of McEnroe tantrums, and my thinking is, they will always be with us, why? Because it Was a turning point in their sport and is NO longer Tolerated, which is a good thing.

A similar Note.

Yrs ago early 80's, Denver Open, during the time Mike Massey got LSD slipped into his drink, Earl was playing Chewy Rivera. Earl was sitting against the wall and in line of the shot to the corner pocket, Chewy was playin' good and during shot execution Earl ''Uncorked''. From that point on, a rule was ''set in stone'', match over if done during play.
NOW, maybe tantrums too can become something of the past, and maybe now ALL promoters that allow Earl to play in their events will tell em, ''up front'' actions such as this are NO LONGER tolerated.
Promoters, do it ''for the sport'', it's time to move on and out of this McEnroe tantrum situation, which hurts the game more than you know.
We should NO LONGER enable these actions.
 
great post justin....continue to do right by yourself and you will be just fine...get some rest and enjoy the holiday seasons with the ones you love and get ramped up for tar 23....mickey
 
Justin

You have a unique and thoughtfully put-together product and bring exposure and promotion to a game that sorely needs you. No way in the world should you apologize for Earl's behavior. I think we are all clear who is responsible for Earl's bad behavior. Your responsibility is to think about whether you want to promote him any longer, and I'm with you.

I think Earl takes Shane off his game. I think he would shark anyone in that kind of one on one deal, nobody likes to descend into hell with a madman. Shane keeps his composure pretty well, and managed to win (to his continued credit), but we, as fans, are certainly not seeing Shane's best performance and that is the product we are paying for.

Earl doesn't play as well as he used to. Sr Tours and such where stars from the past are showcased present a way for fans to thank the past players for their fabulous contributions and for us all to show respect. I think few of us, for good reason, respect Earl, and I don't want to show him gratitude by paying to see him play.

Earl dragged (for the 2nd time in 2 matches) Shane into the muck where Earl's mind lives, and Shane had a tough time wading through it. This time he won, last time he didn't. OK, I get it (I think I already knew), fading those antics takes a heavy toll. I'd much rather see how good Shane can play when he hits his gear than watch Shane have to swim through the shit Earl puts out. TAR has created a great environment where they can control the conditions. Sounds to me like you have decided to continue to control those conditions by not inviting Earl back and I'm all for that.

Thanks for the show and thanks for caring,

Kevin
 
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Justin, it seems like you love your job and the game of pool,and i appreciate everything TAR does,but i agree it's time to cut ties with this spoiled little primadona, he needs somebody to lay him out instead of this "oh he's just earl and he's got an illness. bullshit
 
Overall the quality of production and the opportunity to witness high caliber play was still there, so thanks to TAR for that!!! I still gotta recommend instant replay to get another look at sick shots. Maybe also an option to turn off commentary and listen to the players.

Thanks for keeping pool alive!
 
Fu*# that Justin! You are the absolute last person who needs to apologize. Earl is a grown ass man! Everyone knows NO ONE can control him. Many have tried an many have failed. In a way we are all responsible because we all want to see the ball pocketing run out monster that he is. But that comes with a price. And he always collects his toll.

I totally felt ill when he started his give up routine at the end. The most grotesque display of selfeshness. I hope the poeple at Kurzweil Meats were'nt put off by the meltdown. I'll send them an email pleading not to give up on TAR and may even order some smoked pork chops too!

Thanks to TAR for bringing us high speed pool! I'll be a returning customer.

kano (mrsoeil)
That's the way I see it as well. Justin, I understand where your coming from and absolutely respect the hell out of you (I'd feel the same way) but the bottom line is only Earl can be held accountable for his behavior. I think I read somewhere a comment referring to why you didn't stop this behavior and the answer was obvious to me. if you did so his behavior could have escalated to the point where he could have conceded the match wich would have been a lose, lose situation for everyone involved . ie.your guests in the studio, streaming customers, Kurzweil Meats and TAR itself. It would be awfully hard to market a DVD for future sale if it ended prematurely via a forfeit. I didn't a vested interest in the match, but what angers me the most is when a sponsor outside the industry (Kurzweil Meats) witch the sport so desperately needs could be adversely effected for lack of a better term. Keep up the great work Justin and everyone else who make these matches possible.
Jason
 
"We put this match together based on the reaction to the 10 foot table match...." first sentence of the post. So now that the numbers stink the concern is image of the game and respect of the audience.

Would this be the same post if the numbers were off the charts?

Did you read the next sentence? You know the one where he said "but I swore after that match I would never put myself through that again and so did Shane"? Here's a guy that just had the top ppv he's ever had, saying he would never do that again. Does that sound like someone that is more concerned about the money then what he's putting on to represent TAR?

He goes on to say that after time passed, feelings cooled, that maybe he would take another shot at it, hoping somehow that Earl might have got on some medication or something and would be somewhat respectful.

Did you read all the threads after the 10 ft match of everyone that wanted to see them get on a 9 ft table that was setup properly, so Shane could get his revenge, or Earl could show he could beat Shane on a 9ft too?

I imagine as a business owner, TAR wants to show matches that people want to see. Not just what Norman Ballspeckle and Elnora Hobbensticker want to see, but matches that many people want to see.

There was obviously a lot of people that wanted to see a rematch. I believe that if the numbers of this PPV were the same, or even better, then the last one, the same exact thing would have come out of Justin's mouth.

He doesn't look at it like, well screw the 10 or 20 people that were uncomfortable in my studio, and screw the 10 or 20 people that always bought TAR PPV's before, but didn't because it was Earl.... because I can make up for those people 4 times over by putting this show on.

How you can read his statements about how he saw a guy that flew in from England, who got told to go F&%k himself when he went to simply shake the guys hand, and how much that bothered him, and try to make it into a numbers and profit thing, I could only surmise you have some personal issue with him.

If there's one thing I've learned from being a TAR fan from Day 1 and from getting to know Justin some, and to be able to work with him, is that he does not compromise his integrity over money. He's one of the few good guys we have left.

He is a pool fan first and foremost, just like a lot of us are. He is a extremely nice guy that goes out of his way to make people happy and to help them out. He gives people the benefit of the doubt, sometimes more then once. Sometimes he gets screwed over by doing that. Some people like to try and take advantage of people that give you the benefit of the doubt or are willing to accept a shake of the hand for a business deal. Pool is a world where unfortunately you really have to watch your back. It is a world where movers, shakers, con artists, scammers, hustlers and every other kind of nefarious people, have made up a good portion of this world of pool.

It's pretty tough to try and do good things in the world of pool. It's pretty easy to get fed up with all the back stabbing and being moved on all the time. It can turn a guy that wants to do good things into a guy that could care less, pretty quick.

Thankfully Justin has been able to fade that crap for the most part. I'm sure he's a changed person because of the last 5 years. I bet his list of people he originally thought he could trust, has shrunken considerably over the past 5 years.

I've seen Justin want to refund a entire streams customers their money back, just because of technical glitches, where he had no choice but to open it up to everyone. He's taken a bath many a time, where I said to myself, "He doesn't have to do that, that wasn't his fault"


So you can insinuate all you want, but you couldn't be further off base then you are with Justin. I can tell you this.. I have been thru the life of hard knocks and the only thing I got in this world is my integrity and that people can trust me, and there's not many people in this world that I would put the only thing I got on the line, which is my character, but I would not hesitate for a minute to slide it all in with Justin.

So put that in your pipe and smoke it.. and for god's sake, inhale.:)
 
Yes it would. I was simply being honest in why we put the match together. The first match was stressful as hell in a room I had absolutely no control over. I thought that if we changed the environment, paid Earl a guaranteed fee win or lose, got him staked to a 60/40 (his way) deal that things would go smoother. As I said in the OP I was wrong.

If you expect me to apologize for trying to make money you are barking up the wrong tree. Making profitable matches means everyone gets paid and people get to see something they otherwise wouldn't. It also means I get to stay in business.

Please show me where I said anything about the image of the game. Also please show me where I said the numbers stink. I said customers essentially voted with their wallets on what they think of Earl's antics. I pay attention to what customers say. It was my fault for thinking Earl could be Earl without flipping the switch all the way.

If we had made more money on this match than any other I would still say the same thing. I do this because I love it and I get to do cool shit with some cool people. I accept that I'll probably end up with less than what I started with. That allows me a certain freedom to do and say what I really think. If all I cared about was the bottom line I would be far far far away from doing anything with professional pool.

NEVER apologize for chasing the cash! I am part of the 2%'ters.. working hard to be a 1%'ter.. so...

1. NO I do not want you to apologize for trying to make money. (It is the American way ;-)

2. You said nothing about "image of the game" directly. The commentary during the match had some of that so I probably "read into it"... my mistake.... but the following sentence seems to go in that direction ..." I did what I think many in the past have done to put pool where is is today: I did the easy thing instead of the hard thing..."... I guess this was not about the image of pool but the business of pool

3. Ok the numbers did not "stink"... they were not as good as the 10 ft match which was disappointing to you. (and the meaning of is... is...)

4. and I understand that in the first two paragraphs of your post your justification for taking the risk with Earl.. was to make money... GREAT that is what business people do... Then the numbers were not as good as hoped... and Earl behaved like Earl.. and the decision is not to do it again is because you were embarrassed by how things unfolded

5. I think it is GREAT that you get to do cool "shit" with cool people .. and I LOVE freedom in all its forms .. AND I really enjoyed all three days... watched EVERY MINUTE... the fact the a 50-year old can hang with the "Greatest player in the world today" is very impressive to me.

Finally... I apologize for being confused by your post... the justification to go forward was cash... (the reward)... you hoped Earl would be better in a controlled enviromnet (risk and risk mitigation) then you said the numbers were not as good as before... (market reaction) BUT the reason you would not do it again was Earl behavior (risk / reward analysis).. so my question was a simple one - if the reward was greater would the risk be worth it... you have said NO. Ok then... best of luck to you.

Quote "... do you want to be the guy on the cross or the guy banging in the nails?.."
 
Yours is an admirable post, Justin, and I must admit that I, too, figured that putting Earl in a private studio in a serious one-on-one situation might calm him down. Not only didn't it calm him down, but in the end, Earl, as the commentators noted, and as he himself confirmed in the post-match interview, stopped trying in the last hour or so. Hence, he was unprofessional in both his behavior and his play.

I'll add that Earl's insistence on wearing headphones while he played was comical. I've never see a pro player do more to invade his opponent's playing privacy than Earl, and yet he takes extreme measures to make sure his isn't violated.

Each day I tuned in, the commentators spoke of how unexpectedly poor the play was (not meant to suggest that there weren't some special moments from each of the competitors), and I can't help but conclude that Earl's sharking affected Shane's play for the worse. Shane made some facial expressions along the way that confirmed his anguish. Earl, almost at random, often got out of his chair during Shane's turn, and not in situations where it made any sense. In one situation on Saturday, Shane hooked himself on a six ball and Earl got out of his chair. Asked by Shane why he got up, Earl could do no better than say something to the effect of "I wanted to see the position."

.... and Earl's refusal to shake the hand of a paying customer, that's just the icing on the cake.

A man with this little respect for the game, for the best American professional today, and for those who purchase the professional pool product, is undeserving of playing in TAR matches.

Thanks for all your efforts, Justin, and good luck with future TAR matches. Looking forward to waching Raj and Oscar, but I'll never purchase a TAR match with Earl in it again.
 
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Calling someone a name is not slander. I'm not defending Earl's actions --- please don't take it that way. I'm working this from the other side of the equation---- trying to get everyone to see that Earl is mentally ill and to be more understanding.

I have a bipolar person in my family, so I'm more sensitive to the reality of the situation. The same way a tourettes person can't help ticks and outbursts, Earl can't control his behavior (without medication, as he apparently doesn't take). That's a fact, people.

So, while people are marching up the hill with pitch forks and torches, you should probably take a time-out and google bipolar illness and read the wikipedia entry on the topic. It might shed some light on what you're witnessing and make you a hair more sensitive.

I think people look at Earl as if he's a dick -- and although he acts like one, it's not his fault --- and that's the truth of the matter.

That said, it's up to TAR whether or not to be around it in the future.

exactly right...

He's stuck between a rock and a hard place. Medical conditions, w/o insurance, or a regular income. Barely (and I mean barely) getting by.

He has a terrible, terrible disease that most people wouldn't wish on their worst enemy. A disease that 'eats' you from the inside out. A disease that's invisible to all others in quiet, peaceful situations.

Once stress of one form or another enters the picture, things start unraveling. And it's not pretty....... as you all saw.

He needs help.
 
I think people just take the easy way out and say Earl is an a$$hole and a di(*, but in reality the men has an illness. It is possible its bi polar or maybe even schizophrenia, I have seen both, one was an ex girlfriend and the other was my aunt. They both could be totally fine and the smallest things could trigger some scary stuff like everyone is against me and out to get me, mean and angry behavior, even violence. If you showed someone a video of Earl who is a specialist in this field like a psychiatrist I am sure they will say its one of the two if not something else.

I know some people just do not understand mental illness as they have not been around it but its totally beyond that persons control especially if they are not on meds but even then there mixture has to be right. We joke around and laugh at it, call him names because we think he is normal but the man is really sick and the sick part he thinks he is normal and the rest of us are crazy.

I think the game and life troubles have caused him to get worst, maybe people who know him better can chime in like Rick of Rixx Images or his ex wife Lisa to tell us more but then again is it any of our business? We do not have to watch the train wreck if we do not want to but we want to see his great play, you cannot go have fun sledding when you were a kid without going out into the cold. Earl is who he is, I lost money on the match, I knew who I was betting on so those who are pissed about that, just get real, you were not going to send him a damn jelly anyway. He is a great front runner and when he is behind he gets nasty, negative and gives up. I applaud SVB for his heart and being a class act, we are lucky as is TAR to have a guy like that in pool.
 
exactly right...

He's stuck between a rock and a hard place. Medical conditions, w/o insurance, or a regular income. Barely (and I mean barely) getting by.

He has a terrible, terrible disease that most people wouldn't wish on their worst enemy. A disease that 'eats' you from the inside out. A disease that's invisible to all others in quiet, peaceful situations.

Once stress of one form or another enters the picture, things start unraveling. And it's not pretty....... as you all saw.

He needs help.

Well said, Rick S. I couldn't agree more with your thoughts.

If a woman were to lose all her hair from cancer and appear at a pool tournament, she might be disgusting to other spectators, but they would be more accepting of her due to the fact that she has cancer and can't help it -- well, at least I would hope.

Earl cannot play pool taking medication for his condition. He can play pool without the medication, but his condition worsens for all to see, much like the lady who has cancer and a bald head.

I hope Earl does get the help he needs, but I fear that this will be the end of his pool-playing career. To someone who's lived and breathed pool their entire life, who's reached heights none of us can even dream of, well, it may be a decision Earl cannot face.

Earl is a five-time world champion, multiple titles, still hitting 'em strong, a BCA Hall of Famer, and it doesn't afford him a living in pool. Can you just imagine how financially and socially difficult it is for other aspiring pros or pro-caliber players to function in this kind of pool climate?

Mama, don't let your babies grow up to be pool players unless you live in the Philippines.
 
exactly right...

He's stuck between a rock and a hard place. Medical conditions, w/o insurance, or a regular income. Barely (and I mean barely) getting by.

He has a terrible, terrible disease that most people wouldn't wish on their worst enemy. A disease that 'eats' you from the inside out. A disease that's invisible to all others in quiet, peaceful situations.

Once stress of one form or another enters the picture, things start unraveling. And it's not pretty....... as you all saw.

He needs help.
I just posted above hoping you would chime in as you know him very well, it is a shame that he is one of the greatest players who ever lived and cannot get any treatment, no insurance for pool players. Would Earl even be willing to get help or does he think that he is okay?
 
Did you read the next sentence? You know the one where he said "but I swore after that match I would never put myself through that again and so did Shane"? Here's a guy that just had the top ppv he's ever had, saying he would never do that again. Does that sound like someone that is more concerned about the money then what he's putting on to represent TAR?

He goes on to say that after time passed, feelings cooled, that maybe he would take another shot at it, hoping somehow that Earl might have got on some medication or something and would be somewhat respectful.

Did you read all the threads after the 10 ft match of everyone that wanted to see them get on a 9 ft table that was setup properly, so Shane could get his revenge, or Earl could show he could beat Shane on a 9ft too?

I imagine as a business owner, TAR wants to show matches that people want to see. Not just what Norman Ballspeckle and Elnora Hobbensticker want to see, but matches that many people want to see.

There was obviously a lot of people that wanted to see a rematch. I believe that if the numbers of this PPV were the same, or even better, then the last one, the same exact thing would have come out of Justin's mouth.

He doesn't look at it like, well screw the 10 or 20 people that were uncomfortable in my studio, and screw the 10 or 20 people that always bought TAR PPV's before, but didn't because it was Earl.... because I can make up for those people 4 times over by putting this show on.

How you can read his statements about how he saw a guy that flew in from England, who got told to go F&%k himself when he went to simply shake the guys hand, and how much that bothered him, and try to make it into a numbers and profit thing, I could only surmise you have some personal issue with him.

If there's one thing I've learned from being a TAR fan from Day 1 and from getting to know Justin some, and to be able to work with him, is that he does not compromise his integrity over money. He's one of the few good guys we have left.

He is a pool fan first and foremost, just like a lot of us are. He is a extremely nice guy that goes out of his way to make people happy and to help them out. He gives people the benefit of the doubt, sometimes more then once. Sometimes he gets screwed over by doing that. Some people like to try and take advantage of people that give you the benefit of the doubt or are willing to accept a shake of the hand for a business deal. Pool is a world where unfortunately you really have to watch your back. It is a world where movers, shakers, con artists, scammers, hustlers and every other kind of nefarious people, have made up a good portion of this world of pool.

It's pretty tough to try and do good things in the world of pool. It's pretty easy to get fed up with all the back stabbing and being moved on all the time. It can turn a guy that wants to do good things into a guy that could care less, pretty quick.

Thankfully Justin has been able to fade that crap for the most part. I'm sure he's a changed person because of the last 5 years. I bet his list of people he originally thought he could trust, has shrunken considerably over the past 5 years.

I've seen Justin want to refund a entire streams customers their money back, just because of technical glitches, where he had no choice but to open it up to everyone. He's taken a bath many a time, where I said to myself, "He doesn't have to do that, that wasn't his fault"


So you can insinuate all you want, but you couldn't be further off base then you are with Justin. I can tell you this.. I have been thru the life of hard knocks and the only thing I got in this world is my integrity and that people can trust me, and there's not many people in this world that I would put the only thing I got on the line, which is my character, but I would not hesitate for a minute to slide it all in with Justin.

So put that in your pipe and smoke it.. and for god's sake, inhale.:)

wow... did not mean to cause a stroke...

I was not insinuating anything, I was asking a question "if the reward was greater was the risk worth it..." answer no... you guys would last about two seconds in the meetings I go to...

and as a customer of TAR who purchased all three days let me say I REALLY ENJOYED EVERY SECOND of the match... would HAPPILY purchase the DVD and by the way if the "out of stock items are EVER in stock... I would be happy to pay double for everyone (seriously I have an offer on az right now for $50 for $25 matches) best of luck to you in 2012... don't be soooooo sensitive
 
Great Job!

I have no doubt what you say is in some form correct. I don't hate Earl. I think he's one of the most interesting people I have ever met. I just won't ever let him represent me again. If he called me on the phone right now and said he needed something to get some form of medical help I would do what I could for him.

My mistake was hubris in thinking I could create an environment that would change behaviors I have seen before. Earl is just Earl on that we agree. I just didnt have a full grasp of what that is.

"IMHO, in the long run, you've done something positive for our Sport! You'll have this recording for ALL TIME. Store it, and there may come a day when it will benefit TAR financially again.

The camera coverage and commentary were better this time, than in your past events,"so----great job, to you and your team!"

p.s. "Earl really is like Ty Cobb," and there will come a day when people will want to see "everything he's done." Justin, you've done something with this series of match-ups, I don't think anyone else could have accomplished. Again, great job!

Bill Gibbs
 
Thid match was being streamed during an Event this weekend in Texas in its entirety. Only time I've ever been around that many pool people that the juke box wasnt even on just so everyone could hear through the TV what Earl would say next. He didn't disappoint in that regard. I will also say, the older pool players that were there absolutely love Earl. He has a big following.

When Earl was going on tilt, it was sad to see some of the reactions of those people cause this is there pool hero. Everyone gets beat, don't matter who you are. I just feel like Earl's behavior let some of those guys down and those are the people that root for him, the ppl that will let him get a pull off their joint, or toss him a $100 when he's in their nearest town.

I personally like SVB, he might be hitting the bench press a little too hard, but that guy is a gentleman from what I saw. I did think he was about to clock Earl in the post match interviews but he didnt.

Oh and I think the race to 75 was a hair short, SVB was ahead at the end, but it's like winning on a split decision. I'm not sure that match really proved anything to those folks.

My only question....is this the last SVB Vs. Earl match? Those Diamond 10 ft tables are almost done or already complete, would only seem fair those two get it on one last time.
 
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